Do you still believe in God?

by IT Support 79 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • IT Support
    IT Support

    blind zebra,

    a tree is known by its fruit. every tree that does not poduce good fruit will be cut down and thrown ito the fire.

    I guess if that were true, the Society would have been reduced to ashes around 88 years ago.

    TASTE and see that Jehovah is good. What tastes bad is not from Jehovah.

    No argument there, though we are drifting off subject...

    Thanks for your thoughts,


  • Amazing

    I still believe in God ... but beyond that, my faith, religious view, opinions, and all that are in total disarray ... ready for complete and total overhaul and rehabilitation.

  • Nosferatu

    I believe in myself

  • IT Support
    IT Support


    Frankly I don't beleive in God or the Devil, so i'm rarely disappointed.

    I'm not sure why, but this reminds me of the old story of one child asking another whether he believed in the Devil.

    The second replied, "Of course not, it just like Santa Claus, he's your father!"



    PS Love your name and photo.

  • IT Support
    IT Support


    It has been said:"No one can prove the existence of God,and,No one can prove that God does not exist."

    It then boils down to a belief system or personal experience of some kind that leads one to believe in God.

    You may be right, though I don't know if I relish the prospect of such uncertainty.

    Life was certainly much simpler inside Watchtower... <sigh>



  • IT Support
    IT Support

    franklin J,

    But I do believe something is responsible for our existence.

    What? Who? And why?



  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    James Thomas

    Nathan, often times I agree with what you say, and I do here too, but only 100%.

    That's all I ask.

  • IT Support
    IT Support


    if there's a God, why not leave us some unmistakable evidence of his/her/its existence?

    Sounds reasonable to me.

    It's true that we can't completely explain how life and the universe originated. But science is still in its infancy. If you used God to explain what science can't account for, your God would have gotten gradually smaller and smaller and smaller over the last few hundred years.

    Nor can I believe that a God who was omnipotent and omniscient could not have created a Universe without suffering.

    I know what you mean.

    So if there is a God--which I doubt--I can think of him/her/it in terms of a life force, a creative force, the spiritual energy of the Universe, something like that. But not, by any means, the sort of personal God that Christianity teaches.

    Interesting, I follow your reasoning.

    One last recommendation: if you're really interested in this subject, ignore the Watchtower Library. Go to a real library. You'll find numerous books--by theologians, philosophers, etc--that are far more thoughtful and well-researched than the Watchtower publications.

    Any suggestions?



  • happehanna

    Life was certainly much simpler inside Watchtower... <sigh>

    I am thinking about this comment too and in some ways you are so right

    no thinking was really needed

    do you remember some years ago they (that is wtbts) talked about "perma-frost" of the brain it was like a double bluff...............

    but does it really matter what any of of believes ??????

  • Narkissos
    Realistically , I don't.

    I've a horrible feeling I may end up reaching the same conclusion, though I'd far prefer it would be otherwise...

    Why "horrible"? How can you know what it is like being an atheist?

    Actually I think I understand your feelings. I have been very anxious myself, some years ago, about the idea of "losing faith". But to me admitting I didn't believe in "God" anymore was not "losing faith" at all. It was rather "walking by faith", as it were, on an unexpected path. What I loved in "faith", or in the Bible, is still here -- and I feel the idea of God was more of a hindrance than a help to it -- but that's only my view.

    Are you suggesting there was no concept of God before the 6th century BC?

    Yes, definitely. I mean the concept of "God" with capital "G", which is very different from, though tributary to, the older mythological and polytheistic concept of gods (and goddesses).

    Surely even the written record of the Bible is around a thousand years older, never mind the many 'pagan' concepts of God that went before those (and from which many of the characteristics of the Biblical God is allegedly drawn)?

    Check any recent critical Bible introduction (from a non-fundamentalist Bible edition for example): you will realize the process of writing the texts which now make up the Old Testament hardly began before the 8th century BC, and that all the former texts were subject to monotheistic rewriting after the Babylonian exile (6th century BC). Still the old polytheistic view, in which Yhwh is just one god among many others, show in many places...

    I'm afraid my knowledge of Nietzsche is sadly lacking (my sole 'further education' was attending the Pioneer Service School!). What was his point?

    I attended the Pioneer School too instead of going to college, but there's still plenty of time to read when you're out! I suggest his masterpiece Thus spake Zarathoustra (very Gospel-like in style), and also the provocative The Antichrist as an introduction to Nietzsche's thinking.

    What are 'the best of philosophical arguments for the existence of God' and where can I find out more about them?

    It depends what kind of arguments you are sensitive to. The classical, metaphysical "proofs" of God's existence have been developed by a number middle-age Church Doctors such as St. Anselm or St. Thomas. After the collapse of metaphysics, many attempts have been made at giving a new base for "God". Epistemological in Descartes' Discours de la méthode, moral in Kant's Practical Reason... For one time I was quite fond of Kierkegaard's paradoxical view of God, or Emmanuel Lévinas' humanistic and poetical vision of "God" as the "other's face"... However, I came to realize the definitions of "God" I was mostly attracted to didn't suit the common meaning of the word "God" -- so I finally preferred to confess my atheism, while feeling free to refer to "God" (or "gods") as a metaphor...

    Wherever it may lead you, the path of "faith" as I understand it implies reading (preferably NOT WT or fundy stuff), thinking and above all living...

    Take care,


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