Awake #4/2016: Homosexuality (page 6)

cofty

rebelfighter - If you think that will ever happen you were never a JW were you?

cofty

If you are not excusing anything why would you post this... - MASH

Pointing out that one bad thing is not as bad as another bad thing is not the same as saying the first bad thing isn't bad.

This piece of logic seems very obvious to me.

cofty

'Cofty, do you think the WBTS is a homophobic organisation'? A simple yes or no will do. - MASH

No it won't.

Sexism, racism and homophobia are all on a spectrum and how you apply dictionary definitions in the real world is subjective.

At one end you may have a man who treats his wife very well but he still believes it is his place to ultimately make major decisions for the family. At the other end a man makes his wife stay at home unless she is accompanied by a male relative and is wearing a black sack and veil. He thinks he has the right to beat his wife if she is sufficiently annoying.

Are both of them sexist? Well strictly speaking they are but the same word hardly seems adequate for both of them.

Similarly on homophobia. At one end we have people who genuinely think god disapproves of gay sex but they don't allow that to affect how they relate to gay people. At the other end we have ISIS throwing gay men off of tall buildings.

Do both of them fit the dictionary definition of homophobia? Well it depends on what dictionary you use. The Anti-Defamation League define it as "the hatred or fear of homosexuals - that is, lesbians and gay men - sometimes leading to acts of violence and expressions of hostility."

By that definition no the Watchtower are not homophobic. Other dictionaries define the word in ways that would encompass the position of the cult.

Given that they believe the bible is authoritative in this matter what would you have them do or say?

bennyk

I find it difficult to believe that anyone considering the Watch Tower Society's views on fornication and adultery would declare the WTS to be "heterophobic".

steve2

I agree with Cofty on this issue.

From my own experience in the organization some decades ago I concluded the organization was not homophobic but it was - and remains - homosexual-practice-phobic.

scotsman

sometimes leading to acts of violence and expressions of hostility.

Really, you don't think the teaching of the WT sometimes leads to expressions of hostility? I found being referred to as a poof by some JWs a bit hostile.

I'd agree that there are degrees of homophobia from ISIS to the Salvation Army. Maybe you find the homophobia of the JWs to be a more tasteful grey than ISIS black but I can't help but reflect that the gentle homophobia played a part in the suicide of the two gay (celibate) JWs I knew.

cofty

Maybe you find the homophobia of the JWs to be a more tasteful grey than ISIS

I didn't use the word tasteful but it doesn't seem controversial say that disapproval of gay sex is less harmful than throwing people off tall buildings.

scotsman

I realise I just trivialised my own experience. Being asked if I was a poof by some Witnesses made me feel completely ill. And the long periods of depression I experienced in my twenties were related directly to the JW teachings on sexuality. Yes, other faiths have similar briefs but I wasn't a Mormon etc etc

But hey, at least I wasn't being thrown of a building or beheaded.

scotsman

But Cofty you keep denying that the JWs are homophobic but admitting there are degrees of homophobia. Are the JWs not somewhere on the homophobic spectrum?

cofty

But Cofty you keep denying that the JWs are homophobic but admitting there are degrees of homophobia. Are the JWs not somewhere on the homophobic spectrum? - Scotsman

I didn't assert they are not homophobic, it depends on your definition. I answered more fully above...

Similarly on homophobia. At one end we have people who genuinely think god disapproves of gay sex but they don't allow that to affect how they relate to gay people. At the other end we have ISIS throwing gay men off of tall buildings.
Do both of them fit the dictionary definition of homophobia? Well it depends on what dictionary you use. The Anti-Defamation League define it as "the hatred or fear of homosexuals - that is, lesbians and gay men - sometimes leading to acts of violence and expressions of hostility."
By that definition no the Watchtower are not homophobic. Other dictionaries define the word in ways that would encompass the position of the cult.

Awake #4/2016: Homosexuality

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