Posts by mustang

5

Does anyone have any idea what to do?

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

a sister called me last night very upset.

she knows that my family is avoiding me because of my questions and "doubts' about the organiation.

but we are still sort of friends.

mustang

About 20 years ago, I took my visiting parents to a session of a DC @ Dodger Stadium. I took off for lunch for most of the sessions but during intermission was sitting alone and minding my own business. A "sister" (who I obviously had never seen before) came up to me and GOT PHYSICAL. I was dressed neatly, "business casual", no tie. I had longer hair than is JW acceptable, but not excessive.

These ladies are DESPERATE!!!

And WTS has no answer except 'hang in there'. With the bad ratios of men to women, I'm dubious of the old prayer cure-all.

This brings up a question I have had recently from a lady who is an ex and has recently 'bagged a man': can you be disciplined for marrying an unbeliever (UBM syndrome)?

I replied that you have a worse problem: they are supposedly cracking down on inactive people like us.

I haven't been to meetings in ~35 years (~8840 meetings); she has been to a meeting or 2 in the last 10 years; but that's about it 2 meetings out of 2600 (5 x 52 x 10).

So which is worse 'marrying out of the troof' or being inactive for massive amounts of time?

Frankly, I have seen an extremely active ex-Bethelite get DF'd, and come back married to a non-JW. She just goes to the meetings with him and totally shrugs it off. I'm surprised that he did that, with the boy-girl ratio favoring guys in Dubdom.

I would suggest that she finds somebody wherever-however, take him to the altar and let the chips fall where they may. They will take her back, sooner or later, if she doesn't wake up.

Mustang

19

Phoenix, AZ What do you think?

by White Dove in

jw
friends

i visited phoenix when i was a kid and fell in love with the hot desert and big city.. i haven't been back since, so i'd like your take on phoenix now.. i've given up on houston, tx cuz it doesn't sound as nice as the desert..

mustang

They have black widow spiders there.

OMG, yes!!! We had a mild winter one year that didn't kill them off. The 2nd summer these black golfballs were hanging from the citrus trees!!!

Mustang

17

Will Angels Make Appearance?

by cameo-d in

i think wt uses the word "channel" in reference to supernatural messages from jehovah.

wrong: channeling is wrong according to jw and is only divination or such from demonic sources.. channeling is not used in connection with "good messages".

that is just described as "utterances from god/jehovah" or some such wording and is approved without any particular terminology.

mustang

There has been some thought that WTS HQ has had channeling to occur: but it would be a literal witchhunt if that came to the surface

Mustang

19

Phoenix, AZ What do you think?

by White Dove in

jw
friends

i visited phoenix when i was a kid and fell in love with the hot desert and big city.. i haven't been back since, so i'd like your take on phoenix now.. i've given up on houston, tx cuz it doesn't sound as nice as the desert..

mustang

Been there, done that: 116 in the shade the day I got there.

Learned to fly, there. Wonderful for flying: "typically 26 days below minimums" was our saying. "Visibility is 800 miles and improving".

After I left, I heard that Sky Harbor recorded something over 120 degress on the tarmac. They wouldn't let the heavies go out because the temp was off the scale (Air Data Tables; I believe the "Standard Atmosphere" quits there). So they called Boeing and the techs there ran "extrapolations" to bless some chart addendums for takeoff and landing rollouts.

One million people there when I left; I heard today that it is 3 million.

The "Valley of the Sun" is about 100 miles long: I visited one lady in Avondale and another in Apache Junction, opposite ends of the valley. It seemed that girls were outnumbering guys by about 2:1 while I was there.

I left because of the heat.

Mustang

17

Will Angels Make Appearance?

by cameo-d in

i think wt uses the word "channel" in reference to supernatural messages from jehovah.

wrong: channeling is wrong according to jw and is only divination or such from demonic sources.. channeling is not used in connection with "good messages".

that is just described as "utterances from god/jehovah" or some such wording and is approved without any particular terminology.

mustang

I think WT uses the word "channel" in reference to supernatural messages from Jehovah

Wrong: channeling is wrong according to JW and is only divination or such from demonic sources.

Channeling is not used in connection with "good messages". That is just described as "utterances from God/Jehovah" or some such wording and is approved without any particular terminology.

Pretty much the official line is that such communications have ceased since the NT/Greek Scriptures times; modern communication is simply the "acting of the holy spirit" and they let it go with that pronouncement. No specific instances will be admitted, produced or discussed. Vagueness is the opeative term here.

For instance, if you were to discuss Joan d' Arc, they would say that it is demonic in nature, perhaps channeling and was not a communiqué to JW's.

Mustang

73

As of tomorrow I will no longer be a JW

by passwordprotected in

after my last post where i asked for advice on how to handle whether i should tell an elder that we've been going to church, i decided to tell a local elder who's related to me through marriage.

this was to save my dad having to 'report' me (i'd told my dad we go to church).

anyway, i had an interesting chat with him and he said some very personally revealing things re.

mustang

Wow, I wrote what I wrote before reading all; again, they are generally instructed to maintain control and cut you short. But you had a couple that had some genuine feelings and even concern. Not impossible, but surprising; I would have been touched also.

Generally, they are instructed to look for this sort of thing as a show of remorse and contrition to guage the genuinensss of your repentance. To see it go the other way is -- well, just WOW!!!!

Overall, as good as could be hoped for...

Mustang

73

As of tomorrow I will no longer be a JW

by passwordprotected in

after my last post where i asked for advice on how to handle whether i should tell an elder that we've been going to church, i decided to tell a local elder who's related to me through marriage.

this was to save my dad having to 'report' me (i'd told my dad we go to church).

anyway, i had an interesting chat with him and he said some very personally revealing things re.

mustang

Please let us know what happens... I'm especially interested to hear how they respond to your testimony of becoming a "real" Christian.

(And don't forget to tell them about the multi-million-dollar WT payout to the sex abuse survivors!)

If you look up and read "classic" "JT" posts (a poster that was in Bethel and was deeply involved in JW congo business; he hasn't posted in a long time: too busy getting his degree) you will note that they have a directive to "NOT GIVE YOU A FORUM". A JC will set the agenda and follow it, not let you set the agenda. They will cut the meeting short, rather than let you take floor and start preaching.

Any such preaching, they cut you short, write you off as apostate and fill out the paperwork and select who makes the announcement.

If I sound brutal, it is better that you be aware of reality.

Mustang

73

As of tomorrow I will no longer be a JW

by passwordprotected in

after my last post where i asked for advice on how to handle whether i should tell an elder that we've been going to church, i decided to tell a local elder who's related to me through marriage.

this was to save my dad having to 'report' me (i'd told my dad we go to church).

anyway, i had an interesting chat with him and he said some very personally revealing things re.

mustang

So, I've got all of the UN-related material I could find on the 'net, highlighted the relevant portions and I'll pass it on to them.

They won't give you a forum, to witness to them or "testify": they will sidestep that so fast you won't know what came at you. All they need is something to note that you are now apostate. They are single minded to disposition you into one of the appropriate pigeon holes NOW and nothing else is relevant.

I would send them the DocBob Letter rather than discuss anything resembling theology or let them do what they will do in the blind.

Regardless, best of luck to you.

Mustang

13

Do JW's EVER admit to being wrong about any topic?

by gaiagirl in

witnesses are trained to believe they are right when speaking about the bible and their beliefs, even when reminded that their beliefs have been "adjusted" for "new light".. .

do jw's you know admit to being wrong on any point, whether or not bible related, or are the "always right" even when shown to be wrong?

mustang

A few might when the GB advise them that once again they as R&F read more into something then what the WTS stated.

They have admitted to incorrect dates, but generally deflect by saying they are eager as apostles were.

A very old post by uncle_onion details the real and public screw-up that Rutherford made with the 1925 date. They had solid stuff in writing (in the WT) and the date went by with no effect. They learned from that one and put on the "Teflon overcoat". Thereafter, they never put anything in writing that was blatant about chronology. They let it leak out from the platform and private conversation: i.e. gossip and the grapevine. The key here is not so much "plausible deniability" as it is "indirect misinformation".

***
w8112/1p.27par.2ThePathoftheRighteousDoesKeepGettingBrighter***

At times explanations given by Jehovah’s visible organization have shown adjustments, seemingly to previous points of view. But this has not actually been the case. This might be compared to what is known in navigational circles as "tacking." By maneuvering the sails the sailors can cause a ship to go from right to left, back and forth, but all the time making progress toward their destination in spite of contrary winds.

Ya gotta love their classic "tacking" BS: any sailor knows that tacking is a series of small angled maneuvers that "cut across the wind", eventually going upwind. The WTS version of tacking is invariably a series of complete reversals ("180's") that cancel each other out and go no-where: mathematically WTS plays a "zero-sum game", standing still, whereas real tacking "vectors" upwind accomplishing motion.

Besides: legal won't let them; apologies have repercussions.

Mustang

15

Latest United Nations-End of Religion-End of World alert

by Questions1 in

it has been awhile since i've posted anything, but i got this e-mail from someone who is on the edge of falling out of the borg due to mental stress.

i've attempted to verify the information, even called the united nations, but haven't gotten to a person who can say if this meeting happened.

my gut says this is a contrived experience with many details just not adding up...but you never know.

mustang

My favorite is still the one about vultures multiplying faster to meet the needs of the coming destruction

Mustang