New! SATANIC IMAGES in Knowledge book! What do you think?

by Dogpatch 106 Replies latest jw friends

  • TonyT

    I thinkj its a stretch.

  • drwtsn32

    I don't buy it...

  • Satanus

    Mirroring the image, putting them side by side, and turning them upside down?? Come on.


  • Triple A
    Triple A

    It would be interesting to know, from an official source, what the probability of the images be made by chance is.

    If this was the only picture that had subliminal images and the only one that mirror images are used I would be very sceptical. But it is not.

    I would not use the subliminal images as a sole arguement against the WTBTS, but it could be used as one more nail in the coffin.

    As far as the site itself. It is hard to read and I kept wondering what subliminal images were hidden it's background. The subject matter jumps in the deep end of the pool. Having read Derek Barefoot's book before looking at this site allowed me to wade in from the shallow end. Making it more believable.

    I also kept asking myself, how would this be used in a court of law.

  • Quotes

    If you look hard enough for a pattern within a huge amount of raw data, it is likely you will find the pattern you are looking for.


    • Drosnin's "Bible Code" finding pretty much anything you want to find in the bible

    • Watchtower's finding 1914 in the bible

    • Born-Again Bible-Thumper's Hidden Demonic Faces in Watchtower pictures

    Some of the earlier "faces" were much more likely, and didn't require folding, mirrors, etc. But even then, it was a stretch. This one only tells me that someone has too much unstructured free time.

    ~Quotes, of the "Studying Pin Up Calendar Girls To Find the Hidden.... Meaning" class
  • Corvin

    " . . . don't you think Ray Franz would have mentioned this in his books were it true the society uses/used such tactics? No high ranking desenter from the Organisation has ever substantiated with any kind of facts in any way they do this......which they would have if it were true.


    I have done a bit of research on this, gumby, and this is the deal with Ray Franz not mentioning anything about it in his books.

    Prior to 1983, most of the WTBTS publications were printed using the 2-color method. I am agreed that anything printed back then using the 2-color method could easily be attributed to printing anomalies. Ray Franz resigned from the Body in the spring of 1980, and therefore would not be in any position to write honestly about the subject.

    1983 was an important year for Bethel with regard to their printing, art and photography departments. They not only asked our own Dave Malone to come and consult for the art and photography departments, to improve the overall quality of those departments, but they also were awaiting the arrival of a new state-of-the-art laser system. The June 22, 1983 issue of the AWAKE! magazine touts their new lazer system called, Laserite-V, which will, among other things, speed up their production cycle. A few days after the Laserite-V arrived, a companion piece of equipment, the Autokon 8400 arrives. The WTBTS states:

    An Electronic Artist "A few days after the excitement of safely placing the Laserite-V on the seventh floor in the Graphics Department a companion piece of equipment arrived, the Autokon 8400. It is another laser system, a tool that does many things conventional cameras do but in a faster, simpler, less costly and more flexible way. This machine produces many special effects that are difficult to achieve with conventional cameras. Autokon uses only helium-neon laser beams to reproduce artwork on film or in digital form for storage in a computer memory system for later use. Its laser scanning system "reads and records" photographs and different types of artwork, and then transforms what it sees into digital information. While Laserite-V reproduces complete pages for offset printing plates, Autokon speeds up the production of artwork that is included in pages scanned by Laserite-V . . . Yes, the laser was used in the preparation of this magazine. "

    With the WTBTS now catching up with modern printing technology, and since the WTBTS firmly denies the use of subliminal or hidden images in their artwork, as of mid to late 1983, "accidental" objects and "discolorations" or "drop-outs" or "fill-ins", and "printing anomalies" that people see as subliminal images would never again be the cause of controversy or stumbling.

    So, while the WTBTS has taken care of those pesky little unintended anomalies that kooks like myself point to as "hidden images", why is the subliminal and hidden image controversy still floating? Apparently because the WTBTS is utilizing and/or allowing hidden and not so hidden images in their publications such as zodiacal symbols, faces, skulls, phantoms, gargoyles, satanic references and emblems, FreeMasonry and Illuminati symbology, ancient pagan philosophers and dark cloaked figures that are a stretch of the imagination to see ONLY if you happen to be blind. Because of the new lazer and digital equipment being used by the WTBTS, the hidden and subliminal images can no longer be dismissed as "printing anomalies". What you see in the more recent printed material is about as close as you can get to looking at the original with very little loss of quality and detail.

    The "Live Forever", first published in 1981 (4-color printing), contains many illustrations containing controversial imagery. There is not one single controversial image/illustration in that book that the WTBTS has ordered retouched in order to quail the controversy. The illustrations have stayed as-is for 23 years. It would take an inexperienced Photoshop user like myself a whole 60 seconds to retouch any one of the images to ensure that the images are not misconstrued by the members and/or worldly folks. They have not made one attempt to fix these images.

    Here is one they did retouch, which at least partially makes a valid point and ads some credibility to the hidden-subliminal controversy:

  • Sunspot

    **I see it as a distraction from what needs continually to be focused on.

    But don't you think that this IS something that should be focused on along WITH everything else questionable about this evil organization?

    If there ARE all these Satanic and Occult symbols being placed in the publications (which I believe is the case) we have to wonder "WHY"? What is really "going on" through the pages of the WTS literature? They are VERY clever and manipulative and I can't dismiss these images (that I have seen for myself) as happenstance.

    I am of the opinion that the WTS is a very insideous and dangerous organization and will stop at nothing to deceive people, including "planting" weird images in their mandatory reading material. I think there is a LOT more going on behind the scenes than we have any idea about---and will poo-poo it when it stares us right in the face, thinking...nahhhh they wouldn't do THAT.

    I think that they WOULD..........and have........and ARE.

    Just my 2cents of course

  • Balsam

    You know I think the web-page listed in the beginning is a stretch. This attributing something evil is as bad as the WTS thinking demons and satan are lurking around.

    Personally I think we'd all be better off if people quit thinking that Satan & Demons even exist. Personally I don't anymore, along with not believing the bible is the word of God. This whole concept of trying to explain good and evil is what got men in trouble in the first place.

    I think these so called Satan images in the publications is just silly if they are there, and silly for people to be looking for them. What the heck difference does it make.

  • Corvin
    I think these so called Satan images in the publications is just silly if they are there, and silly for people to be looking for them. What the heck difference does it make.

    While it has not been proven that subliminal imagery has any sort of effect on a person's subconscious, there are some who really do believe that it works to motivate or effect humans on some level, and therefore, they use the technique in their works . . . and just incase it does work, they put the hidden or subliminal references in the artwork. Some companies actually do use hidden and subliminal imagery just in case it does have an influence on the viewer, and they do spend no little money on it.

    So, what's the difference? The difference would be intent. If by planting subliminal or hidden images in the WTBTS publications, the artist or governing body intends to effect or add to the members' fear of Satan, demons, etc., then we can conclude that the WTBTS is attempting to influence its members on a deeper subconscious level. It was not silly to either the artist nor the WTBTS to plant and allow the images to remain in a 23 year old publication such as the "Live Forever" book unretouched. Just this one publication alone, with all its creepy hidden imagery, gives weight to the idea that it is deliberate on their part, and when I think about what their intent might be, it is not so silly to me.

    Kind Regards,


  • karly

    I think alot of the images are a stretch and would be silly to prove. But this image really bothered me. I checked in a bound volume and found it there as clear as day. It made clear in my mind the years since birth I have experienced of built up fear of displeasing Jehovah (which is really displeasing a man-made organization who claims to speak for Jehovah). I keep this image in mind as a visual to remind me of the depth of fear inspiring tactics the WT uses to control its members. It may not speak to you but it spoke volumes to me. This image came years after the rumor article and I think that the Governing body should have caught it if they did not approve of subliminal messages. The coloring of the picture even, is not pleasant but tension producing. At the very least, I think the committee in charge of the art should be more diligent in making sure that pictures like this are changed before publication. It seems to me that it was put in there with intention.

    I agree that the faulty reasoning and words (and actions!) of the publishers are the biggest issue. It would be great if every witness could have the opportunity to take a indepth class on Logic and the basics of what makes a good argument. I think it would be a mind opener for many to understand the difference between logical argument and one that is a fascimile--intended to manipulate.

    But I am not against persons noticing things and drawing attention to them. If someone showed me an image that bothered them, I would listen. I don't think people who are bothered by this should be ridiculed. On the other hand, I probably wouldn't show to any witnesses I know, this image or any other. Sometimes, I think, that there isn't much we can say to someone else. I think time and experience will help someone more than anything. Not everybody is ready to hear that their most cherished beliefs are based on faulty reasoning, no matter how disquieting those beliefs may be. That's just me though. I still think there is something out there bringing each one of us to the place we need to be at a time when we are ready to hear. It's nice that there are resources around like this website where we can discuss these issues!

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