Posts by jonahstourguide

11

Incomplete quote,, does it make any difference?

by jonahstourguide in

in the dec 15 2013 study article page 19 paragraph 10 a professor jonathan klawans is quoted.. i found the original quote here:.

exodus 12 commands the israelites to repeat this practice every year, performing the sacrifice during the day and then consuming it after the sun has set.

(according to jewish tradition, the new day begins with the setting of the sun, so the sacrifice is made on the 14th but the beginning of passover and the meal are actually on the 15th, although this sequence of dates is not specified in exodus.

jonahstourguide

Yes you're correct Earnest, I'm mixing up the arguments. A George Howard quote was used to support the use

of gods name in the NT. There was a post some time ago regarding that.

jtg

11

Incomplete quote,, does it make any difference?

by jonahstourguide in

in the dec 15 2013 study article page 19 paragraph 10 a professor jonathan klawans is quoted.. i found the original quote here:.

exodus 12 commands the israelites to repeat this practice every year, performing the sacrifice during the day and then consuming it after the sun has set.

(according to jewish tradition, the new day begins with the setting of the sun, so the sacrifice is made on the 14th but the beginning of passover and the meal are actually on the 15th, although this sequence of dates is not specified in exodus.

jonahstourguide

Thanks for your comments folks. Its what you would expect, quote the authority in context and let the

authority speak rather than structuring a quote to suit a different position. I actually had a disagreement with a local elder

regarding the john 1;1 quote. I think the scholars name was George Howard. An attempt was then made to "caution" me!!!

I guess thats why we're told we don't need to research coz da gb duz it for us.

Not a good practise as I see it.

jtg

11

Incomplete quote,, does it make any difference?

by jonahstourguide in

in the dec 15 2013 study article page 19 paragraph 10 a professor jonathan klawans is quoted.. i found the original quote here:.

exodus 12 commands the israelites to repeat this practice every year, performing the sacrifice during the day and then consuming it after the sun has set.

(according to jewish tradition, the new day begins with the setting of the sun, so the sacrifice is made on the 14th but the beginning of passover and the meal are actually on the 15th, although this sequence of dates is not specified in exodus.

jonahstourguide

In the Dec 15 2013 study article page 19 paragraph 10 a Professor Jonathan Klawans is quoted.

I found the original quote here:

Exodus 12 commands the Israelites to repeat this practice every year, performing the sacrifice during the day and then consuming it after the sun has set. (According to Jewish tradition, the new day begins with the setting of the sun, so the sacrifice is made on the 14th but the beginning of Passover and the meal are actually on the 15th, although this sequence of dates is not specified in Exodus.) Exodus 12 further speaks of a seven-day festival, which begins when the sacrifice is consumed (Exodus 12:15).

and the second statement here :

Passover Seder brings us back to the time immediately following the Roman destruction of the Temple in 70 C.E.12 It’s not that rabbinic literature cannot be trusted to tell us about history in the first century of the Common Era. It’s that rabbinic literature—in the case of the Seder—does not even claim to be telling us how the Seder was performed before the destruction of the Temple. 12

As I understand the full article of jonathan Klawans, he doesnt believe that the "lords supper" was in fact a "seder"

What caught my eye was the omission of his reference that "according to jewish tradition",,,,, it triggered my brain to a quote in the wt of october 15 2013

page 28 paragraph 9 where the wt speaks of Jewish tradition in a derogative way in reference to not using gods name " We can be sure that Jesus firmly

rejected such an unscriptural tradition"

So, as I read it, and I may well be wrong, it's ok to quote tradition if it supports the argument, but just not say that we are.

I cant post the link to the site from where I copied the quote. its :biblicalarcheology.org and the subject was "was jesus last supper a seder"

jtg

Edited underlined the actual quote from where the wt sourced their quote

And I do understand that the seder is a part of passover that is performed on the first and or second day of passover.

My point is, I am finding it increasingly difficult to believe any "quote" inserted in the wt. Another case in point was the Albert Barnes quote last week.

jtg

38

Curious change in December 15 Study Article

by Bobcat in

i ran across a change between the printed edition of the december 15, 2013 wt study edition and the magazine as a pdf download from the jw.org website.. whether the change amounts to much, i'm not sure.

but it is curious.

the change is in paragraph 16 on page 15:.

jonahstourguide

The Australian printed version reads the same as the pdf.

jtg

52

Billy's Comments You Won't Hear at the 01-26-2014 WT Study (Obey Jehovah's Shepherds))

by Billy the Ex-Bethelite in

fine.

holy spirit appointed overseers to shepherd?

6:1, 2; jude 22) are these not good reasons for being obedient to those who are taking the lead?read hebrews 13:17.. .

jonahstourguide

Yep it was a difficult one to sit through, sympathies to the rest of my "necessity compatriots".

My answer to para 6 today turned a few elders heads. The conductor asked, after getting the regulation verbatim answers,

"how are elders appointed by holy spirit?".

"Well, actually todays elders are not appointed by holy spirit, only the early christian

congregations' oveseers were by paul and the operation of holy spirit was immediately evident.

Today however, the elders are 'said' to be appointed by holy spirit only if they conform to the

scriptural qualifications and the rules stated in the elders manual. The governing body relies on the local elder body to

'get it right' as it were". Conductor smiles benignly and says we'll have the next paragraph read.

Ha ha I've already dodged 2 attempts for a shepherding call over the generation correction. " Its just not convenient at this time,

thank you for your concern".

jtg

32

Contradictory Timelines - Do they REALLY think we are this stupid?

by piztjw in

so in today's wt, as brought out in another thread, it is the nations that make the declaration of "peace and security.

" yet just a few paragraphs later they claim, in answer to their own question of who declares "peace and security", that the bible doesn't say.. in the very next paragraph they say that angels are holding back the destructive winds of the great tribulation.

to answer their next question as to what those angels are waiting for they say the wait is for the "annointed" to receive their second sealing, referring to a 2007 q/r which says the second sealing is finished only when the "annointed" (including the gb) are in heaven.

jonahstourguide

Yep, confusing but the study issue feb 15 2014 pages 8 to 12 seems to go

with the july 2013 view. I was told not to get too technical when I popped the

question to an elder on sunday.

jtg

65

Will this Memorial be our last?

by pixel in

they just put up the march km 2014 on the private website.

most of it is same-old-same-old, with info here and there about the memorial.. somebody here might post the march km for all to see, i wont.. i just wanted to share the paragraph from page 2 q&a anticle: will you seize the opportunity?

upcoming memorial enables us to show gratitude .

jonahstourguide

Good point prologos

We been observing it all through the "great tribulation we never had"

and now somebody reckons it wont be observed at the end of a hundred years.

buggered if I know

11

How to Cause a Hardcore JW Brain to Malfunction

by Apognophos in

i am leaving it to the reader to decide whether this trick is funny in a cruel way, or potentially beneficial.

it can definitely be used for evil, that is to say, personal amusement.

then again, it could be a kind way to help someone start thinking outside the box.

jonahstourguide

How many guesses do I get Oubliette ? One for every "adjustment"?

jtg

199

Millions die in Natural disasters - God is doing nothing. Do I adopt Anthropomorphism to him?

by KateWild in

i do not think god is a'morphic.

god is not human, so hence he does not possess human characteristics, to know god better and to understand him better i study science.

there has been a new discovery of strange signals picked up from black holes and distant supernovae suggest there's more to space-time than einstein believed.

jonahstourguide

Konceptual99 Oh no, Hypothesis that has been falsified after experimentation is called

Bullshit in the part of the world i live in irrespective of whether it's in the rubbish bin

or not. Thats gotta be obvious!! I don't believe I stated that a scientific theory was or was not falsified.

Actually I don't understand where this concept of "Falsified" came from.

(Does trash canning something mean it's falsified in some parts of the world?)

Perhaps the Australian idiom I'm using is not working internationally. My point was that many theories

are formulated calculated and abandoned as they don't have or cannot be proven at that time.

Then others take their place. Mate I've had this new light argument with others,,, there is no new light.

It's called "we got it wrong and we're not telling you so"

199

Millions die in Natural disasters - God is doing nothing. Do I adopt Anthropomorphism to him?

by KateWild in

i do not think god is a'morphic.

god is not human, so hence he does not possess human characteristics, to know god better and to understand him better i study science.

there has been a new discovery of strange signals picked up from black holes and distant supernovae suggest there's more to space-time than einstein believed.

jonahstourguide

Thank you snare, I'm going to have a good look.

Have they found a way of making dna computing more commercially viable?