If a surgeon operates to remove a live fetus from its mother, his intention is to kill it, however much he finds it regrettable.
Please stop with the copy-paste and engage in a conversation.
abortion vs holocaust
by unstopableravens 692 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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jgnat
So in the case of an ectopic pregnancy, sometimes it will spontaneously resolve. I am 100% sure you don't know what that means. It means the mother aborts naturally. In the meantime the woman is in excruciating pain. To fully appreciate this, leave an abscessed tooth until it spontaneously resolves.
Hubby has a question for you. Will the ravens repeat this year? I do not know what this means.
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unstopableravens
cofty: sorry its not often i get to copy and paste, i think at this point we are playing with words, i, like the article says intent. take it and run or take it at face value.
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Finkelstein
The reason why there is a gestation period scale to when an abortion can proceed is established upon the fact
that a developing fetus is not capable of living outside the womb.
All this claptrap about the sacredness of life is full of bullshit, human life means nothing to god if one really reads the bible.
Self righteous zealots are just trying to push their own self inspired sacredness onto the general public to create a semblance
of power and control toward themselves.
But thats the reason why PRO-CHOICE is here because some people are religious minded, these ones can make the
decision on their own upon their own beliefs, but they do not have the right to impose their beliefs onto other
members of the public.
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unstopableravens
jgnat:yes naturally, but not willfully. tell your hubsand hopefully, thou i does not look promising if they dont get there offensive line together
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unstopableravens
fink: but abortion forces a choice on the baby
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cantleave
That article's view on rape and incest victims is truly disturbing. How can any medical practitoner spout such nonsense?
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GromitSK
Isn't this about when a person comes into existence? I don't think anyone would condone the taking of a person's life without good cause, however there are a number of situations where this is already permitted. The rules also vary somewhat from place to place.
It appears to me that the anti-abortion lobby view fertilisation as the point at which a person is formed whilst others view that point as being reached at different points in the process of gestation. I am not sure there is a single common accepted point at which an embryo becomes a person in its own right. If it was that obvious, it would have been defined a by now I would have thought.
I can understand why a person opposing any form of abortion would try to convince others of their point of view but the fact is that not everyone sees it that way and shouting the point won't change their opinions. I dread a society where such stridency overrides the rights of others to determine their own lives.
True, abortion takes away the right of a foetus to live (If it has such a right). If it is not a person then what rights exactly does it have?
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Finkelstein
fink: but abortion forces a choice on the baby
A growing fetus is not a baby !
Typical assertion by pro-lifers, using emotive metaphors to win the debate.
Try and be a bit more intellectually honest if you can unstop.
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unstopableravens
LifeNews.com
Scientist: Human Life Begins at Conception, Fertilization
by Gerard Nadal, Ph.D. | Washington, DC | LifeNews.com | 11/18/11 11:18 AM
Bioethics- 6893
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When one considers the ethics of manipulation, the question of whether we ought to, or whether we may manipulate an organism or entity depends on the answer to the first and most fundamental question:
What is it?Ascertaining the identity and status of the object of our intended manipulation is essential.
In the fields of obstetrical medicine and reproductive medicine the ethical debates have raged for four decades. Enlightened discourse between opposing parties must assume good motives by all involved, and then go about asking the essential questions, following where the truth of science and reason lead.
Many claim that life begins at some point distant from fertilization, always beyond the point at which they propose some manipulation (abortion, embryonic stem cell culturing, etc…). There are always a list of biological functions that are given to define when human life begins: Cognitive capacity, etc.
The simple biological truth of the matter is that the Cell Theory states that all cells arise from pre-existing cells. There is no blackout period between sperm and egg uniting, and then the emergence of ‘life’ at some point distant.
The Carnegie stages of human development indicate that human development begins in the zygotic stage. Then there is the assertion of developmental biologist and leading textbook author in the field, Scott Gilbert. In his text, Gilbert takes us through the life cycle of a dog. His text, Developmental Biology, is arguably the leading text in the field. According to Gilbert:
“Traditional ways of classifying catalog animals according to their adult structure. But, as J. T. Bonner (1965) pointed out, this is a very artificial method, because what we consider an individual is usually just a brief slice of its life cycle. When we consider a dog, for instance, we usually picture an adult. But the dog is a “dog” from the moment of fertilization of a dog egg by a dog sperm. It remains a dog even as a senescent dying hound. Therefore, the dog is actually the entire life cycle of the animal, from fertilization through death.”First, note how he sets the word dog off in quotes at one point, to communicate the very essence of the organism:
But the dog is a “dog” from the fertilization of a dog egg by a dog sperm…
The same may be said of all vertebrates, including cats, giraffes, chimpanzees, and humans. Substituting the word human for dog in Gilbert’s analysis gets to the heart of the matter. We are human for our entire life cycle. We are whole and complete in form and function at every stage of our development, for that given developmental stage. The prepubescent child is fully human, even though they lack the capacity to execute all human functions, such as abstract reasoning, or reproduction.
In the same way, the early embryo is alive and fully human, though it has not yet executed all human organismal functions.
Photo via: embryology.med.unsw.edu.au
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