Did Jesus Exist? What historical proof is there?

Awakened at Gilead

After rejecting the WTS, I have also rejected belief in Jesus because I do no see any proof that he even existed. Shouldn't we put the belief in Jesus through the same historical wringer that we put the WTS through?

Why do YOU believe in Jesus?

Rules of this debate:

Please cite historical sources. Do not cite the Bible, as that would be like saying "I believe in the FDS because the WatchTower tells me to" = "I believe in Jesus because the Bible says so"

My take? I have not found any sources outside the Bible that conclusively prove that Jesus existed.

slimboyfat

Man if this does not tempt Narkissos nothing will.

Awakened at Gilead

Well, maybe Leolaia will show up too... and

Perhaps a Christian or two will be brave enough to answer also!

Mickey mouse

I don't have an answer for you A@G but did anyone else hear JW's say anything along the lines of the following: "There's more historical evidence supporting Jesus existence than Alexander the Great"?

still_in74

Josephus is often referred to but there are those that believe Jesus was added to his writings later to add wieght to the new roman religion.

I dont have citations but I recently watched a show that discussed this. Although they obviously couldnt prove the bible true they did state that there is no doubt Jesus existed, but only in how much truth is know about him.

Awakened at Gilead

Citations...please!

I'm tired of Christians on this forum lambasting me and others since we reject the existence of Jesus. All I am asking is for some proof that he existed, and I will stop saying that he didn't!

Fair enough? If your faith is so strong that he existed, please show the proof! Its the same requirement that we exact from the WTS.

HappyDad

You must have to much free time if all you can do is rant about what you don't believe in these days. This is not a slam at you and I'm not saying that you are not an intelligent person, but you are arguing a moot point.

Yes, there are many on this forum who are of like minded belief/non-belief and will talk about it all day long.

Are you sure of what you believe in at all? Are you searching for truth, or for answers that tickle your mind? We all like to have our mind tickled but there comes a time to face our own reality and stop promoting our own program.

From your past posts, you have shown that you are able to search and find answers to many subjects. Why not this one? Is it that you like to instill controversy?

Just do a little looking and you can find some answers to just about anything on the internet.....such as the following individuals who have written about a possible man named Jesus. Maybe it doesn't completely answer all you want to know, but why continue to push the issue you are pushing?

Cornelius Tacitus
Lucian of Samosata
Suetonius
Pliny the Younger
Thallus and Phlegon
Josephus

There is no need to direct a response to me since I will not engage in what I feel is a fruitless question on your part.

I wish you well.

HappyDad

Mickey mouse

I have no strong feelings either way whether he existed. No citations here, just an anecdotal example of the way JW's quote supposed evidence without ever having a firm reference to back it up.

Awakened at Gilead

Its not a fruitless question Happy Dad. I think the decision to believe in Jesus or not is a serious one... I used to believe in him, but I am placing Christ, Muhammed, Joseph Smith, Moses, et al, through the same scrutiny that I placed the WTS under.

Are you sure of what you believe in at all? Are you searching for truth, or for answers that tickle your mind? We all like to have our mind tickled but there comes a time to face our own reality and stop promoting our own program.

I am not promoting my program, I don't have a program. You are one of the persons that have lambasted my disbelief in Christ. I don't want my mind tickled, I had enough of that through the WTS mind control program.

From your past posts, you have shown that you are able to search and find answers to many subjects. Why not this one? Is it that you like to instill controversy?

My reseasrch thus far indicates that Jesus does not exist, nor did he. Nut I am humble and willing to admit that I might be wrong. This is the debate section, so controversy is part of debate, isn't it?

Cornelius Tacitus
Lucian of Samosata
Suetonius
Pliny the Younger
Thallus and Phlegon
Josephus

Do you have links? I am asking a serious question, and I will look them up.

OnTheWayOut

I don't want to cite references like Josephus and say that there is independent
proof of Jesus' existence. But it does seem that there was someone back in the time
period who had some things to say. Why couldn't Jesus have existed?

Now, I didn't say he was what the Gospels say he was.

I think the man existed. I think he was expected to be a puppet of the revolution
against Rome and Herod. I think a ride on an ass was staged for him to make
claim of his kingdom. I think, though that he saw how the rebels were using him
and knew how it would end, so he turned on them when he said to pay back
Ceasar's things to Ceasar. That's not what the revolutionaries wanted. He
wanted to have it all and lost it all, but there were plenty of others before and
after him, just like that.

I believe the 1st Century Christians were alot like him, spouting wisdom from
philosophy and religious faithfulness, but not making any wild claims of Godship.
As time passed, the legend grew larger and Constantine made him a God, much
later.

Or it could all be a fairytale. Like the Exodus or the Flood.

Did Jesus Exist? What historical proof is there?

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