Quillsky

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Posts by Quillsky

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  2

  Cognitive Dissonance

  by Quillsky in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the term cognitive dissonance is thrown around often on this forum, and rightly so, imo.

  it has been discussed before and will be discussed going forward, but another thread made me realize that perhaps now is a good time to re-open the discussion.. in brief, cognitive dissonance is how our minds work to close the gap between our attitudes and what we believe to be true, and what we do and experience to be true.

  our minds want to close that gap, or reduce the dissonance.. so if what we believe doesn't match with what we're doing, we shift our minds to close the gap.

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  Quillsky

  The term cognitive dissonance is thrown around often on this forum, and rightly so, IMO. It has been discussed before and will be discussed going forward, but another thread made me realize that perhaps now is a good time to re-open the discussion.

  In brief, cognitive dissonance is how our minds work to close the gap between our ATTITUDES and what we BELIEVE to be true, and what we DO and EXPERIENCE to be true. Our minds want to close that gap, or reduce the dissonance.

  So if what we BELIEVE doesn't match with what we're DOING, we shift our minds to close the gap. Hence we BELIEVE that what we're DOING is correct.

  It's the perfect breeding ground for a hectic activity-based cult.

  We all experience some dissonance in everyday life, but seldom as much as a lifelong JW who has given up everything and gone out in field service and raised their families with the BELIEF that the world is about to end, and cannot reconcile that belief with the FACT of the awesomeness of the planet and its people and the unlikelihood of the imminent "end of the world".

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance

  Read, and discuss.
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  23

  Before you learned the real truth about "The Truth", did anyone try to help you get out of JWs?

  by JimmyPage in

  1. jw
  2. friends
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  Quillsky

  Yes.

  It helped that it was a work colleague, so not someone I knew in a religious or family or door-to-door context. When he discovered I was a JW he revealed that he happened to know a lot about Jehovah's Witness beliefs, including some things that I didn't then know or grasp, through no particular interest on his part but because he was someone who knew a lot about a lot of things.

  We never debated hard-core doctrine. The best way to describe our discussions at work is that he was gently mocking of the general beliefs, but in an intellectually honest and worldly-wise way.

  So I invited him to attend a meeting, since he was sort of an "interested one". He good-naturedly agreed. After the meeting some young brothers and sisters were planning on meeting up at a restaurant for a meal and invited me, but one ministerial servant explicitly said that my "worldly friend" was not welcome to join us. It was extremely embarrassing to try to explain this to my colleague. I would say that over the few months of these small touch-points my eyes began to open.

  An interesting post-script is that many years after this happened, the judgmental MS, who had since left the organization himself, ran into my former colleague socially and apologized to him for saying he was not welcome to join us at the restaurant after the meeting all those years ago.
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  36

  Why does the WTBS hate sex so much?

  by highdose in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  now i know they try to control everything and pretty much ban anything.

  but sex seems to be somthing they can't stand and would like to get rid of completly if they could.

  so many articles and so much conusel about not having sex or having anything to do with sex from any angle at all.

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  Quillsky

  Robdar said....

  I do not know of any modern day church that condones sex except within the confines of marriage. Care to enlighten me?

  There are many mainstream religions that welcome unmarried couples to attend their church, no matter what the status of their sexual relationship or living arrangements.

  Often they kindly or actively encourage the couple to marry rather than living together unmarried, but you don't hear of them calling the couple into a kangaroo court to request details of their sexual acts, and you definitely don't hear of them then reading an announcement from the pulpit that is secret code for "nobody is to say a greeting to the unmarried couple".

  I personally know MANY couples that lived together, had mucho sex, before getting married in a mainstream church by a mainstream priest or pastor or preacher. I've attended some of these weddings in beautiful churches.

  Most of these couples talk of the pre-marriage counselling they received, and by all accounts it focuses on creating a good marriage and living a loving life as a couple, rather than witch-hunting premarital sexual activity.
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  46

  When do you know you are a JW apostate?

  by dissed in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  you know you are a jw apostate when..... .

  your fellow jw's mates that are df'd for drug abuse, drunkeness, and wild sex orgies refuse to talk to you because you are bad association.. you know you are a jw apostate when....... you come by to visit your jw parents, they open the door and say they are not interested.. you know you are a jw apostate when........ the wts takes your contribution for the wwf but refuses to send you a thank you letter.. you know you are a jw apostate when....... you can buy tupperware at a yard sale and not worry it has a demon preserved inside.. you know you are a jw apostate when........ you can visit jwn and not feel guillty for weeks at a time.

  you know you are a jw apostate when......... the girls at the kh find you more mysterious and sexy now that your df'd.

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  Quillsky

  You know you may be an ex-JW but NOT a JW apostate when.......

  Someone says "You were in a cult", and you respond (or think) "No, no, it's not really a cult".

  You know you ARE a JW apostate when.......

  You can say "I was in a cult", and you experience ZERO tug of cognitive dissonance to resolve.
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  63

  God so LOVED the world.........................................WHY? How could He?

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the following is the most quoted scripture in the bible:.

  john 3:16 (new international version) .

  16"for god so loved the world that he gave his one and only son,that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.. here is a question for you.

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  Quillsky

  Terry I believe you now have two stalkers.

  Perry

  HappyDad
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  27

  How do you respond to: "The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one?"

  by darthfader in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i get this statement all the time from my jw family.

  that this system is in satan's control.

  or that "this or that" is put here to test our faith.

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  Quillsky

  How do you logically rebut statements like these?

  There's no logic available for paranoid pessimists, my friend. Lead loved family members by the hand to a beautiful sunset and a pessimist may tell you that the orange and pink colors come from the dirt particles in the air; the paranoid will tell you that it's an attempt to get them to "love this system of things".

  There are none so blind as those that will not see.
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  55

  BOE on Disfellowshiped Relatives

  by JWFreak in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  again...please do not request a pdf scan these are interbranch copies not the same ones sent to the congregations.

  jwf.. january 21, 2010 .

  to all bodies of elders .

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  Quillsky

  I understand your mistrust......but I can confirm this letter is real, I normally get these interbranch copies a month or so before the congregation elders receive them.
  
  Any one who reads BOE letters will recognise the style and content of these type of letters anyway.

  JWFreak, if you are posting real early news of interbranch Bethel correspondence then I thank you, as do many others.

  I've only had 30 minutes or so to go through your previous <unscanned> early releases of confidential WT information. However I haven't seen evidence yet that any of them were confirmed with follow-up scans or confirmations. Would you consider posting a link to a thread where your insider information has been proved true by follow-up details from WBTS publications/scanned letters thereafter?

  The post about pioneer/aux pioneer hours going down to 50/35 was an interesting one. It was termed a "hoax" by some here but there was also a claim that the Society got wind of the advance information and decided not to implement the new policy in order to discredit the apostate network.

  It could well be that I haven't done enough investigation...............
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  111

  Borg court: 1st session

  by sd-7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  record of committee meeting #1. after prayer, proverbs 28:13 was read: "he who is covering over his transgressions will not succeed, but he who is confessing and leaving them will be shown mercy.

  " the need to confess to jehovah was emphasized.

  as jehovah's representatives, the elders said we therefore needed to confess to them.

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  Quillsky

  sd-7, at this point your story sounds unbelievable to me.
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  63

  God so LOVED the world.........................................WHY? How could He?

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the following is the most quoted scripture in the bible:.

  john 3:16 (new international version) .

  16"for god so loved the world that he gave his one and only son,that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.. here is a question for you.

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  Quillsky

  Terry I believe you have a stalker.

  Perry
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  55

  BOE on Disfellowshiped Relatives

  by JWFreak in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  again...please do not request a pdf scan these are interbranch copies not the same ones sent to the congregations.

  jwf.. january 21, 2010 .

  to all bodies of elders .

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  Quillsky

  Today I described to a relative, one who has never been a JW but knows my family well, how shunning works. His jaw pretty much dropped to the ground.

  On topic..........

  On the other hand, if the circumstancesraise serious questions and the appointed person
  has lost the respect of the congregation, the elders may determine that it would be best for the
  appointed person to relinquish his privilege of service. '

  What does "raise serious questions" mean? Raise which serious questions in the mind of who exactly? How serious do the questions have to be? Will the person in whose mind these "serious questions" have been raised also be subjected to a personal evaluation of whether they are qualified to cast the first stone?

  Cult speak. Sufficiently obscure and vague and loaded with unspoken rules.

  On the other hand, if the circumstances raise serious questions and the appointed person
  has lost the respect of the congregation, the elders may determine that it would be best for the
  appointed person to relinquish his privilege of service.

  Let me understand this right. A congregation is usually between 60 and 180 people. What does "lost respect" mean? Does the MS/elder/pioneer, despite their work for the organization have to have "lost respect" by the entire congregation, like 100%, or is 80% okay? Or 20% of sisters gossiping plus 100% of elders? Or 10% of sisters if they are elders' wives plus 10% of publishers??

  Cult speak. Hmm, "you know exactly what we mean, body of elders.......... Rumors reflect badly on the congrega... we mean on the Governin... we mean Jehovah, yes, Jehovah the almighty God. A rumor that a brother is looking after his family member will reflect badly on Jehovah our God of love. Although it may pain you, you know it's what you need to do."

  On the other hand, if the circumstances raise serious questions and the appointed person
  has lost the respect of the congregation, the elders may determine that it would be best for the
  appointed person to relinquish his privilege of service.

  Oh they may randomly decide on the basis of their own feelings determine that it would be best? What percentage of the congreagation should have lost respect for the person again?

  Cult.

  On the other hand, if the circumstances raise serious questions and the appointed person
  has lost the respect of the congregation, the elders may determine that it would be best for the
  appointed person to relinquish his privilege of service.

  Don't you mean have the voluntary unpaid work taken away from them? Or did you really mean "to relinquish"?

  Cult.

  On the other hand, if the circumstances raise serious questions and the appointed person
  has lost the respect of the congregation, the elders may determine that it would be best for the
  appointed person to relinquish his privilege of service.

  Don't even get me started on this one.

  Cult.