What police have to deal with (page 5)

LoveUniHateExams

Do you understand the type of stop this was? - this was originally a stop to check the vehicle's tags.

Do you understand that these stops must rest on reasonable suspicion the suspect is a dangerous felon? - the stop escalated because of non-compliance on the part of Nazario and confusing orders issued from the cops.

Nazario's non-compliance was bad, and the cops issuing confusing orders was bad.

With respect, LUHE, you've picked a horrible example - ok, fine. Do you want to look at the other examples I've given in this thread?

Justmemorph

I cringe every time i read or hear the word “comply” in connection with the states jack booted thugs. Someone gets pulled over an expired tag. Nonviolent and nothing more than a vehicle tax. He ends up dead for “not complying”. Nice to know that people support the state executing citizens for “non compliance” . Be sure to carry your papers or face summary execution. Many will applaud the rebels execution.

truth_b_known

A Day in the Life of a Police Officer in America - A Play

Police Officer: Sir, you're vehicle's expiration has expired. Please sign this citation stating you promise to appear before the court to answer the allegation of the offense in lieu of being arrested in placed in jail.

Driver: No. I did nothing wrong.

Police Officer: Sir, is their anything I can say or do to get you to sign this citation so I can release you on your own recognizance, that is to say, without paying bail?

Driver: No.

Police Officer: Sir, step out of the car. You are under arrest.

Driver: No. I am not being arrested. I did nothing wrong.

Police Officer: <Opens drivers door and places hand on driver to affect the physical arrest>

Driver: <Resists arrest and assaults officer to prevent arrest>

Police Officer: <Increases use of force to affect the arrest of the driver who is now committing the offenses of Resisting Arrest and Assault on a Police Officer>

Driver: <Starts vehicle, begins driving while dragging the police officer to his impending death>

Police Officer: <Affects the arrest of the driver for the offense of attempted Capitol Murder of a Police Officer by shooting and killing the driver>

Fringes of Society: That police officer just murdered that driver over an expired registration!

The End.

Everyone takes a bow. Showtimes daily.

Justmemorph

Why did the jack booted thug need to open the car door? Why did he need “to make an arrest” at all. Living in the nations capitol i can tell you there are a thousand traffic cameras that send citations all day every day. No “arrest” or “signature” needed.

If your happy to “comply”, good on you. Comply all the way to the cattle cars.

TD

LUHE

This was a felony stop. Gutierrez states that to the dispatcher as he exits the vehicle

A temporary vehicle license out of place is not a felony. It's not a misdemeanor either. It's actually a minor civil infraction that usually results in a warning.

Once it became apparent that this was the only thing amiss and the vehicle was not stolen, which was very early on, the justification for the felony stop came to an end and it was time for the officers to change tactics. The Windsor Chief of Police has acknowledged as much himself.

To quibble over whether Nazario was too slow to comply with an unjustified level of force misses the point that the level of force was unjustified.

Brandon Tatum, who is the author of the 33 minute YouTube video at the start of this thread is either misinformed or lying on a number of fronts. He claims it was a traffic stop. It most certainly was not as Gutierrez clearly stated. As a former Tucson police officer, Tatum would have been familiar with the procedure for stopping safely in Arizona, which I've posted on this thread. His righteous indignation that Nazario proceeded for almost another mile in a state with a virtually identical procedure is therefore either disingenuous or ignorant.. His claim that Nazario didn't even slow down is demonstrably false as it's contradicted by the transcript of Crocker's radio communications. The guy's videos are frankly garbage. I've no interest in watching any more of them and am surprised that you do.

It the spirit of your thread though, I agree that it's very easy to criticize and much, much harder to do quality police work. Anyone who can do it and maintain their composure is a much, much better person than I am.

truth_b_known

...there are a thousand traffic cameras that send citations all day every day.

Citations issued from traffic camera footage are not the same. That is why Red Light Cameras are being dismantled across America as they have been found to 1) are being used to fine people for a city's municipal code violation, not the State's traffic law, with the only penalty for not complying is being barred from re-registering your vehicle and 2) there are Constitutional issues with the whole scheme.

When the violator fails to appear in court or pay the fine that citation results in an Arrest Warrant being issued. I have yet to see a traffic camera show up at someone's doorstep to arrest someone for Failure to Appear.

LoveUniHateExams

@Justmemorph - here's what should be done, as a social experiment.

First, explain and warn local people of a chosen city of this experiment, give them time to leave if they want to.

In one US city the police should be defunded. All cops should leave, get the f**k outta there.

And you and people who agree with you should go live there.

Sounds good to me ...

Justmemorph

@truth- may be in your area but in DC they are adding more. Thugs are gonna extort, always, and there is no bigger thug than government.

@uni- you are threatening me with a holiday. Here is an interesting little real world example showing why i would welcome self ownership.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSN1719257620070418

Simon

He ends up dead for “not complying”

No, he ends up dead for either shooting at a cop or appearing to be about to shoot at a cop. If you hide your hands, then swing your arm quickly toward the cop, I think you should expect to be shot. Especially if you've been a grade A idiot jackass for the last 30 minutes for no good reason whatsoever.

Why did the jack booted thug need to open the car door?

Why did the grade A idiot have to be a jackass?

Now, you don't get to accuse police who are doing their job of being "jack booted thugs" on this site unless and until they actually have been "jack booted thugs".

Please reserve such language for when it is actually warranted, and not when their actions are more than justified.

Queequeg

Is the jack ass booted... again?

What police have to deal with

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