If the society did not have all the restraints and rules and door to door ministry they would probably have a lot more members. People in general do not like rules but they do like to have their ears tickled. All religions and the wts in particular try to make people think you can not be religious without being a member of their group. If the society did away with the door to door work I think they would grow like crazy.
Posts by logic
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36NY Times: "Bad times are good for churches." Why so little JW growth?
by Seeker4 inin today's ny times there is an article on this topic, and here are two quotes:.
"bad times are good for evangelical churches.
'its a wonderful time, a great evangelistic opportunity for us,' said the rev.
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43
People who actually listened to Kingdom Melodies outside the Hall
by JimmyPage indid you know people like this?
you get in their car and the kingdom melodies are playing on prerecorded piano... you go to their house and there they are in an orchestral arrangement... even when i was a complete believer i cringed when i had to hear this banal crap!
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logic
If you think listening to the meetings and the music is bad just try listening to video tapes of the crap. My wife has gotten them a few times when she could not get to the meetings. The kids screaming must be right under the tape player. Every thing else sounds like finger nails across a blackboard. I have to go outside so that it does not drive me nuts. A person really does have to be brainwashed to listen to it. I think that most of the jws that listen to this stuff are just trying to show how spiritual they are.
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Leave silently or loudly: that is the question
by Hiddenwindow insince the wt has always capitalized on secrecy, aren't we playing into their game when we leave silently?
wouldn't it be better to make as much noise as possible when leaving?
it would be of great help if each individual who leaves for matters of conscience or disagreement with doctrine wrote a letter to his entire congregation and family explaining his view on the issues.
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logic
One thing about fading quitely is you will still be able to talk to jws and your family. They may not think much of you but you will be able to show you did not turn into some kind of crazy so called worldly person. They will still treat you like you are 'weak' but who cares. This way they still have to deal with you and believe me it drives them nuts and sometimes you can get a little dig in there every once in while. I never bring anything up any more but when they say something negative about the society I will just make some short remark to make them think. That way you are not offending their watchtower senses. My wife now does not got to very many meetings and not out in service at all. I just tell her that she has to do what she feels right to her. I know deep down she knows the society has a truck full of problems.
I think it takes all kinds of methods to make a difference. For those that can the loud method is great. I like the old phrase used by submariners, ' run silient run deep'
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Revelation Jan 07-08 Week in review
by still_in74 insorry for the text format, i have this all in html with all kinds of formatting for emphasis but it keeps coming up error when i try to submit.. .
chapter 29. .
singing the triumphal new song.
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logic
When I was still going I asked my wife to explain what alot of this crap meant. She always has an excuse. Generally it is because I am just looking to put the society down. I just tell her that there is no way she can explain it because none of it makes any sense.
I have never had any jw explain why the society is the faithfull and discreet slave, why they were chosen by jesus in 1919, why does all the dates apply to jws, why none of the numbers match any of the dates , why the 144,000 are the governing body, why the society just says that something 'is' and cannot show it from the scriptures, why is it none of this chosen in 1919 can be proven from the scriptures. The reason that they cannot prove it is because they can't. Ask any jw to show that the society is the authority on this earth, they cannot. My wife has been a jw for 45 years and she can't do it. I could always explain it the way the society does but never from the bible.
I believe jws should be asked to explain what they are trying to cram down other peoples thoats. In other words put up or shut up.
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Interesting scans of new lit - 2009 WT, Oct 2008 KM, and a new tract
by DoomVoyager ini found these articles intriguing.
i'll let them speak for themselves.
the first is from the january 2009 wt; kool-aid edition; second from the october 2008 km, the last is a new tract.. oh, and i apologize for the poor lighting.
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logic
Just shows they are more interested in money than accurate information. There are so many changes scince 1992. They could care less if the information is correct. They didn't even give a date limit. I guess if you have a bunch of rutherford crap you can use that too. The society does not care as long as the jws just kiss thier xxx.
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the seventy year thing
by logic ini hate to keep bringing it up but i would to give the jws something to think about.
if the isrealites had done as god had told them, to serve babylon voluntairly as they had done in the beginning, then when would the seventy years of so called total devastation have began.
god said that only if they did not serve babylon that they would be destroyed.
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logic
Scholar , I love the way you never answer a question directly. That makes it easy for you to say you wern't wrong. But I still say you are not who you say you are, but I will still play along. So answer my question, if the isrealites had obeyed god would they have been devestated? I know that you know the answer. Did not god say they could stay on their land if they obeyed? And the second question . If they obeyed up untill one year before 539 how long would they have been devestated.
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the seventy year thing
by logic ini hate to keep bringing it up but i would to give the jws something to think about.
if the isrealites had done as god had told them, to serve babylon voluntairly as they had done in the beginning, then when would the seventy years of so called total devastation have began.
god said that only if they did not serve babylon that they would be destroyed.
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logic
Scholar, I usually read your post even though I never agree with anything you have to say. You express yourself well. I really do not believe you are who you say you are, I think you are a very experienced debater. A good debater has the ability to make things that are illogical to sound logical. If no one checks out the facts then it sounds reasonable. In my opinion I think you are a split personality possibly with identities on this site an others. You are too good at reversing the logic on both sides. What am I saying is I think you are two people on these sites and I consider you very good at it.
Your weakness as scholar is your lack of logic, you say things that just does not make sense to me. I myself am a very critical reader and check all my facts before I open my mouth. I actually think you do this to get more information out that actually proves the 587 date . It is in my opinion very clever of you. That is the reason I have read almost of your postings. I wont mention who I think your alter ego is, but you writings styles are very close to each to each other.
I actually want to thankyou for your efforts, because your scholar style makes it very clear that the 607 date is wrong. I think you are having a very good time with the whole thing.
My point with my post was , what would have happened if the isrealites had obeyed god. He did tell them that if they obeyed they would be able to stay on their land. In other words , lets say that they obeyed god right up to one year before 539 bc but then rebelled and caused the destruction fo jerusalem, while all the time they were serving babylon. How long would that make the desolation. In my math that would only be one year. You have to remember that other nations were subservient to babylon but were not desvated because they did what they were told.
I alreay foresee your reply, and it will probably be a good one. By the way I very seldon get into discussions on the net, I just dont have the time or the talent for it. You and others do just fine.
by the way I'm honored you even answered my post.
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41
Who else liked "The Rifleman"?
by Tired of the Hypocrisy ini grew up watching the rifleman and always loved it.
i wonder if they might bring it to the big screen like they have ironman and the hulk.
maybe tom selleck could pull off a decent lucas mccain??
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logic
I was a fan of all the old westerns. You can rent many of these from netflix. I recently finished the entire series of rifleman, have gun will travel, cheyene, rawhide, etc. They bring back the old days whether they are hokey or not. I also enjoyed playhouse ninety, suspicion, twilight zone, wanted dead or alive, lawman, wagon train, wyatt earp, the virginian, high chaperell, big valley, roy rogers, iron horse, to name a few. I think most of the stuff on t.v. now is stupid, but one of these days you younger ones will feel he same about them.
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the seventy year thing
by logic ini hate to keep bringing it up but i would to give the jws something to think about.
if the isrealites had done as god had told them, to serve babylon voluntairly as they had done in the beginning, then when would the seventy years of so called total devastation have began.
god said that only if they did not serve babylon that they would be destroyed.
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logic
I hate to keep bringing it up but I would to give the jws something to think about. If the isrealites had done as god had told them, to serve babylon voluntairly as they had done in the beginning, then when would the seventy years of so called total devastation have began. God said that only if they did not serve babylon that they would be destroyed.
Up untill 587 they did ok. They were able to stay on the land like they were promised. If they had obeyed this devastation think would not even be important. The society ignores the fact that the city did not need to be destroyed. They even got a repreive in 589 when they rebelled, they still got to stay on the land.
When looked at the whole thing in this light it is obvious that the seventy years and the devastations were two different things, the seventy years were absolute but the devastations were not. No matter whether they obeyed or not they would serve babylon for seventy years. The isrealites choose the hard way.
That is the problem with most of the societys 'teachings' , they are illogical.
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36
Did You Have Respect For The Elders In Your Hall?
by minimus inone day after a sunday meeting, 2 elders got into it with each other and started screaming at one another in the back of the hall just as service arrangements were being made.
of course, the boe counseled them strongly but the result was that the congregation lost respect for the whole body.
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logic
I have respect for some of the elders that I know, as people, but not as elders. I had a real problem with the elder arrangement as the society sees it. The elders think they have authority over you, but they don't. I think you have to take alot on yourself to think you have the very great responsibility to advise other people as to what is right or wrong. I have never met any elder that I thought was living a life style that made it possible for him to give me advice. I am not saying that I do not look at other peoples way of living as an example. But I do not like people who have the audacity to assume that they have the expertise to tell me how to live. The society lies like the proverbial dog and their actions have screwed thousands of people over. Yet they still assume the position of authority over the spiritual well being of their fellow man. The society likes the scripture 1 peter 5:5,6 but they skim over 1 peter 5:1-4. Other scriptures show that elders serve the congregation , not the other way around. I know we hear that from the podium but it is not practiced.