HB

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Posts by HB

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  25

  Words in other languages which have different meanings to when we say them

  by The Nothing Man in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  does anybody know of any words, which are spelt and pronounced the same, which are used in other languages but which mean completely different things?

  as an example (which doesn't work i know) love in english means affection, but love in say, spanish, means hate?

  dumb example i know, but do you catch my drift?

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  HB

  The Russian word BOG means GOD.
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  53

  Why do most people not think?

  by llbh in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have just had a long conversation with a dear friend, and we came to the same conclusion most people do not really think.. he is 75 and is fizzing with ideas, got a phd at 60. in fractals( no have little idea what they are).

  for instance it was and is blindingly obvious to me that the price of oil would drop, it has a little.

  the reasons are simple and i am prepared to discuuss that if you want.. i have observed in relationships recently, my own included, that we ignore the what is happening, and often to our, and our familie's long term benefit.

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  HB

  I would imagine most posters on this board are, de facto, "thinkers" to some degree ~ that's why you are here. However I'm not sure if you will relate to the following or not, which is on a lighter note than some of the above posts.

  Non-thinkers may or may not be deep-down happier ~ but they do sometimes seem to have more fun, at least the non-religious ones. They skate across the surface of life without looking into the depths, untroubled by philosophy, ethics, Truth or the nature of reality.

  I remember very clearly the moment I discovered that it is not always helpful in all circumstances to be a deep thinker. One afternoon when I was a teenager, I watched a TV wildlife programme showing how birds and animals attract a mate by displaying, preening, calling, dancing, strutting, fighting and drawing attention to themselves, males trying to assert dominance and display strength and prowess and females being choosy and coy but also hoping to get noticed by the males.

  That evening I went to a noisy teenage party and when it was in full swing, I found myself analysing the reasons why I and all these other people had chosen to spending our time jumping around, flirting, posturing, hips gyrating to the music wearing fashionable clothes, jewellery, perfume and make-up (it was the '70s ~ some boys wore make up too!), and the scene became high comedy to me when I compared it to the wild-life film and saw the parallels between the two. I suddenly couldn't dance any more. I felt terribly self-conscious and ridiculous and it killed the spontanaity. (BTW I have never taken drugs and was not drunk.)

  I thought about how the people in the room believed they were so cool and sophisticated, but in fact they were behaving no differently to animals. I was watching them watching each other, aware of the unspoken sub-text going on behind everything that was happening. I was analyzing the reason why the girls were fiddling with their hair and the boys were standing legs wide apart playing imaginary electric guitars. It seemed all the weirder because my friends were not conscious of or thinking about the motives for their behaiour, they were just following their instincts.

  My thinking spoiled my evening, From then on I could not get rid of my self-aware thoughts and do what my friends were doing. I desperately wished I could be like the others and NOT THINK, but just mindlessly enjoy myself. I did not say anything as I felt sure no-one would have a clue what on earth I was on about if I tried to explain, even though my friends were all intelligent. They were just not in thinking mode, not analyzing, but just happily existing in the moment.

  It's an example of how I have found conscious thinking can occasionally be a bit of a disadvantage in some aspects of every day life. However when life is hit by problems, it is usually the thinkers who have the advantage.

  I'm not sure if anyone reading this will understand what I felt at the time or whether it was just me that was odd and in my own little world!

  Footnote: I am pleased to say I have over the years more or less learnt not to be a thinker all the time, so I can now enjoy dancing without caring if I am behaving like a baboon.
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  31

  No Girls Scout Cookies for you!

  by independent_tre in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  even though, i was raised in a witness home, i never remember hearing that girl scout cookies were a no-no.

  and even though i've only been baptized for a few years, i don't remember any specific admonishment of these sweet treats.

  but recently at work a jdub coworker made it a point to remind me that jw's do not buy or eat girl scout cookies.

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  HB

  I am a Guide Leader (UK equivalent to Girl Scouts) and have been in the Guide Movement for 45 years. I love it and am proud of it's achievements.

  In 1907 Lord Baden Powell (the founder) deliberately called his experiement the Scout Movement, not the Scout Organisation as he wanted it to move forward with the times and stay relevant to the youth of the future. Although the activities the young people get involved in are quite different nowadays to those of 100 years ago, the core purpose has not changed. Countless children and adults have benefitted all around the world. If only the Watch Tower Society could say the same! By being negative about Girl scout cookies they just make themselves look mean and foolish.

  Guiding and Scouting aim to give children and young people opportunities to try new things and expand their horizons, develop their skills and talents, learn to be good citizens, contribute to their local community, gain leadership skills and self-confidence at the same time as making new friends and having loads of fun. (This includes the adults - dangling upside down on an abseiling rope on rocks during a thunderstorm at camp was certainly a new experience for me!) I am just off now to set out a treasure hunt in the local woods ("The search for the Golden Tootle-Warbler") for my 36 Guides for our meeting tonight so am hoping it won't rain! In comparison what can the WTS claim they have done for children? Taught them to sit still during meetings?

  Incidentally if any of you are trying to make new friends outside the WTS and move on from the past I would highly recommend volunteering to help with the Scouts or Guides - you don't have to have previously been a member or have any special skills or experience and you will find it is a warm and friendly 'family' and will give you a real sense of fulfillment and you will know you are doing something worthwhile.

  Heather
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  30

  Do the religious have higher morals than the non-religious?

  by digderidoo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok, i was going to ask whether christians have higher morals, but i thought that other religions have the same kind of morals too.. when i look at those who sincerely follow their religion, i think that they do have a higher morality than those who do not follow some sort of scriptural guidelines.. this is not to say that the religious have a monopoly on morality, or to say that some religious people are not hypocritical in doing what they say, rather than what they do.

  but as a whole it seems to me that someone with a religious upbringing has higher standards than someone without.. now some would say that higher standards or lower standards are defined by society, so therefore by whose definition do they have higher morals.

  this would be a fair assumption.

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  HB

  I visited the USSR in 1973 when not only was it a secular state, but all religions were heavily suppressed. 'Morality' was taught to children by parents and schools and was based on innate human instincts and traditions passed down over generations rather than on written laws or religious teachings. I found the standard of morality there to be no different than in countries where religion is integrated into the fabric of society. Russia was supposed to be classless but of course it was not, and I did find that, as in the UK and I guess elsewhere, the working classes were in many ways more moral then the upper classes.

  I met lots of lovely people (I was studying the Russain language) and in Odessa I was invited to attend a meeting of an underground Christian 'church' that met secretly in someone's house. It was a group of about 20 mainly young students who were studying English. It was quite amazing as they did not even have a Bible, just a few type-written sheets of information and Bible texts sent to them from the West. The main reason they invited me was because they were desperate for more information about Christianity and they begged me to send them a Bible and any other literature I could when I got home. They based their whole attitude to morality on the text "Love thy neighbour as thyself" which I felt was a great way to live and they were very sincere about putting it into practice. Although I did eventually send out some Bibles (disguised as classic novels), I was rather diffident about it as I think they had probably already found an ideal basis for simple and pure morality without reading too much further and spoiling it with layers of dogma!
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  38

  Any actually embarrased to admit they were Witnesses?

  by Robert7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i was active, i was always (usually) proud to talk about being a jw, our faith, reasons for our stupid beliefs on birthdays, x-mas, etc.

  now with everything i'm going through, given how much of an impact this is to my life, i want to talk to others about it, like coworkers, and other friends.

  but thinking about how i would explain how it's a mind-controlling cult, i feel stupid for falling for it.

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  HB

  Speaking as someone who has never been a JW and knew almost nothing about the religion before March this year, (ie a worldly person), I am looking at this topic from a different perspective than most of you.

  Far from judging you as idiots or freaks for previously being taken in by this religion, I have the greatest respect for you. The crucial element as others have said, is that little word "EX" in front of the words "Jehovah's Witness". That word 'ex' should be worn metaphorocally on your forehead as a badge of intelligence and pride.

  For those who were born in or joined as children, you had no choice about what happened to you, but you deserve huge admiration for having the brains, courage and determination to get out, or to currently be in the process of doing so. Many of you have faced enormous challenges and overcome seemingly impossible obstacles to achieve your freedom. That deserves respect.

  For those who were converted as adults, you need to remember that you are not the only ones in the world that made a mistake, EVERYONE makes errors of judgement........... a bad career choice, an unwise financial investment, an unsuitable spouse, bad choice of friends etc. You just happened to choose the wrong religion, (I'm not saying there's a right religion, but hopefully you know what I mean!) I would guess that in almost all cases, you chose to join the JWs at a time when either you had not yet found your true identity and purpose in life and were searching for something, or at a time when your emotions were in control rather than your head. And now you have also seen the light and proved your intelligence, courage and determination. So please try not to feel ashamed or guilty - it's completely unnecessary!

  I suggest you could look on your JW years as if you have been on an gruelling journey to the Arctic where you developed snow-blindness and frost bite, became hopelessly lost for a time wandering on the ice in ever-decreasing circles, were cut off from the world, fell down deep crevasses, fought off agressive polar bears and almost starved, but in spite of all this you survived and reached civilisation and warmth again. You should be as proud to tell your JW story as an Arctic explorer would be to tell of his/her adventures. You have triumphed against all the odds and lived to tell the tale, and have a lot more to be proud of as a consequence than others who never had such difficult challenges in their lives.

  To those of you who are afraid to tell people about your past because you think no one who has not been a JW member will understand, just check that you are not holding on to vestiges of the WTS teaching that all worldly people are selfish and uncaring. From what I have seen, JWs are very judgemental and intolerant so if you are newly out of the religion, you may think that everyone else in the world is like that and will continue to treat you in the same way. Of course some worldy people are just as bad or worse than bigoted JWs but don't tar everyone with the same brush; in my experience most worldly people are very understanding and symathetic. Just don't dump everything about your past on them in one go and expect them to understand immediately. Some will be compassionate, some will be indifferent, but few if any will think you are stupid. If they don't show interest or empathise, it's their loss and you don't need to be ashamed.

  If you tell someone that you used to be a JW and there is an awkward silence or they change the subject, don't automatically assume they are judging you negatively, it's more likely that THEY are the one feeling inadequate and embarrassed as they don't know what to say. Some people are not comfortable discussing topics which are outside their own experience.

  Also they may be assuming that you are a "religious" person and therefore have very high moral standards and they are inwardly panicking that you are judging their less than perfect morals. A Methodist Minister I knew a few years ago told me that he was used to people asking him at social occasions what he did for a living and when he told them, it immediately killed the conversation. But he realised that often the silence was because they were suddenly conscious that a few moments before, they had sworn or told a dirty joke or something! He was good at quickly putting people at ease as he was not judgemental and could tell a few dirty jokes himself, but it's worth remembering this when you mention your past JW status.

  If you would feel confident enough in a relationship or social situation to tell someone what politcal party you would vote for then you should be ok telling them about your past religious membership.

  There will be many outsiders who are eager to know what your JW life was all about and have countless questions as I do. Sweet Pea was right when she wrote that many non JWs would be wide eyed and interested to hear about your experiences. I certainly am, it is fascinating although at times heart-breaking. She is also right that it is like learning about a secret society, a world that the rest us knows nothing about.

  A couple of months ago, the subject of cults came up (as it was in the news) at a dinner party I was at. It was an interesting discussion and in the course of it, I told the others what I had learned at that time about the JW religion. They were all fascinated and since then, as I have been learning more, five of the twelve who were at the dinner party have been asking me to pass on to them what I learn, as like me they are intrigued by what motivates people to believe such strange things. I found out that all of these 5 people have discussed the topic with other people at their work etc.

  One of the most common reasons for curiosity I have found is that a lot of people want to know one or two arguements they can use on the door-step if JWs call. They don't have time to spend time trawling the internet or want to research deeply but just want a couple of facts that are easy to remember so that rather than just saying 'no thanks' and closing the front door they can say something relevant. They are not on a crusade but the existence of cults offends many, (not sure if this applies more in the UK than the USA?) and they like to occasionally do their bit to counter irrationality. The grapevine works quickly, so JWs in service in this area had better watch out!

  So I would say to those of you dedicated to trying to bringing down the WTS or to helping as many JWs to see the light as you can, don't always avoid telling outsiders about the cult; in some cases we have access to tell the truth to JWs we know that you as apostates would not have. The JW that I am trying to help still talks to me although her study conductor has told her I am an "agent of Satan". But if I was an apostate, I am sure she would not be talking to me. I know my friend is embarrassed to tell people she is a JW to the extent that she is quite happy to lie about why she can't go to a birthday drink at the pub, so that gives me hope!

  In summary well done to those of you who are comfortable with your past and to those who are not YET, I hope one day soon you too will realise there is no need to be ashamed and I hope will find peace as you concentrate on having a great life in the present and the future.

  Love Heather
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  34

  How much does gas cost where you live?

  by reneeisorym in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was depressed yesterday because i put in the first $40.00 tank of gas.

  (i drive a toyota matrix -- i'm sure most people should think i should shut up now ...) .

  i was hoping you guys could make me feel grateful for only having to pay $40.

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  HB

  
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  50

  Struggling with the concept of a "God"

  by littleblueuk in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this topic, i'm sure, has been discussed many times, but today i am really contemplating the concept of god.. i remember vividly the old testament; the israelites slaughtering everyone in their path, men, women and children at god's direction at jericho, leaving no one alive.

  i remember thinking then as a child how cruel that was.

  there are many other examples.. then reading the news today i read a section in the world news about india.

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  HB

  Awakened07,

  Thank you for explaining clearly a concept which has been half formed in my head for a while but which I have not been able to put into words.

  What made me ponder was when I found out, in the process of researching my family tree, how many people we are each directly descend from. We have 8 Gt Grandparents and the number doubles each generation you go back, so we all descend from 4,194,304 twentieth Gt Granparents and so on.

  Back in the middle ages, i f just one of your 4 million+ direct bloodline ancestors as a child (or at least before they conceived the baby that became one of your 19th Gt Grandparents), had happened to step in front of an ox cart or whatever, and had been killed, you would not exist.

  The probability of any of us as individuals existing in our present form is incredibly small, but nevertheless, we are here.

  I do not personally believe there was an intelligent Being directing events and purposely bringing couples together from the beginning of time just to lead to my birth, or that this Being engineered my meeting my husband so that an as yet unknown individual will exist in another 20 generations. I feel that I am here by chance not Providence. (Do any Christians feel differently and feel you were destined to be born ever since time began?)

  That thought led me to consider that the reason all the other amazing things in the universe exist which at first seem to be too complex or well-designed to be a product of chance, could indeed be just that, chance.
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  17

  UK / USA opinion poll

  by HB in

  1. social
  2. current

  not sure - uk25% usa 11%.

  yes it is a sin - uk 5% usa 33%.

  yes it is a sin - uk 13% usa 40% .

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  HB

  A new opinion poll from YouGov has compared the US and Great Britain on a number of issues. It covers politics, social issues, troops in Iraq and Afganistan, free trade, globalisation, religion, immigration, the economy, etc etc.

  Interestingly, the most marked difference between the two nations is in relation to belief in God.

  I have copied a few excerpts here, but the full survey can be read at

  http://www.yougov.com/uk/archives/pdf/UK%20US%20topline%20comparison.pdf

  Do you believe there is a God?

  Yes I do - UK 39% USA 80%

  No I Don't - UK 36% USA 9%

  Not sure - UK25% USA 11%

  Do you believe that there is a Hell where sinners who do not repent their sins go when they die?

  Yes I do - UK 16% USA 54%

  No I don’t - UK 57% USA 27%

  Not sure - UK

  27% USA 19%

  How would you feel if the Prime Minister / President were an atheist?

  I would be delighted - UK

  11% USA 6%

  I wouldn’t mind - UK

  63% USA 28%

  I would be sorry - UK

  14% USA 31%

  I would be angry - UK

  2% USA 21%

  Don’t know - UK

  10% USA 14%

  Which do you think is more likely to be the correct explanation for the origin of life on earth?

  The theory of evolution - UK

  63% USA 30%

  The account of creation as told in the Bible - UK

  10% USA 40%

  “Intelligent design” – evolution has happened but by intelligent design - UK

  13% USA 19%

  Not sure - UK 15% USA 11%

  Do you regard sex between unmarried people as a sin or not?

  Yes it is a sin - UK

  5% USA 33%

  No it is not a sin but it is not generally desirable - UK

  22% USA 29%

  No it is perfectly acceptable behaviour - UK

  71% USA 34%

  Don’t know - UK

  2% USA 4%

  Do you regard homosexuality as a sin or not?

  Yes it is a sin - UK

  13% USA 40%

  No it is not a sin but it is not generally desirable - UK

  37% USA 27%

  No it is perfectly acceptable behaviour - UK 46% USA 26%

  Don’t know - UK

  4% USA 7%

  (I have added this one as I just read a thread on this topic.)
  On the subject of climate change do you think…

  The world is becoming warmer as a result of human activity - UK

  55% USA 49%

  The world is becoming warmer but NOT because of human activity - UK 25% USA 19%

  The world is NOT becoming warmer - UK

  7% USA 18%

  Not sure - UK

  13% USA 14%

  Although UK and USA contributors to JWD are probably not a completely representative sample of their respective nations, I have noticed some definite trends on this board showing opinions drawn along national lines . Makes for more interesting discussions!

  On a tangent, and national trends aside, the fact that ex JWs have such a wide range of opinions as seen on JWD proves that the Governing Body does not succeed in permanently re-wiring brains and creating all members into drones (or are they trying to create members in their Own image?). Once out of the cult, the previously supressed opinions of ex members are as diverse as the rest of society. A fact to celebrate!
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  43

  2012: The Year The Internet Ends

  by What-A-Coincidence in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://ipower.ning.com/netneutrality.

  06/01/2008 - every significant internet provider around the globe is currently in talks with access and content providers to transform the internet into a television-like medium: no more freedom, you pay for a small commercial package of sites you can visit and you'll have to pay for seperate subscriptions for every site that's not in the package.

  what can we do?internet providers have realized that the only way to not lose massive amounts of customers over this is to make sure there are no alternatives, that's why all major internet providers are currently making agreements and planning to switch simultaneously somewhere in the year 2012. this is currently all going on under very strict nda's (non-disclosure agreements) because the last thing they want is the masses speaking out against it.

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  HB

  I sent a link to this article to my son who works in the internet business and this was his reply: The article is vastly exaggerated and has facts wrong. At one point some of the big American ISPs were talking about trying to charge websites every time one of their users visited it (so that bit is the other way around). However the websites just threatened to block those users if they tried to put this into place (i.e. the intention being to make the users angry at their ISPs), so that idea was dropped. The other way around would never work as there'd always be one ISP which would stay out of the 'package' and thus attract everyone to join it. (Long live market forces!) Another less dramatic idea now exists - where big companies would pay ISPs to have a faster connection (e.g. Amazon's website would load quicker than a local website) however last thing I heard, a couple of the ISPs weren't going in on the idea either (in the hope they'd get extra customers by pointing out their average speeds are better) so I think that idea has started to collapse too. Plus, there are laws to contend with. This is what our government said: " The conclusion was that Net Neutrality laws in the UK would be "extreme... unattractive and impractical" and that it was "an answer to problems we don't have, using a philosophy we don't share" So don't panic.
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  20

  the day after armageddon

  by Crumpet in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  (this is creepy, funny and shocking so i thought i would share - sorry if its ever been posted before.

  ) parts 2-5 will follow!

  the diary of an .

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  HB

  There was an interesting programme on UK TV last night (Channel 4) entitled "Life After People". It discussed a hypothetical time-line of what would happen to the world if for some reason humans were completely wiped out. If I was a JW, the programme would worry me.

  Although theoretically speaking, immediately after a JW Armageddon, there would perhaps initially be a few million people left on earth, based on the ideas in this programme, this would not be enough to prevent the forces of nature taking control of most of the planet in a short space of time. I suppose JWs believe that Jehovah will take care of all problems, but in order to do so, He would have to change practically every known law of the universe including all weather systems.

  An example of the problems that would face survivors is that within two weeks of not being maintained, city subways and underground networks would start filling with ground-water. Currently, in New York City, 700 pumps shift 49,000 cubic metres of water out of the tunnels everyday; in London, 30,000 cubic metres are pumped out. If no one was around to operate the London flood barriers, it wouldn't be long before the whole city was under water. So the top brass JWs can forget their ideas of moving into Buckingham Palace.

  Everywhere there would be a population explosion of mice and rats eating all the rotting food in the houses and shops, and feral cats would be in their element. Forest fires would be left to burn out of control, and in the longer term, bridges, roads and all infrastructure would crumble if not maintained.

  It's a strange thought that someone who lived in the 1st century and was resurrected might have to learn to do some very 21st century tasks!

  The programme showed what has happened to a once beautiful town near Chernobyl that was evacuated only 20 years ago to illustrate how quickly buildings and civilisation disappears if not maintained.

  See http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/L/life_after_people/timeline/timeline.html