Sign Governors' petition to President Bush to lower gas prices!

by FlyingHighNow 99 Replies latest social current

  • SWALKER
    SWALKER

    we should be signing petitions to follow Brazil or Sweden's lead.

    Totally agree that if they can do it so can we!!! There really is no excuse for this country NOT to have alternative sources readily available...

    Wonder what it's going to take to light a fire under corporations to start seeing that profits can be made in alternative fuel/power sources?

    I just saw a documentary on HBO that showed how solar power could be harnessed and would be able to provide power to the entire U.S. and several corporations are working on this now. That's sounds like progress in the right direction!

    Swalker

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    Welcome Adgod = I would like to see square mile after square mile of wind turbines in North and South Dakota

  • upside/down
    upside/down
    what did Mr. Raymond do to deserve a 400 million dollar retirement package??

    Ran the biggest company in America...that's all. Who are YOU to judge that?

    "saints"

    I never called 'em "saints"...you did.

    Yes, companies, even oil companies deserve to make mucho profit but not at the expense of the American consumer

    Then who?....That is ASININE!!! You make it sound like they just steal the money with out giving anything in return..."at their expense"...

    As far as not building new refineries...that my friend is the work of the LIBS!!! Environmental nutjobs to thank for that...I lived in California most of my life... I saw it first hand.... Bitch that we don't have enough of ANY resource...then make it virtually impossible to harvest that "natural" resource...be it oil, lumber, minerals etc...

    Funny... I don't see the oil company's bitching to explore and drill for more DOMESTIC oil...they're chomping at the bit... and are currently banned from doing so...that'd eat up some of that FAT profit that your so jealous of...

    Is this Rush?

    Wow... you listen to Rush....? I'd think you'd know a little more about him then... Nobody listens to Rush...just like nobody voted for "W"...twice!!! lol!!!

    tell me where the money came from.

    Gross profit... Oh hell let's just blame it all on "W".. Halliburton and ...while we're at let's blame the French too....those bastards!

    You know... as much as you try to fit me into a box opposite of your views...it just don't work....does it? You can't stand that I agreed with you on the valid points you made...and vehemently disagreed on some others... so you must lob me into the camp you like to fight with...

    Just like a Dub...no yielding whatsoever...

    For the record... I cannot and WILL NOT solve the worlds problems till I take it over by force....and appoint myself Most Exalted Emperor of the Planet...and soon to be the Universe!!! Mwaaahahahaaa!

    u/d(of the not afraid to go it alone class)

  • roybatty
    roybatty
    Ran the biggest company in America...that's all. Who are YOU to judge that?

    What did he do? What exactly did he do that resulted in the biggest profit of all time? Must have done something amazing.

    I never called 'em "saints"...you did.

    It's called sarcasim. Catch it.

    Yes, companies, even oil companies deserve to make mucho profit but not at the expense of the American consumer

    Then who?....That is ASININE!!! You make it sound like they just steal the money with out giving anything in return..."at their expense"...

    I'll make this really easy for you. Let's say a natural disaster hits your area. No food. No water. Hopwever, a local merchant has both and he decides to charge $100.00 for a bottle of water and $200.00 for a loaf of bread. Do you see any problem with that senerio? It's no differnt with the gas prices.

    As far as not building new refineries...that my friend is the work of the LIBS!!! Environmental nutjobs to thank for that...I lived in California most of my life... I saw it first hand.... Bitch that we don't have enough of ANY resource...then make it virtually impossible to harvest that "natural" resource...be it oil, lumber, minerals etc...

    Ummm....no. That's not the case. Do you little research dude. You can find INTERNAL MEMOS from the big oil companies showing that they themselves shut down gas refineries to increase their margins. Buty I guess its just easier to blame the enviroment nut jobs. Blah blah blah...always the Libs fault. Funny thing is the Mr. Lib (aka John Kerry) pushed for a 1 mile increase in the MPG law back in 2002. Bush shot it down just like Clinton did in the 90's. Sad thing is, if they would have continued to raise the bar on minimum MPG like we did in the 80's, we'd be using 1/3 less gas today.

    Why build new refineries when you can shut down half of them and create a shortage?? Brillant!!!

    Is this Rush?

    Wow... you listen to Rush....? I'd think you'd know a little more about him then... Nobody listens to Rush...just like nobody voted for "W"...twice!!! lol!!!

    Voted for Bush....twice!

    You know... as much as you try to fit me into a box opposite of your views...it just don't work....does it? You can't stand that I agreed with you on the valid points you made...and vehemently disagreed on some others... so you must lob me into the camp you like to fight with...

    What camp is that? Seems like you get anouyed by the facts, but, thats ok. If you don't have a problem with a company controlling a vital resources and manipulating the market, well, what can I say.

    Funny thing is, there is NO SHORTAGE OF OIL yet both oil and gas are at an all time high. Don't you at least want to take a minute and think about "why"? If you turned on CNN today and saw a story that a hurricane hit Florida and 75% of the oranges were suddenly destroyed, would you expect the OJ sitting on the shelf at your local store to suddenly skyrocket in price? Of course not. By why does ths happen with gas that was refined months ago and is now sitting at your local gas station?

    What the oil companies are doing is NOT capitialism. When huge companies like Mobil and Exxon merge and control the market it's more like socialism.

  • upside/down
    upside/down


    What did he do? What exactly did he do that resulted in the biggest profit of all time? Must have done something amazing.


    Not necessarily...What did Don Shula do to have the perfect season in 1970? He was in the right place at the right time... with the right franchise... totally irrelelevant. No matter who was in charge of Exxon...it would have made record profit...that's the big league. What did FDR do to get credit for winning WWII... this can go on and on... I sense more envy/jealousy...than real concern for what's "right"... I admit...I'm a little jealous too... Maybe if I hadn't joined a cult and taken that full ride scholarship I earned instead of "pioneeerin" I'd be "somebody" with obscene loads of cash too... but I made some poor choices...oh well. ****As far as the Big Guys being crooks...yes I'm sure many are... just like I saw in the dirt broke congo's of Witnoids.....all CROOKS...just at different socio/economic levels...and power mongers too****

    It's no differnt with the gas prices.



    Oh yes it is... what you described is "gouging"... that is ILLEGAL and borderline immoral...although a true "capitalist" would say that supply and demand determine the value of anything...

    How many times must it be repeated here....HIGH PRICES are the best thing to ween us off oil... you want some painless fix?

    to increase their margins

    First of all... that is HIGHLY debateable... but again...SO WHAT!....Since when can't ANY business lower it's costs to increase it's bottom line? Heaven forbid they become even MORE profitable... it's all perspective...The little guy of course hates to be laid off... and the big guy is proud that he made billions and pleased his stock holders...

    Voted for Bush....twice!

    Wow...good for you ... you voted!

    As far as increasing the MPG... no agrument from me there... I see it happening on the commercials of the automakers daily. Except it would perpetuate continued dependency on oil (and Exxon would still make profits for even longer)... which I thought was the problem to begin with...

    Seems like you get anouyed by the facts

    Not if their legitimate...and un"spun"... NO WAY!

    there is NO SHORTAGE OF OIL

    Agreed.

    If you turned on CNN today and saw a story that a hurricane hit Florida and 75% of the oranges were suddenly destroyed, would you expect the OJ sitting on the shelf at your local store to suddenly skyrocket in price? Of course not. By why does ths happen with gas that was refined months ago and is now sitting at your local gas station?

    You were making good progress till here... this is where your understanding of economics is flawed. THAT is EXACTLY how supply and demand work... The price we pay for ANYTHING isn't determined at the time that "anything" is made... For example a truck load of turnips that is picked by illegal immigrants for DIRT CHEAP can be enroute to market at let's say, the then fair "market value" of .25 cents each....but that night the laws change and "illegal" immigrants are all deported and the market parameters have changed...all future turnips will cost at least .75 cents each...GUESS WHAT? That truck load of turnips magically becomes worth more ENROUTE....those are market forces at work... It works in reverse too... That is "business". You take the good with the bad...

    Do I think oil companies...are filthy rich...YES. So is my uncle Sal who does nothing but sit on his ass and watch is stocks earn earn EARN.

    I just wonder...what will happen when all the obscenely profitable companies like Microsoft, Exxon, General Mills, GE, ahemmm ...Halliburton**cough**... all go under (if that were possible)? Will anyone feel sorry for all the 100's of thousands of employees that lose their jobs... What will we ever do?

    Of course not... the "government" will save us all....LOL!!!

    I've said this before...Why would I trade one cult mindset...for a new one. People will survive no matter what happens (short of Iran and No.Korea nuking the planet eventually)... and there will always be entrepeneurs that will PROFIT...no matter what.

    That is....till I become King!

    u/d

  • funkyderek
    funkyderek

    FHN:

    What a brilliant idea. You're thinking too small though. Instead of petitioning the president to lower oil prices, you should petition him to print more money and divide it out among the American people. That way everyone would have enough money to pay for gas! If you have any money left over, maybe you could use it to buy yourself a clue about economics.

  • sammielee24
    sammielee24

    One suggestion by one gov't rep has been for Bush to heavily tax excessive profits. His prediction is that you would see gas prices fall substantially overnight. Now the question remains - what would the cut off be in order to determin excessive profit? What kind of percentage would be reasonable?

  • sammielee24
    sammielee24

    CEO Pay Soared in 2004 as U.S. Economy Stumbled

    By MARC MCDONALD

    CEO pay continues to soar into the stratosphere, while wages for the average American worker stagnate.
    Forbes magazine reports that the CEOs of America's 500 biggest companies received an aggregate 54 percent pay raise last year. As a group, their total compensation totaled $5.1 billion (compared with $3.3 billion in fiscal 2003).

    Conservatives, no doubt, would argue that under America's free market system, these chief executives "earned" their pay. But did they?
    Forbes, a publication not exactly considered to be in the progressive camp, seems to think otherwise.
    The magazine says some CEOs "did so bad they should have paid their shareholders."

    Take Peter Cartwright of Calpine, a maker of gas-fired power plants. Forbes reports that Calpine's average annual return to shareholders over the past six years has been minus 7 percent. During the same period, Cartwright pocketed an average annual $13 million.

    America's CEOs are by far the highest paid CEOs of any nation on earth. Which begs a question: why?
    The U.S. economy isn't exactly stellar at the moment. In fact, an increasing number of commentators warn that America's economy is facing a major crisis.

    Our exploding fiscal and trade deficits are the highest that any developed nation has ever seen. America's once-vaunted manufacturing base has been hollowed out. And the dollar continues to crumble in value.

    Exploding CEO pay is a relatively recent phenomenon in U.S. history. For example, in the 1960s, the average CEO earned around 40 times what the rank-and-file workers earned. Today the average CEO makes over 500 times what the average worker earns. And the gap continues to widen, year by year.

    Like a magician pulling a rabbit out of a hat, conservatives are constantly coming up with reasons to justify soaring CEO pay. Here are three of my favorites:

    CEOs create jobs. They create shareholder value. They have supposedly made the U.S. economy the strongest and most competitive in the world.

    First of all, let's take a look at jobs. The past few years haven't exactly been a boon to job seekers in the U.S. Fewer and fewer jobs are being created these days. And the jobs that do exist are paying less and offer increasingly meager benefits. And American employees work the longest hours in the industrialized world, as author Juliet Schor pointed out in her book, The Overworked American.

    Now, consider the issue of "shareholder value." The past few years haven't exactly been stellar for the stock market. But even the CEOs who preside over companies with sinking share value continue to pocket huge compensation packages.

    Last, but not least: let's take a look at America's "competitiveness" these days.

    A recurring mantra with America's mainstream and business press is that the U.S. is the most "competitive" economy in the world. A casual look at America's current trade figures, though, explodes this myth.

    The fact is, America has the largest trade deficits of any First World nation in history. It seems to me that the U.S. has a difficult time these days creating products that other nations want to buy. Meanwhile, Americans line up to buy products from countries like Germany (which exceeds even China as the world's largest exporter) and Japan---despite the fact that average wages in those two countries are now higher than U.S. wage levels.

    If U.S. corporations are really that "competitive" these days, it seems strange to me that America's CEOs seem to have a tough time making ends meet without corporate welfare.

    Take Wal-Mart for example. The world's largest corporation (with over $286 billion in annual sales) cost American taxpayers over $1.5 billion in 2004, according to Walmartwatch.com.

    If you want to get an idea of how out-of-control soaring CEO pay has gotten, it's important to look at the CEO pay of America's automakers. To me, Detroit sums up many of the major problems that America's economy as a whole faces these days.

    Detroit's CEOs have long pocketed by far the highest compensation levels of any auto executives in the world.

    This shouldn't really be surprising: American CEOs in general have long raked in vastly higher pay packages than their overseas counterparts. U.S. CEOs make, on average, 22 times what their counterparts make in Japan and 17 times what their counterparts earn in Europe.

    If pay is somehow tied to performance, then you'd think that America's automakers are the world's most competitive, correct?

    If so, you'd be wrong. Detroit, in fact, has been steadily losing market share to foreign automakers for the past five decades. And the blame for this can be laid squarely on the shoulders of Detroit's CEOs, who've made one stupid decision after another for decades. One recent example: Detroit's decision to stake everything on gas-guzzling SUVs, while the Japanese were busy perfecting hybrid technology. (Hybrids are currently by far the auto industry's hottest segment).

    Detroit CEOs have long complained that "it's not their fault" and have offered up one excuse after another as to why America's car companies are losing market share. My favorite excuse of theirs is that foreign automakers' workers earn less than their America counterparts (an excuse that the U.S. mainstream and business media has never bothered to challenge).

    A quick look at the numbers explodes this lie. The fact is, automaker employees in both Japan and Germany earn higher salaries than U.S. automaker workers do these days. Japan's wages run 30 to 40 percent higher than Detroit's wages. And German automakers workers earn around $49/hour on average versus $39/hour for Detroit's workers.

    Although U.S. automaker workers earn less than their foreign counterparts, Detroit CEOs make vastly higher pay packages than their counterparts do in Germany or Japan.

    This vast gulf was vividly demonstrated in 1998 when German automaker Daimler-Benz took over U.S. automaker Chrysler. As it turned out, the CEO of Daimler-Benz, Jurgen Schrempp, was earning a pay package that was less than one-tenth of the pay package of Chrysler CEO Robert Eaton.

    One might think, given the gigantic pay packages of America's CEOs these days, that being a chief executive is a demanding job. It seems to me that the opposite is true. CEOs seem to do little more these days than bitch and moan and offer up excuses for their companies' declining fortunes. There are always plenty of handy scapegoats around. Unions. Democrats. "Excessive" red tape and regulations. Lower wages overseas. Ad nauseam.

    It seems to me that, far from having a difficult job, America's CEOs actually have one of the easiest jobs in the world these days. When things aren't going well, simply blame others for your mistakes (shades of the Bush White House here). And, if that doesn't work, simply ask for another round of corporate welfare from the government.


    # posted by Marc McDonald @ 5:36
  • upside/down
    upside/down

    I highly recommed you start with Energy Basics 101...in the lower right hand portion of the web page....for starters...http://www.eia.doe.gov/

    Have at it...knock yourself out!

    u/d

  • FlyingHighNow
    FlyingHighNow

    Looks like maybe my dad knows what he's talking about afterall. Now, I'll go back and look at the new additions to the thread.

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