Posts by kaik

47

"Make a list of people you want to meet in the New System!" (New September Watchtower)

by FusionTheism in

watchtower september 2015 study edition, "stand firm in the faith," paragraphs 16 and 17:.

following jesus example, we must read the bible daily, study it, and meditate on what we learn.

along with general bible study, dig into topics about which you may have questions.. you can imitate jesus by meditating on the wonderful promises jehovah has made to you.

kaik

Question is if the other people would be interested to meet up with you at all. I remember my elder dreamed to meet with Da Vinci in the new system.

26

How much sediment would have been moved in Noah's flood?

by Zoos in

i flew over this crate yesterday on my return home from las vegas.. .

they say this crater was created by an asteroid about 50,000 years ago.

then about 6000 years ago, presumably, god wiped out all life on earth with a global flood.. how much sediment would have been moved around during that flood.

Interesting feature of European neolithic is continuous human settlement, while underlying ethnic groups had changed and intermingled as can be evident from pottery and sites. A good example is Beaker culture and Corded Ware culture which existed at the same time as supposed Deluge. These people built Stonehenge and hundreds of sites around continent from Iberian peninsula to British Islands to Central Europe and Carpathian basin. The civilization ended around 1800 BC after 1000 years of continuous existence after introduction of bronze into the culture. Some sites were inhabited for several hundreds of years of continuous human presence and had yield hundreds of skeletons. There are DNA studies done across Europe on this culture to pinpoint ancestry of Indo-european population and they are interest for origin of proto-Celtic and and Balto-germanic nations. None of these studies had ever uncovered a global deluge and total annihilation out of population in the 2200 BC. There was a significant collapse of Bronze age civilization in Europe around 1600BC as a result of Thera explosion and subsequent mass migration of population southward due sudden cooling of the northern hemisphere. Science can pinpoint this explosion to accuracy of 50 years, yet, nobody ever discovered any evidence of global flood in neolithic/bronze age.

35

What are Some of your best JW Questions they can't answer?

by 1tMakesNoSence in

i made a thread on reddit regarding questions jw's can't answer.

was wondering what you guys can add to it..

kaik

My favorite is who is the owner of the old light. If the old light was incorrect and replaced with the new light; thus, who was the source of the old light. If God cannot make mistake, then the old light cannot come from him.

26

How much sediment would have been moved in Noah's flood?

by Zoos in

i flew over this crate yesterday on my return home from las vegas.. .

they say this crater was created by an asteroid about 50,000 years ago.

then about 6000 years ago, presumably, god wiped out all life on earth with a global flood.. how much sediment would have been moved around during that flood.

kaik

Some of the sediments in Northern America are up to two miles deep. This is especially true for central part where intracoastal seaway connected Hudson Bay with Gulf of Mexico, but over the time it was filled with deposits. Therefore, it is also difficult to understand what is the cause for Madrid fault in middle of the country, due the rift being filled with sediments. Northern America has a lot of craters (Catskills, Chesapeake Bay, Yucatan, Manicouagan), which are well studied cases.

It's very likely if humans originated in that general area of the world that it would be completely flooded without it everything

Nope, humans originated in Eastern Africa and the migration is well documented from numerous evidences in archeology, biology, paleontology,... Israel is in the middle of rift between several tectonic plates that pushes African Plate northwest and Arabian plate south east/east. There are also microplates like Anatolian, which have own direction of movements. One point Mediterranean sea was closed, causing a huge issue with global climate as it almost dried up. Water level in enclosed area can fluctuate by several hundred feet, and this also evident by Booneville lake. Israel topo features are not unique.

Earth potentially having had a ice ring similar to Saturn

No, there are not evidence to , it is another pitiful attempt of evangelical creationists to come up with explanation of Stone Age myth as a scientific proof. Last time Earth was significantly covered with ice was 550 ma when most of the surface was covered with glacier with the exception of equator. This is known as snowball effect, and the ozone layer is the legacy of this glaciation.

ancient civilizations living in both North and South America at the time of the supposed flood occurring

Not only there, but also in China. There is no whatsoever any evidence of global flood around 2200BC. Not single one. Egypt was already advanced civilization, and human population was already distributed everywhere around the globe even in Australia. The number of people around the time was close to 30 millions. European neolithic is well studied subject for last 200 years, and there is nowhere a break of population habitat in Europe around the time of flood.

74

Is Prophecy important?

by EA916 in

hello, i am certainly new to all of this.

i have recently been studying the prophecy's, and i was wondering if they are of any importance at all?

kaik

Welcome to the board. When I was still associated with JW, I had debated the prophesies with one unbeliever. His question was very simple at that time which really shocked me, "Do you know what all biblical prophesies have common?" "None of them ever came true". Once I have analyzed various prophesies, they seems much of BS than proof of divine intervention.

Any Jew will tell you that Jesus did not fulfill role of Messiah, as he did not restore kingdom of Jews nor brought to peace to the world. Jerusalem was destroyed in 70AD, but Jews were not banned from Jerusalem until much later around 115-130AD.

40

Spiritual AMNESTY -- Return to Jehovah

by FusionTheism in

basically, from what i can tell from the new return to jehovah brochure, is that the governing body is now offering amnesty to anyone who has been gone from the congregation but now wants to return.. it claims it doesn't matter what sins you've done, or what caused you to leave, if you repent to jehovah and ask the elders to help you, and return to the meetings, you'll be warmly welcomed with no disciplinary action or judgment against you..

kaik

So, the WT attempts to impose another cultish outreach to people who are out, but still partially in the WT. Amnesty can be defined as a pardon for offense, so the WT wants to say that we are the offenders, and they will forgive us! How loving.

109

Did judge Rutherford piss off Hitler

by greenhornet in

the jws at the time in germany where considered part of the aryan race, (since they were not jews).

then things changed for the jws after rutherford mailed a letter to hitler bragging about jehovahs kingdom on earth.. so can we add this to the bloodshed that that the watchtower corp is responsible for?.

kaik

Thanks OrphanCrow for a clarification, I haven't considered dual covenant doctrine, but it make sense. During the evangelical movement of the 1900s, the perception of Jews and Judaism was much different than in interwar period with the rise of totalitarian movements. Russell would be affected by the fundamentalist pro-Zionist Christianity that was defined around his lifetime, while Rutherford would shift toward anti-Jewish policy after 1925. It is hard to justify Jerusalem to be the future seat of Jesus kingdom with WT building mansion in San Diego.

Welcome Finkelstein, I only read some chapters of it. Some Rutherford ideas showed lack of knowledge of Jewish faith, culture, and religion. Average scholar with university degree would write such nonsense as he did in that book. He failed to understand why Jews do not accept Jesus, he did not know that Jews do not believe in Original Sin, and Jesus redemption does not make whatsoever sense in Judaism.

109

Did judge Rutherford piss off Hitler

by greenhornet in

the jws at the time in germany where considered part of the aryan race, (since they were not jews).

then things changed for the jws after rutherford mailed a letter to hitler bragging about jehovahs kingdom on earth.. so can we add this to the bloodshed that that the watchtower corp is responsible for?.

kaik

Finkelstein, you can obtain copy of "Comfort for the Jews" by Joseph Franklin Rutherford on Archive.org. They have digitized version of the 1925 book. Some of the ideas in that book are truly ridiculous as Rutherford lacked any understanding of Jewish faith and history. For example he said that Jews must accept NT and Messiah insisting that Satan had blind them etc.

Generally, Rutherford perceived Jews as money loving people in control of Anglo-American empire and taking last nickle from passerby on the street. He also used terms like nose-hooked and Jesus murderer. There are tons of the material on the internet, and some Jewish groups had dedicated their effort to summarize various text and preaching from his era as a proof of antisemitism in WT.

109

Did judge Rutherford piss off Hitler

by greenhornet in

the jws at the time in germany where considered part of the aryan race, (since they were not jews).

then things changed for the jws after rutherford mailed a letter to hitler bragging about jehovahs kingdom on earth.. so can we add this to the bloodshed that that the watchtower corp is responsible for?.

kaik

FusionTheisim, you generalize. Heroism is always on individual level, and the were JWs who were brave and JWs who were not when it came to face to face with totalitarian regimes like Nazism and Communism. There were catholic priests who stood up to Nazism and they were these who supported. However, talking about bravery of JWs without consideration that Rutherford was living in seclusion and security at San Diego and WT HQ in Brooklyn during WWII under protection of USA, is very ridiculous.

109

Did judge Rutherford piss off Hitler

by greenhornet in

the jws at the time in germany where considered part of the aryan race, (since they were not jews).

then things changed for the jws after rutherford mailed a letter to hitler bragging about jehovahs kingdom on earth.. so can we add this to the bloodshed that that the watchtower corp is responsible for?.

kaik

Many JWs did suffer and died under Nazi regime for their faith. There is no debate on it. However, it is crucial to say that some died due own negligence and sheer irresponsibility. For example in May 1942, 3rd highest ranking Nazi official of the Reich, R. Heydrich, was assassinated by Czechoslovak underground resistance at the outskirts of Prague. The retaliation was immediately brutal, thousands of people were executed, and small city of Lidice was leveled and all men slaughtered. Martial law was declared throughout Protectorate and everyone was required to carry identification IDs. An elder from northern Moravia encouraged his congregation to destroy their IDs or not present them to the occupational forces by arguing with Revelation 13:16. During the peak of the Nazi oppression, JWs in that congregation went to the field service without any proof of identification, where they got arrested and executed. Totally unnecessary.