IS GOD REAL? HOW DO YOU KNOW? (page 29)

still thinking

WOW!! snare&racket....what a well thought out post...it wasn't too long at all...I was riveted.

So yes, I had to be honest with myself, I can see the evidence for life forming with no god, really it exists, it isnt about not wanting to believe in living forever in heaven and no death, who doesnt want that?

Exactly! Who doesn't want that? I know I would love that to be the case. But like you, I can now allow for the possibility even probability that I have been mislead and wrong all this time. Theres so much information out there and I have only scratched the surface. I can honestly say that my reading/learning has been unbalanced. Definiately leaning towards proving the existence of a god...ie creation...but no longer. I want ALL the facts so I can make an informed decision on what I think/believe. And this still includes trying to understand peoples beliefs, but not predominantly as before.

Thank you for the links... I will definately be looking at those.

LV101

snare&racket --- WOW, thanks so much for the crash course on evolution --- I'm serious! I love reading this and you are right about individuals being ignorant and uneducated. As soon as I finish up a couple of time-consuming situations in the next yr. I'm going to hit the books. I know Terry and many others have recommended many to start with. I certainly need to find those posts and order away.

still thinking

Thanks wizz....just had a quick read of your PM...will have more time later to read it properly. Thank you.

Wizard of Oz

@ snare&racket Great post alright......

Though aren't we understanding seeing and living in the effect

I want to see the cause explained........maybe we'll get to know ourselves, maybe we wont

snare&racket

You are welcome, it took some time to write and in all honesty the time was not spare, it was supposed t be for revision, so I am overjoyed you even read it.

Wizard of Oz, you are asking the same question as everyone else, go back to school, study physics and devote your life to the answer! We know one thing for sure, to say a god caused it is lazy and easy. Especially when we have already proven that his hand has not played a part in the very imperfect universe. Of course the religious are also then left to explain the 'cause' of their chosen god....

As I said in my opening few sentences WoOz, there is explanations and theories out there for the formation of the universe. String theory has opened up the door to many possibilities. Take a look at BRANE THEORY (as in membrane) and its explanation, it is the last one I read with interest. Also, I wasn't being flippant about devoting your life to the answer, I think it's a exciting and noble thing to do.

Snare x

If you look back I started a thread on what books to read if interested in evolution. I hope it proves useful. 'The Greatest Show on Earth' by Professor R Dawkins will never be a bad place to start..... All the best x

still thinking

snare&racket...

We know one thing for sure, to say a god caused it is lazy and easy. Especially when we have already proven that his hand has not played a part in the very imperfect universe

I'm not so sure we can say it is lazy or easy to say that god caused it...I wouldn't consider myself either lazy or looking for the easy way out. It was what I understood it to be based on my limited knowlegde for sure....but not from lack of wanting to know...more from being mislead and brainwashed.

And....I'm not sure science disproves a God either...it simply exlpains how things probably occured...it does not prove god didn't have a hand in it. If it was that simple we wouldn't be having this discussion at all.

Thanks snare....I will check out your thread, I am interested. Can you show me the difintive proof where science disproves the existence of a God?

LV101

Thanks for book title, again. Think you also posted he has a new book out for children but a good basic for anyone.

Question --- I'm assuming learned individuals of physics, the sciences, evolution, etc., do not believe in a god --- for the most part. I'm assuming it's all fantasy and myth? Someone posted Dawkins is certain about evolution 7/8 on a scale of 10 (don't recall exact nos.) because I was shocked it wasn't a 10! I guess as a scientist he leaves room for more proof of everything.

Wizard of Oz

@ snare&racket...... I wasn't being flippant in my remarks either, I acknowledged what a great post it is and know the truth contained in it.

However explanations & theories are still just that. Show us where you have proven god dosn't exist and was not the cause of the Big Bang.

Wizard of Oz

Quantum physics also dictates multiple parallel dimensions exist, but I guess you already know that and yes I was being flippant.

snare&racket

We cant prove unicorns dont exist, but does anyone here believe in them? Do you advocate them on this argument alone ? To be consistant you should! Also note you are calling me wrong for not upholding this principle, of course you are correct.... but really !!!

Ok this is where my biblical knowledge makes me believe I can take one step further than the likes of Dawkins. Dawkins is a TRUE scientist who lives and dies on the evidence. He will never say god does not exist as it is impossible to deny the existance of anything (unicorns, fairies etc) however probability and evidence points us in a direction. Don't misunderstand this as a 50/50 heads or tails issue, he does exist, he does not exist... far from it. The evidence says he is not here but we cant end the debate with an absoloute. Science needs evidence! How can you prove the non existance of anything? (brain slowly implodes).....

HOWEVER as an ex christian I am well aware through research the ORIGINS of the very idea of the Christian God !

For me personally the universe, its imperfections, the evolution of man and its evidence along with the history of the biblical accounts and beliefs, tells me personally that the god as described in the bible definetly does not exist. The universe is not a precise, perfectly timed masterpiece. The human is not a perfect piece of art and life is not like a watch found on the ground, needing a designer. All the arguments made FOR a christian god, I personally feel are answered with evidenceand simple reasoning (such as a loving god and genocide do not mix). BUT i totally understand people that still feel it is POSSIBLE for a god to exist as described in the bible, as it is also possible there are unicorns and fairies and the like.

Snare&Racket x

The childs book is called "The Magic of Reality" and is very good.

IS GOD REAL? HOW DO YOU KNOW?

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