Posts by Confession

38

My story of abuse and disappointment.

by ackack in

i was raised in as a jw, and got batpz at 16. i started pioneer at 18 and got married when i was 21. i was made an ms at 22, and was soon giving many parts.. my brother who was also a pioneer, eventually stopped, even stopped going to meetings.

he placed a doubt in my mind about 607. he simply told me to look at the kingdom come book appendix.. i looked at the material and was ablt to rationalize it in my mind as secular vs. biblical chronology (which is a gross oversimplification).

as well, i knew some things being done within the orginization didn't sit very well with me.

Confession

Ackack,

Let me tell you, Sir, I can relate. Absolutely. I know what it's like to have an abusive wife, and I know what it's like to get looks from family and friends in the organization who look at you like it's probably your fault. When a female in the congregation leaves her husband because of abuse so many arms reach out to her, but if you're a male? Ha!

"Don't you know how to handle your wife, boy? What's wrong with you? Have you ever stopped to consider that maybe you are causing the problem somehow?" Sometimes people would even laugh when I told them about the abuse. Once in a great while someone would see how she was capable of behaving. Then they seemed to get a clue, and become understanding.

Actually I see this as a problem with society in general. Quick to accuse the male of abuse--hesitant to do likewise with the female.

37

most hated analogies

by googlemagoogle in

we've already got some "most hated" threads on here, like "most hated bible verse" or "most hated meeting", don't know if there's another thread on metaphors/analogies.

one of the most used analogies used is the "jehovah's like a loving father holding your hand and leading you, you can trust him like a little child trusts his father".

i don't know how often i heard that one.

Confession

Rebel8, I'm still chuckling over your comment...

girls in puberty = cows

LOL. What are you talking about?

It's funny how, as time elapses, I remember the little flashpoints I used to experience. The sheep thing used to get me too. I used to think, "Why do we keep saying we're looking for "sheep-like, teachable" people? I mean, aren't there lots of different personalities? Didn't Jehovah make all of them--and don't we need all of them? Just because someone doesn't easily submit to being "teachable" BY US, does that really mean Jehovah will reject them?"

61

On a macro level, the Witnesses are pretty harmless

by logansrun in

jw
friends

warning: this post may be damaging to your biases.. it seems to me that the "danger" the witnesses pose to larger society is, well, pretty damn small.

just think about it: the witnesses are almost not involved in politics at all, except the occassional "freedom of religion and speech" issues they take to various courts, issues i am happy to support the witnesses in, even if i strongly disagree with their beliefs.

you will not see jws supporting banning abortions or gay marriages or a whole host of other civil liberties and freedoms that evangelicals rally around like the village people searching for frankenstein's monster.

Confession

Many times in this forum I've tried to present what I feel has been a balanced perspective regarding this organization. For instance, I dislike it when I read posts that say things like, "They're all so unloving. None of them really cares." (Insert your own sweeping generalization.) I've also tried to be balanced in admitting that there are some things I can be grateful for, having been raised as a JW. While there are no guarantees, the group encourages kids to be involved in activities associated with the congregation and family. As Tom Cabeen once told me, 'I was protected from a lot of bad things. A lot of kids I grew up with got involved in crime and drugs.' And, although I understand others may have had different experiences, personally I feel I was brought up in an environment quite free of racism. I appreciate not being saddled with negative racial stereotypes--as so many non-JWs are. Loganrun has also mentioned some fairly positive things about the organization.

But, of all the comments I've read in this thread, the one Pole made hits me the strongest...

As a person coming from a post-totalitarian state I get anxious when hearing the "macro" argument. It smacks of cynical totalitarianism.

Using the "macro level" argument I can argue that the David Korash cult was much less harmful than the WTS.

Using this macro vs. micro level argument I can also state that sex slave traders and mafia hitmen are no serious threat to society "on the macro level." A very, very small percentage of human beings in society will ever actually be exposed to the dangers they pose. Now before you go saying something like, "It's absurd to compare JWs to such people," let me remind you of your premise:

So, when it comes to greater society -- which, of course, is far and away mostly people who have never been JWs -- the Witnesses pose no real threat at all... It's only on the micro-level -- on current JWs and ex-JWs -- that the Watcthower can have a negative effect.

The great majority of all persons probably do not personally know a person kidnapped into sex slavery--nor do they know anyone murdered by a mafia hitman. So "it's only on a micro-level" that they can have a negative effect.

And, even then, I sometimes wonder where some JWs would be if they didn't have a worldwide organization telling them how to sneeze. Some people are better off in a cult.

I'm sure the families involved in organized crime feel the same way. Aren't many of them in families that are loving and normal in many ways. Don't you think such individuals ever do much good for those around them? And I can guarantee you many of them feel they're "better off."

If you don't like my comparisons, try and remember some of yours. Saying something like, 'Well at least they're not trained assassins" is something you can say about a great number of evil people. Yes, if you want to take things to "the macro level" the JWs are pretty insignificant. But regardless of any of the things you and I can admit might have been positive, I am also faced with the fact that they are guilty of gross deception and manipulation--while representing themselves as the sole messengers of God on earth. Knowing that they will happily rip families and friendships apart in order to maintain their authority makes them pretty evil in my book. And this has not happened to, as you put it, just "a few families."

45

That Voice...My Story

by Confession in

why doesnt he just talk to me later?

i dont really talk about this much, but i just dont get it.

he seems confident that eventually ill understand him.

Confession

Hey, Cali!

Thanks for the note. Sorry I haven't responded to your e-mail...I'm going to do that now.

4

women's intuition?

by onintwo in

jw
friends

ok, can someone, maybe women in general, tell me what this one is all about?

the dictionary seems to indicate it means "arriving at a conclusion without any reasoning".

what, just sort of a gut feeling?.

Confession

Some like to think of intuition as a magical power. In reality what is at the heart of intuition is miniscule data. A person known to be particularly "intuitive" is someone who has learned to get in touch with such data. Perhaps they are good at detecting lies. Whether they realize it or not, they have picked up on certain cues provided by people throughout their lives who they know have lied. Maybe it is a tone of voice, an eye movement, facial tic... The possibilities are truly endless.

From my study of human temperament, it's clear that women are generally more intuitive than men. What this means is that about two thirds of women are more intuitive than they are concrete. But it's also true that one third of them are less intuitive and more concrete, and roughly one third of men are more intuitive. So it's certainly not across the board.

I've known and paid close attention to highly intuitive people--men and women--for years. They certainly have some advantages--but I'm convinced it can also cause them problems. The problem with many highly intuitive people? They are right just enough of the time so that they get to thinking they're ALWAYS right. And they're not. No one is. Example...

HE: Well it was nice to get together with Bill and Sue tonight.
SHE: Did you see the dirty look Sue gave me?
HE: Dirty look? Uh, no...
SHE: Oh yes, she very definitely gave me a dirty look.
HE: Are you sure? Look Sue was happy to see you; remember how she gave you a big hug?
SHE: And I know why she gave me that dirty look too...
HE: Do tell.
SHE: She's mad at me because I didn't go to the movies with her that time.
HE: The movies? That was like eight months ago!
SHE: I know--can you believe how she just can't let it go?

Now sometimes she's right, but sometimes she's not. And the problem with many highly intuitive people is they remember all the times they were right in their intuition--but often forget or dismiss all the times they were wrong.

45

That Voice...My Story

by Confession in

why doesnt he just talk to me later?

i dont really talk about this much, but i just dont get it.

he seems confident that eventually ill understand him.

Confession

Zulukai, I really enjoyed reading your comments. Yes, indoctrinated we were. In the classic sense. Glad to see you found your way out of mind prison. I'm still trying to get used to life out here myself.

9

Do Not Be a Victim of Propaganda!

by stevenyc in

.

this is recommended reading for anyone scared to venture into looking at the foundations of the watchtower..

Confession

It's great to read stuff like this from the Watchtower Society. Not unlike an '84 Watchtower...

[Awake, November 22, 1984, “An Open or a Close Mind—Which Do You Have?”]

A necessary part of life is that we make decisions and reach judgments. But decisions made "without due examination" or judgments reached "on other grounds than reason or justice" are evidences of a closed mind.
Having an open mind, on the other hand means to be receptive to new information and ideas. It means being willing to examine and to evaluate information without a biased attitude. By retaining what is worthwhile and rejecting what is worthless, we can reach definite conclusions on a solid basis. A closed mind may betray a lack of interest in the subject matter, or a reluctance to look into the matter. ... If we are unable to defend our religious views, we may find ourselves lashing out against those who challenge our beliefs, not with logical arguments, but with slurs and innuendoes. This smacks of prejudice and of a closed mind... An open mind can serve to your advantage, a closed one will almost certainly serve to your detriment.

Then there was the Truth book...

[The Truth That Leads to Eternal Life, 1968, p. 13]

We need to examine, not only what we personally believe, but also what is taught by any religious organization with which we may be associated. Are its teachings in full harmony with God's Word, or are they based on the traditions of men? If we are lovers of the truth, there is nothing to fear from such an examination.

This is certainly an admirable position: a religious organization teaching that we should all have nothing to fear in examining “any religious organization with which we may be associated.” They emphasize how important it is to separate ourselves from organizations that “teach falsehood,” and to have an “open mind” in examining our religion. But does the WTS apply these same positions to the examination of their own religion?

[Watchtower 1986 March 15 pp.10-15 “Do Not Be Quickly Shaken From Your Reason”]

7 Now, what will you do if you are confronted with apostate teaching—subtle reasonings—claiming that what you believe as one of Jehovah's Witnesses is not the truth? For example, what will you do if you receive a letter or some literature, open it, and see right away that it is from an apostate? Will curiosity cause you to read it, just to see what he has to say? You may even reason: 'It won't affect me; I'm too strong in the truth. And, besides, if we have the truth, we have nothing to fear. The truth will stand the test.' In thinking this way, some have fed their minds upon apostate reasoning and have fallen prey to serious questioning and doubt.

Here's where the tables turn. This advocating of a completely open, honest policy regarding the examination of what we believe--or new information presented to us--ONLY applies to religions other than that of the Watchtower Society. Here they clearly teach a different policy: if someone approaches you with information "claiming that what you believe as Jehovah's Witnesses is not the truth," it MUST be "apostate reasoning." Hypocrites.

And what of this term "subtle reasonings?" Where is the objection to subtle reasonings? Surely their problem is not with the word "reasoning," so it must be with "subtle." The American Heritage dictionary defines it as..."Able to make fine distinctions: a subtle mind." What's wrong with that? Doesn't the bible encourage us to develop our powers of discernment? Or is it one of the alternative meanings of subtle: "Crafty or sly?"

Heck, this new article even uses the word itself!

A person with discernment perceives subtleties of ideas or things and has good judgment. Using discernment, we will be able to recognize those who are merely using "smooth talk and complimentary speech" in order to "seduce the hearts of guileless ones." (Romans 16:18) Discernment enables you to discard irrelevant information or misleading facts and distinguish the substance of a matter.

So we CAN perceive subtleties! Why then does the Watchtower Society teach JWs that they shouldn't even listen to those who present information that differs from theirs? We should not even allow our curiosity to let us read something about it.

No matter what the Society writes about open-mindedness, you may rest assured that every word comes with it an implied asterisk...

*This of course would not apply to us.

67

Our Own Conference

by Valis in

jw
friends

i know there are conferences that xjws attend, but since i ran accross joy castro's writings and new book today it got me thinking about the subject.

something non-religious in nature.....well as non religious as xjws can get anyway lol.

i think it would be cool if we could have people like her, kimberly norris, bryan, donald, and so many of the others that have done stuff for us.

Confession

Valis, this sounds like a great idea. I'm in. My first thought is some place centrally located--like St. Louis. But it would probably be best to find the destination that's least expensive by air. Where would that be?

45

That Voice...My Story

by Confession in

why doesnt he just talk to me later?

i dont really talk about this much, but i just dont get it.

he seems confident that eventually ill understand him.

Confession

Thank you, Miss Peaches... And, yes, I am actually a writer. Although I regularly write radio and television commercials--I enjoy writing pieces like "That Voice" considerably more. I'm glad to hear you related to it.

23

Share a Story...

by misspeaches in

i really enjoy reading the stories/experiences you guys all post on here from your jdub days..... the funny, ridiculous, ironic ones make me laugh but reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. the hurtful, sad, mean ones make me hurt as well but again - reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. the scandals that go on - well same again - they reinforce in my mind that i've done the right thing by leaving that organisation.. i do appreciate the time you all take in writing down your stories and will never tire of reading them.

so if you have a story you haven't relayed here before because it is didn't seem relevant to a thread i would love to read it!.

cheers - miss peaches

Confession

Miss Peaches, I told a story this past week that a lot of people told me they enjoyed. Be forewarned though--it's long!

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/7/96377/1645996/post.ashx#1645996