Posts by prologos

45

If there is a creator, will an expanding universe ever become bigger than he?

by prologos in

the bible has expressions like: "--god walked in the garden at the breezy part of the day--" .

but more realisticly, speaking in today's lingo:.

if, as accepted by consensus, the universe was "smaller" in the past, expanding out of a zero size singularity, it was "smaller" than the "creator"* at that point in time.

prologos

mr. Grundy, you live on the GRoUNDy, because you are material, naturally.. There was no material before the BB, or in the singularity. but if we agree there must be creator, creatrice, she/he obviously was super natural, non-material, not immaterial. "god" did not need a ground or reason to stand on or to exist. god being eternal, is therefore existing in eternal time, which is a non-material, supernatural dimension. thank you for helping me along.

yes, thinking about it, time is the one dimension that the universe shares with the creator as far as we can tell, the fairy tale afternoon "walk in the garden" notwithstanding. But if you live (like god) in an eternal STRETCH of time does that not imply size? it does on earth! "---adding one cubit to your life ?---"' blessings.

45

If there is a creator, will an expanding universe ever become bigger than he?

by prologos in

the bible has expressions like: "--god walked in the garden at the breezy part of the day--" .

but more realisticly, speaking in today's lingo:.

if, as accepted by consensus, the universe was "smaller" in the past, expanding out of a zero size singularity, it was "smaller" than the "creator"* at that point in time.

prologos

no its not a frivolus question, I have thought about it for many times sitting and blasting my chair at the KH. and there is a real created universe out there expanding as we write. so there must be a real answer which I like help and input with. blessings.

45

If there is a creator, will an expanding universe ever become bigger than he?

by prologos in

the bible has expressions like: "--god walked in the garden at the breezy part of the day--" .

but more realisticly, speaking in today's lingo:.

if, as accepted by consensus, the universe was "smaller" in the past, expanding out of a zero size singularity, it was "smaller" than the "creator"* at that point in time.

prologos

the bible has expressions like: "--god walked in the garden at the breezy part of the day--" . but more realisticly, speaking in today's lingo:

If, as accepted by consensus, the universe was "smaller" in the past, expanding out of a zero size singularity, it was "smaller" than the "Creator"* at that point in time. point in every way.

WHEN-or at what SIZE or at all would it become larger than it's maker? When and Size are related since they are described by known dimensions.

*for the purpose of this discussion lets assume that the universe did not creat itself, was not a random fluctuation in the created vaccum.

317

Does God's foreknowledge take away from free will?

by Christ Alone in

just by knowing what will happen, that doesn't mean that we can prevent or cause something to happen.

my knowing that does not prevent them the free will of making the choice.. it's the same with god.

if god is not restricted to existence in the present, then the future is known by god because god indwells the future as well as the present and the past.

prologos

The time-space-energy-matter laws work the same way for atheists, agnostics, so substitute your favored entity or abstract for GOD, CREATOR.

A real fast- talking god could have told the awe-inspiring predictor of THOR'S hammer- thunder that a flash was on the way before she saw it, before her blind friend heard it.

The illustrations used just work with the knowns, givens. . A being with better senses, not embedded in an expanding, through-time-moving universe could describe events that are not perceived yet by those that are. In that sense God can be a pleasently surprised spectator of the "--spectacle-- paul was mentioning in I Cor.4:9 or to quote the Bard : "-- the world is a stage--".

I would love to hear falsification, rebuttals, not to details sematics, but the point.

27

With elders like that, who needs Pharisees!

by 00DAD in

i'm sure you're all familiar with the quip, "with friends like that, who needs enemies!

a recent thread got me thinking about how this easily applies to the organization in general and to many of the elders in particular.

now i know, there are some few good elders out there (god knows i tried to be one).

prologos

in amy given BOE, guess which Pharisee will set the tone? The leaven of the Pharisees spreading from the top down.

Jesus: --" you ,though, are not to be that way--" Luke 25:26

317

Does God's foreknowledge take away from free will?

by Christ Alone in

just by knowing what will happen, that doesn't mean that we can prevent or cause something to happen.

my knowing that does not prevent them the free will of making the choice.. it's the same with god.

if god is not restricted to existence in the present, then the future is known by god because god indwells the future as well as the present and the past.

prologos

A factor in Gods ability to "forsee" events is the fact that it might not be foresight at all, but just Gods "Sight" period.

Consider the fact that all information we receive is from the past. The most stunning demonstration of that is to see a thunderbolt and then have the bang arrive 3 seconds later, or to watch a space launch and feel it starting to rattle your teeth later. . so:

You could awe a blind person with your "foreknowledge" by "predicting" that in x seconds she will hear an earth-shattering noise,--- because you just saw a lightening flash, but she could not.

compared to the 600mph/ 100kmh sound perception, the absolute speed for US to get ANY info is "c" 300 000km/sec a nice round figure=186K M iles/sec.

Because we MOVE TROUGH TIME, all info we receive is already UNALTERABLE history. We send messages into the future, but they will be received from the past.

But it can be shown that the Creator does not MOVE through time as we do, --GOD IS-- in time. He IS eternal in the past and future. He is able to see events as they happen. To illustrate: He could tell us all what has happened on a recently dicovered galaxy 14 billion light years away, and what are the events there "now", only to seen in 14 billion hence in this neck of the woods. it is most likely gone. the woods too. For us that would be a prediction, not for a Being that is outside our "moving time", and "c" constraint.

There are other factors that make this concept applicable in our narrow "bible prophecy" domain, but the principle is stands.

IF Jehovahs dwells in the Pleiades, (as opined by somebody definitely not of the FDS)*, its possible that human bible history would there just now become visible to the Pleiadians, But He could have "predicted" -read describe- it all to the Pleiadians 6000 years in advance as He saw it by just looking from His " not moving in time" heavenly abode. None of our ancestors would be at all restrained from exercising their free will by that observation and reporting cum prediction.

ALL THIS OBSERVATION OF THE PAST DOES NOT RETROACTIVELY EFFECT ITS OUCOME. God sees it instantly, we will see it later, sometime 6000 years later. beabeorean.com on time, space and the scriptures.

*note: not all WT new light is inaccurate * note: respectful treatment: calling CTR a "somebody" not a nobody.

20

By what name should Christ's followers be known?

by The Searcher in

at isaiah 43:12, jehovah said to his fleshly nation of israel, "you are my witnesses.

" after christ's death, the literal jewish nation was cast off as god's chosen people, (matt.

21:43) and jehovah now allowed gentiles to join those jews who accepted christ as the messiah, to become part of the 'israel of god'.

prologos

Christians, belonging to the Way. I opt for the awkward "ISRAELITES OF GOD" or members of The "Israel of God". here are my thoughts:

ISRAEL was a real name given by the Father of ALL.

the ISRAEL OF GOD or spiritual israel, is composed of 12 tribes too, each tribe having a REAL name. as in Rev.7

going forward into time and looking at Rev.20-21 The NAME of the 12 tribes hence ISRAEL is a feature of the New Heavenly Eternal City, its Gates. check beabeorean.com.

The reality is, that we have real flesh and blood Christians in the Way making up the ISRAEL OF GOD right here with us. But,

wether the book is just fables, the concept a fabolous fabrication or real, is another matter.

22

Since the wt is discredited, what is the pillar and support of truth now?

by prologos in

since the wt with its doctrines past and present is discredited, is there an entity that can be shown to be the latter- day "-----pillar and support of truth---" paul was writing about at i tim 3:15.?

have the believers or non-theists or exjws an equivalent at all ?

because humans like to huddle around the fire for the radiant heat.

prologos

texas: "-- start talking---" I am afraid of monologues. it is the conversations like these that advance, bring out my ideas, so I am gratful to be here.

159

Believers, do you believe in evolution?

by everchangingworld in

after leaving, i still couldn't wrap my head around evolution (after the years of seing "intelligent design" in everything around me).. there's a series of videos that give a good intro to evolution and critical thinking.

they've probably been posted here before, but, for any new members, these are worth watching.. evolution: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdddbyilel0.

critical thinking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6olpl5p0fmg.

prologos

cofty; you write: evolution has nor target. I meant no fixed target. it is an always moving target, species sensing and responding to be the most efficient energy-users moving into the available niches. Since there are many created niches, and some shutting down and new ones appearing, we have species that some, (not me) consider less evolved.

since it is more difficult to make an adapting entity than a fixed one, would not the evolution process give a creator more credit, than the"according to its kind" bible fable?

as a newby I am very impressed and overwhelmed with the level of knowledge and is use among you- all. If ever there would be a large scale public face-off with WTBTS personnel, it would be over .

159

Believers, do you believe in evolution?

by everchangingworld in

after leaving, i still couldn't wrap my head around evolution (after the years of seing "intelligent design" in everything around me).. there's a series of videos that give a good intro to evolution and critical thinking.

they've probably been posted here before, but, for any new members, these are worth watching.. evolution: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdddbyilel0.

critical thinking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6olpl5p0fmg.

prologos

cofty, thank you: I believe what I got from my reads, that it was fine tuning all the way, one increment at the time , rather than the big mutations. the final, or present steps giving those elegant shapes. and the bird brains to go with it. Butterflies with brains like a pinhead, going south for the winter! wow.

I also believe,- because development is to take best advantage of energy, matter and laws-, that evolution would automaticly be an ascent wwith perfection as a "target".

according to religion-speak we are decendants of Adam, degenerate adams,--but-- evolution has us as ASCENDET microbes, shrews, comon ancesters also called (other) Primates.

so believing in evolution has another plus, you are an Ascendent, UP, not an Descendent, Down.

you can see how the bible has subtely shaped our thinking., Luther, Tyndale et al were believers in ADAM degenerating descending toward us. blessings.