Posts by lurk3r

38

1 John 4:1 What is the JW and non JW take on this scripture? Thank you!

by lurk3r in

jw
friends

lurk3r

Nark - Y My education, and limited way of "thinking", puts me at a loss to properly "understand" contextual errors at present. With that, I pose a question. wtf? The 1 Corinthians quote you have going

on, I can see where your coming from. From reading your bio, I see you worked in the translating dept at the Borg and that was the "beginning of the end for ya". In your above post, you point to an error in the rendering of the NWT. Working

there, when you DID notice a discrepency, what was the procedure that would follow? Who ultimately made the final call and on what basis? Was partiality shown to those who were more "in subjection" to the ones making the final call? Surely

disputes would arise. Did it ever get heated? Since the 50's, when the NWT was introduced, there has had to be a "turnover rate" of translators. Are the new brothers brought into such area's of importance "coached" with regards behaviour and

"different 'conditioning' ?" Is it just the same carryover as the "Kingdom Hall 'conditioning' "? Did you personally talk with the GB about things, or were the considered to "sacred" for laymen? GOD IT FEELS GOOD TO ASK!!! Better yet, to ASK and

have someone who KNOWS things like this!

Narkissos - I can't thank you enough for this opportunity to glean more.

Pee.Ess. If you have talked about all this before, just point me to it.

lurk3r

36

I wish I was Stronger

by apocryphal22 in

jw
friends

but im not.

i have lost everything.. i am a third generation jw on both sides of my family.

all of my family is in full time service, pioneers, elders, cos, international construction, anointed and gb.

lurk3r

Apocrophyl.

My heart goes out to you and your current state.I too am part of a 3rd Generation jw upbringing, full of "spiritually stong" family, INCLUDING a member of the annointed!

I understand VERY well the page you are currently on in your book of life, yet to be written. Hold in there. How long did you view this website before you joined? You joined for a reason Apocrophyl, so please follow the course of your

heart out, and stay here for a little bit. I am the same age as you, and know EXACTLY what you mean when you say, "I'm too old to start over." Whether or not you realize it just yet, you ALREADY have! Your family; all of them, love you. Your

family; all of them, want whats best for you. What your family DOESN'T know, is what actually IS best for you. The ONLY person that knows that, is you Apoc. You have just started to gain your

independence for the first time in your life. It sounds like a tough situation your in, your WHOLE family seems to know exactly where they fit in, and your not sure. Weather the storm Apoc, the sun IS going to come up. Take heart, that I

once said those exact same words to myself, "I am too old to start over". So many people's stories here, are SO ecouraging...but you have to take a little bit of time for yourself first.

Can we chat Apocrophyl? If not here on the board, email or PM? When I first started viewing this board, the kind hearted people here were suggesing the many ways for me to get better. Go to school, get a new job etc...get out and ENJOY life!

All the advice given is VERY true, but I had to overcome some of my fears BEFORE I could even THINK about such things. Everyones situation is different, and as a result I think some thing are easier to do for some than others.

I can relate to your situation, and wish you all the best Apocrophyl. As much as you feel so very alone, your not as alone as you might think you are. Better days are ahead, one way or another. One day in the future, your going to be "looking back" on this very moment. WHATEVER you decide, you are going to be of an IMMENSE help to others.

lurk3r

8

Souls Under the Altar

by cameo-d in

how long do you think it will be until there is a tipping point, when the majority of the population realizes the scam of religions?.

do you think there is a plan in place to try to stop this from happening?.

.

lurk3r

With the many thoughts available to us on a given day, I think we are still "confined". While I am still understanding many things, I do believe freedom is an illusion of sorts. Take for example, the "American Dream". This "dream", is nothing more

than a goal. The masses pursue it, because this is what they are shown. The thing is, we only get what we are given. Beyond what we are given or shown, what more can we seek?

A good friend and open thinker went for a meal today. We had a great chat, and have discussed many things about the world and whats in it. She is not religious, and it is refreshing to speak to her about things and hear how she sees them. Lately

we have beentalking about "global oneness", and the pursuit in which the western world is giving this. Eckhart Tolle's book, The Power of Now is one book that has come up in conversation between us. I like it, but am suspicious of it's intentions.

She loves it, as it "wakes people up" and exposes religion for what it is by using your own mind and "thinking for yourself". I agree, but there has to be more to it. Call me paranoid, but nothing is what it seems, and this site is evidence of that.

We are on the brink of a "New World". It remains to be seen. One can only speculate on the future, and what it holds. Since it has been thousands of years since Jesus was here, I'm going with history in saying that it could be much longer than

one would prefer that he returns. In the meantime, were on our own in one way or another.

Technology is key I believe ,to the world we live in today. Nasa and the military are the ones who hold this key. Current technology that we make use of...is old. Stealth jets that crash have manafacturing dates on them, and unless these number

are intentionally manipulated, THEY are old. Some of these jets that crash, have dates on them that go back to the 80's. Technology increases exponentially, and i really think it impossible to even concieve what actually IS possible, considering

what we are SHOWN. Make sense at all?

In the pew, or out, could be one and the same. possibly? Either way, the higher ups are still going to have the control, because they have the knowledge, because they can see.

your thoughts?

lrkr

14

My thoughts on the memorial.....yea I did go

by Soledad in

jw
friends

it was dull.

i could have sworn that i heard the same talk 20 years ago.

witnesses look tired, bored, lifeless.

lurk3r

hellooooo Soledad.

I don't know of you carry youself with as much grace as you write, but if you do, your extremely attractive. You summed up my experience of going last night, saving me a lot of typing. Thank you.

The sense of urgency is gone

From the looks on the member's faces, they are obviously in denial, or mentally re-writing JW history.

To echo Amazing's tune, that was spot on indeed.

I went to the Memorial last night too. I made MANY of the observations tht you yourself made. For the very first time in my life, I went to the memorial, to LISTEN. I figuratively shook my head in disbelief with the way it all went down. It was unsettling to see the lack of sincerity that so many unconciously displayed. The brother who took the wine glass from my hands, seemed like a really nice guy. I felt sorry for him when I passed the wine (i was sitting on the end) to him and he whispered "right on" and went to the next row. The sacredness was lost to him. I too made a point of looking up the 1 scripture mentioned, and inside myself I wanted to blurt out "Prove to me this is what it means!" ...When the bread went by, for the first time in my life I conciously thought " Could it really be true, that by NOT partaking and just " passing it on" Im actually REJECTING him?Ugh.

I came to many realizations about myself this night though, and for that I am extremely gratefull. The sisters did look nothing short of fantastic.In fact, fantastic is an understatement, they were downright beautiful. From infancy I grew up around those fine looking sisters, 3+ times a week, NO WONDER I was such a horndog. Growing up as a teenager, the younger girls in my hall, and i imagine EVERY hall, pushed the limits on revealing clothing...The Society always discouraged it, but it was never for the young ones and the lasting impressions it would leave on the 5 year olds... I JUST realized it last night, I wonder if it ever even crossed the mind of a GB member before.

My procrastinatory ways seemed to manifest themselves, in the same way as having to get ready for the meeting growing up. Just like every other meeting night, 6 oclock rolled around and I came to the realization that I had to get ready soon. Apathy overtook me like I was driving in the slow lane. 6:00, 6:15, 6:30...tick tock tick tock, "You have to get ready". The memory of my Moms voice cut through me like Gordon Ramseys chef knife, "Kids, time to get ready!". The same thoughts that had swirled around my head for DECADES, "I really don't want to do this" returned.

While I discount the WT, i have yet to fully discount JC, and THAT is the only reason i went. Respect given for the very first time in my life. Next year, perhaps i will demonsttrate more and take another step in the right direction.

The sense of urgency IS gone. Thanks so much for that. You put words to a feeling I have felt for a very very long time.

kind regards, lrkr

178

Why is Jesus kept side stage ?

by iknowall558 in

john 5 :39 ' 40 "you study the scriptures, because you think that in them you will find eternal life.

and these very scriptures speak about me!

yet you are not willing to come to me in order to have life.

lurk3r

sorry to rant on your thread Iknowall....no disrespect intended. Guess this could be considered hijacking. Truth be known I couldnt hold it anymore, and already used my Topic thread.

lrkr

38

1 John 4:1 What is the JW and non JW take on this scripture? Thank you!

by lurk3r in

jw
friends

lurk3r

My original thoughts in posting this title, were to get opinions on whether the "spirit" talk was literal or not. Homerovah, I talked to an elder a long long time ago about this particular scripture, his interpretation was literal. Among the things he said was "there are spirits watching you...". For the record, he was a fine brother, and not an overbearing dictator. Through personal experience, his words have always stuck out in my mind...and I wondered if what he said was a JW thing or not. Where IS that dear Leo?

Amazing- thank you for bringing the Catholic view to my attention. It seems all religions like to claim scripture for themselves. I hope you can answer Blondie's question if ya get back here...

When i first read this scripture, years ago in the NWT, it was the "inspired expression" that raised an eyebrow. Looking in another bible to quench my curiousity left me even thirstier, as now that word was SPIRIT! whoa.

Sylvia, if I may, your reference,is the first time I ever seen it literally put to "everyone"...big difference in context. How did you come to refer to the bible you use?

Nark - I never knew there were no "chapter breaks" till your post. Thank you kindly. Thats really interesting too...who made the call on that one? Your post was very detailed and I could understand it still...thanks for articulating, and what your saying makes sense to me.

The NIV draws distinction in the "spirits" too. vs 2 gives a big "s". (holy spirit I presume) "This is how you can recognize the "Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowleges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God..." If we are going refer to the "spirit" as purely verbal expressions, then this doesn't make sense to me. There are too many people out there that acknowledge JC, that are "ungodly" and clearly cannot be from God. Does that make sense as a no brainer? At least with this translation?

Another reason that would think that these "spirits" mentioned in 1-4 are literal and not just "verbal expressions" , is because the wording in vs 4-6 is quite distinct from 1-3 and talks about "speaking" and "viewpoints" of the world. That sounds more like a verbal expression to me... I do not wish to lean on my own understanding though, anyone else care to elaborate or clarify further?

Thanks for this discussion peoples, it means a lot to me. Really.

lrkr

10

Shiny Wrappers; Rotten Candy

by cameo-d in

jw
friends

lurk3r

"Do you want to hear about my bottle collection?"

Hello CC.

While i know the comment was directed to another member CC, would you mind talking about your collection? I love old soda bottles and have one myself...from the 50's I think it is. I also have a 2 fluid oz bottle of " Coopers (triple test) CAMPHORATED OIL" that was made by the "Balsamea Medicine Company" and has a price on it of 25 cents. Even has a wooden cork in it and not a twist cap.

lrkr

178

Why is Jesus kept side stage ?

by iknowall558 in

john 5 :39 ' 40 "you study the scriptures, because you think that in them you will find eternal life.

and these very scriptures speak about me!

yet you are not willing to come to me in order to have life.

lurk3r

Reniaa.

Your actions here indicate your a sidestepping little harlot. Harsh words I know, considering I don't know you, but you are bottom of the barrel. What disgusts me most about your "approach", is it runs 100% contrary to your sworn allegience, the "Slave". How dare you come here and show your true colors and yet indentify yourself as a Witness. Your giving the rest of them such a terrible name in doing such...how can you bear it?

You are here for NO OTHER REASON than to tell everyone they are wrong, and at the heart of it, makes you a hypocrite, as you are unable to examine yourself. In typical fashion, you skirt the questions that contradict "your" viewpoints, and move on to that in which you are comfortable. You are unable to acknowledge the faults in which you yourself are a part of, in being so closed with regards the very aspects that could make you so very strong...set an example for the rest of your brothers if you wish to remain with them in proper spirit. Lean on Jehovah, by doing what he says and remove yourself from where he tells you NOT TO BE. Live the life before you preach it...otherwise no one is going to listen to your attempts of present futility.

I can't remember the last verse of last nights closing song...but your doing it. Your putting your "brothers" before Jesus, and making yourselves ALL look bad.

Quit pissing in our ears, and telling us it's raining.

lrkr

lurk3r

I have only one thing to say to you and your abusive unchristian words.

Matthew 7:5 (New International Version)

5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

Could you please just put your bible down for a minute and have a rational conversation? You have a lengthy retort to everything that you don't agree with, yet your scripture here has no bearing on my statements. I'm sorry for referring to as a harlot, as I bear you no ill will. I am flabbergasted with your approach though. . . With all due disrespect towards you and you alone, the vast majority of JW's live in ignorance; your ignorance is within your psyche as a result of being here, and you KNOW now. Your condoning the leading of a double life by this. You swear by the slave, yet ignore the advice given, yet you call my words unchristian. Whatever happened to actions speak louder than words?

I bear ya no ill will, and I hope you are able to hold your mental stability in place.

lrkr

178

Why is Jesus kept side stage ?

by iknowall558 in

john 5 :39 ' 40 "you study the scriptures, because you think that in them you will find eternal life.

and these very scriptures speak about me!

yet you are not willing to come to me in order to have life.

lurk3r

Reniaa.

Your actions here indicate your a sidestepping little harlot. Harsh words I know, considering I don't know you, but you are bottom of the barrel. What disgusts me most about your "approach", is it runs 100% contrary to your sworn allegience, the "Slave". How dare you come here and show your true colors and yet indentify yourself as a Witness. Your giving the rest of them such a terrible name in doing such...how can you bear it?

You are here for NO OTHER REASON than to tell everyone they are wrong, and at the heart of it, makes you a hypocrite, as you are unable to examine yourself. In typical fashion, you skirt the questions that contradict "your" viewpoints, and move on to that in which you are comfortable. You are unable to acknowledge the faults in which you yourself are a part of, in being so closed with regards the very aspects that could make you so very strong...set an example for the rest of your brothers if you wish to remain with them in proper spirit. Lean on Jehovah, by doing what he says and remove yourself from where he tells you NOT TO BE. Live the life before you preach it...otherwise no one is going to listen to your attempts of present futility.

I can't remember the last verse of last nights closing song...but your doing it. Your putting your "brothers" before Jesus, and making yourselves ALL look bad.

Quit pissing in our ears, and telling us it's raining.

lrkr

4

Did Jehovahs have to Destroy Jesus?

by VM44 in

i posted this in another thread, but i believe that the question is very important and deserves discussion in its own thread.. ****.

here is a question i have never seen asked, let alone answered.. it is claimed that jesus died and then god (three days later) resurrected him in a new spiritual body (according to the watchtower).. what about jesus before he came to earth?.

i would appear that god would have to destroy jesus, in effect killing him, beforing transferring the memories to an earthly body.. otherwise there would be two beings each calling themself "jesus", one in heaven, and the other on earth.. the above is not speculation, it follows directly from what the watchtower teaches.. .

lurk3r

beforing transferring the memories to an earthly body.

I can't open up my bible to see, but i don't recall Jesus ever having a "memory " of the life ebfore his earthly one. Is it in "the book" ?

Lastly, according to the Watchtower, Jesus is gone. He no longer exists. He is now Michael, the Archangel.

Hello saco. Are you sure about this?? I'm not saying your worng, BUT, "Jesus" is ruling since 1914, not "Michael". (according to wts theology) Has this changed?

10 threads a day just isnt cutting it for me....when do they get increased?

lrkr