i am curious, what amount people on this board from their experiences of being a baptised & active jw and their subsequent exit from the jw org (for whatever reason or reasons) are now either agnostic, atheist or do some actually still believe in god?.
your honest answers please.. lfcv.
Interesting that nobody seems to believe in an evil god, who made us for the sole purpose of watching us suffer... Either he's some all powerfull father figure who wants to make you immortal or he doesn't exist.
Just a thought.
Anyways I say he doesn't exist. So I'm an atheist.
LtCmd.Lore
crazy can't get online, and jwd is a real support system to her right now.. i talked with her a few minutes ago on the phone......... and she is going to call me tomorrow.. her mom is driving her nuts, she is ready to make a change in her life........and i am asking you to encourage her, as she is being very couragious right now.
i am proud of her.
she is going to call tomorrow and i would like to be able to read some wonderful things to her from her friends at jwd!!!!!.
Hey Crazy, I hope things go better for you soon. Don't let your mother break you. (Like I have to tell you that, I already know you have a strong will.)
Why does it always seem to be the mothers??? Just wonderin...
LtCmd.Lore
ok, first of all i would like to point out that i don't fall for the lousy story of the canopy being over the earth before the flood, thus nullifying any carbon dating that dates back more that 5000 years.
but the witnesses do, so therefore it may become neccasary to confront them on it.. so here's the question.
and it may seem like a stupid one to anyone who knows anything about the subject: if there was a canopy of water covering the earth interfering with the radiation... wouldn't it reduce the amount of radiation reaching the surface, therefore making the carbon atoms degradate at a slower pace instead of faster?
OK, great, thanks HAL9000 I just learned more about carbon dating from you than in the 17 years I've been a witness, plus the 12 years I've been in school.
ok, well, mom called.. she left a message.
my cphone got saturated with chocolate milk and the screen is no longer working, and the battery is not charging right.
(blame it on the kids) so i didn't know she had called.
http://www.cpsr.org/issues/privacy/ssn-faq/
I'm definately not an expert, but my parents have my ssn, I kind of wish they didn't but they do... and I think most parents do, in fact I'm not sure why yours doesn't.
LtCmd.Lore
ok, first of all i would like to point out that i don't fall for the lousy story of the canopy being over the earth before the flood, thus nullifying any carbon dating that dates back more that 5000 years.
but the witnesses do, so therefore it may become neccasary to confront them on it.. so here's the question.
and it may seem like a stupid one to anyone who knows anything about the subject: if there was a canopy of water covering the earth interfering with the radiation... wouldn't it reduce the amount of radiation reaching the surface, therefore making the carbon atoms degradate at a slower pace instead of faster?
OK thanks guys, I knew the society couldn't be telling the whole truth... But now I'm curious, you mentioned the tree rings... I didn't know there even WERE any trees that old... I thought the oldest trees in existence are 3000 years or so.
Wouldn't the very fact that a tree was alive during the flood, prove that it didn't happen?
LtCmd.Lore
edited to add: It just occured to me that there are pertrified trees out there, which could be pretty darned old.
you surely noticed that the jw's have an answer to everything.. question: my dad died.
jw answer: he will probably resurrect .
question: i don't feel well.
I may lose my job. What should I do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
I lost my job. What should I do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
I still don't have a job. What should I do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
My wife just lost her job. What should we do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
My wife and I have been out of work for 3 months and now the bank's taking the house. What should we do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
We're living out of our car. What should we do?
Response: Pray to Jehovah.
We're staying at a Salvation Army shelter. What does this mean?
Response: It means your prayers have been answered.
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
LtCmd.Lore
ok, first of all i would like to point out that i don't fall for the lousy story of the canopy being over the earth before the flood, thus nullifying any carbon dating that dates back more that 5000 years.
but the witnesses do, so therefore it may become neccasary to confront them on it.. so here's the question.
and it may seem like a stupid one to anyone who knows anything about the subject: if there was a canopy of water covering the earth interfering with the radiation... wouldn't it reduce the amount of radiation reaching the surface, therefore making the carbon atoms degradate at a slower pace instead of faster?
OK, first of all I would like to point out that I don't fall for the lousy story of the canopy being over the earth before the flood, thus nullifying any carbon dating that dates back more that 5000 years. BUT the witnesses do, so therefore it may become neccasary to confront them on it.
So here's the question. And it may seem like a stupid one to anyone who knows anything about the subject: IF there was a canopy of water covering the earth interfering with the radiation... wouldn't it REDUCE the amount of radiation reaching the surface, Therefore making the carbon atoms degradate at a SLOWER pace instead of faster? And that therefore would make things seem YOUNGER from carbon dating not older....Right?
So if scientists believe that a dead life form in a pyramid is 9 thousand years old ... they would be wrong like the witnesses say, however it would be older than that, not younger.
Does the average witness know so little about carbon dating? Or am I the one at error here? I'm just asking, in case we have any scientists here. But it seems so obvious.
LtCmd.Lore
genesis 3:15 states " i shall put enmity between you and the woman and between your seed and her seed.
" " he will bruise you in the head and you will bruise him in the heel.".
i did some meditating on this scripture and came to the realization that this prophecy could have somehow been misinterpreted.
As with pretty much every other bible prophecy, it's so darn vauge it's impossible to disprove.
Here's my prophecy...
"The quail will been eaten by the cat, the cat has indigestion. Soon the cat will die and the mice will rejoice for 40 days."
OK now it's up to you do determine who/what the quail symbolizes and who/what the cat symbolizes, and who/what the mice symbolize. And how long the 40 days really are, since they may not be real days, or they may simply be symbolic. And what the period of indigestion stands for. And did the cat have indigestion before, after or during consuming the quail.
This could be applied to pretty much any event in human history, or future. And if, by some remarkable coincidence, this cannot be applied to ANY event in the whole of human existence. Then it can be applied to some invisible heavenly event... The bible prophecies are meaningless, nobody seems to know what they meen untill after they happen, and even then there is dispute over whether that's what it was talking about or not.
But anyways, back to the topic at hand. This prophecy might not have anything to do with satan at all, the scripture said that god was talking to the serpent. It didn't mention Satan. Also Satan never did anything to Jesus, it was gods own chosen nation that had him executed... so was satan in control of gods chosen nation? If so, that's not saying much for god.
LtCmd.Lore
LtCmd: Your premise could be flawed, even if allegedly basing your supposition about God on the bible. On what basis do you think we should be able to live forever if there is a God? The bible even speaks of a goal of attaining 120 years in good health.
You have a point there, I was still thinking like a dub, and forgot that most people believe that they will go to heaven. And that they were never supposed to live forever. So some of the things I said would only work on someone who believes the JW interpretation of the bible.
So I'm at a loss as to what to say to you, unless you care to tell me what you believe, or why you believe it... I could point out errors in the bible, but if you don't think the bible is infallible that would be meaningless. I could point out areas in which god totally changed his mind about laws, but that would be meaningless depending on what you believe. I could show you times when god made really unloving, unjust or stupid decisions, but if you don't believe that god is all loving, powerfull, just and wise then that would also be meaningless.
Like I said before, I can't debate every possible belief in god, and some are just so darn vauge that there is nothing to be said about them. But the more vauge they are it seems the less reason there is to believe them.
But if I give just one ounce of proof that indicates he doesn't exist, that's still infinitely more than proof than I've ever heard in his favor.
LtCmd.Lore
I think we ALL know that there is no way to prove that god doesn't exist...
In fact if the theist is a complete brain case, he could believe that the entire universe was created two days ago, and god just made everything seem like it has been here for millenia. And there would be no evidence against that claim. or the claim that fairies exist, or invisible pink unicorns...
But unless the theist is that stubborn, there are a bunch of things that would support the claim that god doesn't exist:
Like the flaws in design, if I was supposed to live forever, why do I only have two sets of teath? If I was never supposed to get ill, why do I have a cough reflex, or have and immune system? If all the carniverous animals are supposed to eat grass, how will the earth not be over infested with bunnies? If the earth is supposed to be inhabited forever, why is the moon, slowly getting farther and farther from the earth? If there was no big bang, why are the gallaxies all moving away from a central point in the universe?
Obviously all of these things dispute the belief in the god spoken of in the Bible. Lot's of people make up their own definitions of god, but I won't even attempt to dispute these because as I said, they are made up and therefore if I came up with something that indicates they don't exist the person will just change his definition of god to prove me wrong... sorry your on your own with that.
But ask yourself: Do you believe in god because it's logical to do so, or do you believe in god because you want to?
If you want to believe in god that's your problem, but personally I think the whole concept is flawed.
LtCmd.Lore
