2Co 2:14 - 16 "Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place. For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved, and in them that perish: To the one we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?"
How can one id a real Christian?
by BlackSwan of Memphis 64 Replies latest jw friends
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SeymourButts
The bible also makes it quite clear that a "true" follower would have to be as poor as dirt. "...none of you can be my disciple unless he gives up everything he has" (Luke 14:33); "If you want to be perfect, go and sell all you have and give the money to the poor and you will have riches in heaven" (Matt. 19:21); "Sell your possessions and give alms" (Luke 12:33); "But give what is in your cups and plates to the poor, and everything will be clean for you" (Luke 11:41); "Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt,.... But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven.... for where your treasure is, there will your heart be also" (Matt. 6:19-21); "How hardly shall they that have riches enter to the kingdom of God" (Mark 10:23); "Truly, I say to you, it will be hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God" (Matt. 19:23-24); A certain ruler told Jesus that he had obeyed all the commandments from his youth up. But, Jesus said, "Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me" (Luke 18:22, Mark 10:21), Paul said, "For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things and count them as refuse, in order that I may gain Christ" (Phil. 3:8 RSV) But, of course, Christians have a tendency to overlook this and try to rationalize it away. But, but, but,...and then comes the lame excuse as to why they feel they can overlook these scriptures. These statements are very clear. It is not enough to just avoid wealth, but one is to actively seek to rid themselves of whatever possessions they may gain. A true follower of Jesus can not divorce someone, .... "So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man put asunder"(Matt. 19:6, Mark 10:9)
Neither can they marry someone who is divorced, "whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery" (Matt. 5:32, 19:9, Luke 16:18).
When we investigate, we are able to find one exception to the former. If the spouse commits adultery, divorce is permissible: "Whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery" (Matt. 5:32).
The bible also says that anyone who obtains a divorce and marries another is an adulterer: "...whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her" (Mark 10:11, Luke 16:18), which applies to women as well--Mark 10:12.
According to Christ's teachings: one can never obtain a divorce, except from an adulterous spouse; one can never marry a divorced person, and one who obtains a divorce and marries another is committing adultery. How many so-called Christians will try and wiggle out of that one? It seems that for the most part, Christians only follow what does not personally cost them, only what is convenient.
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AuldSoul
Seymour,
I think you want very much to believe you are right about that "requirement" of Christianity, but I don't think you really believe you are.
Paul worked as a tentmaker to earn money, he wasn't like Circuit Overseers of today who leech off the congregations they visit or like the Pastors of Churches today who suck their congregations dry while living in finery. But material things were not of chief importance in his life and while he was content with sustenance and covering he also "knew how to have much."
Respectfully,
AuldSoul -
SeymourButts
Sorry, but those are not my words,...they are from they bible and are very clear. But then again as I said....rationalizing away what costs us personally is the norm. We could also go even further and bring up many many other subjects and teachings which are so conveniently ignored. What gives one the right to pick and choose....to apply as he sees fit? It is not some sort of scriptural smorgasboard where one fills their plate with only what is appealing and palatable.
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anewme
After reading the Bible, simply decide for yourself what is a true Christian Black Swan.
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jgnat
Besides, I heard that Jesus' garment was all-of-one-piece, a rather expensive item for the time.
That "giving up all" business I figure, starts with the heart. Often lifetime givers also happen to be very good at gathering wealth. They are just very good at turnover. http://www.worldphilanthropists.org/
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bebu
Seymore,
If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.
Love again is the identifier, even above the outward appearance of giving up possessions. Of course, one of the ways love is worked out is by sharing, or sacrificing one's possessions for others' welfare, so they usually go hand-in-hand.
But logically, how helpful will it be for society if all Christians sold their homes and lived as beggars? The welfare rolls would cost everyone else a lot, and no one would appreciate that.
But I do feel it is right (in general) for Christians to live as simply as they can so that they can be even better givers.
bebu
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Gretchen956
Ok, maybe this isn't my place, but why do you need to ID another person as Christian or not? Surely its each person's personal business. Why do you need this information? I'm not trying to be argumentative, I really wonder. Does it pre-suppose that only christians are loving or live by morals? Because if you are using those types of character identifiers to determine christianity, you might think I was christian and I am not.
Sherry
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jgnat
I have a bit of a problem with the term "real" Christian, probably because the JW's pepper their literature with "true Christians" thereby cutting off the rest of the world. By qualifying who is "real" or "true", we are suggesting there is such a thing as an UNREAL or PLASTIC Christian. Which there very might well be.
But I don't want to be the one to judge.