They can also count children who accompany their parents as they go door to door.
No. Children are not counted unless they are unbaptized publishers
Watchtower Releases 2017 Grand Total Figures!
by darkspilver 48 Replies latest jw friends
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Drearyweather
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Drearyweather
So the more publishers you stuff in at the top then the more baptised dribble out of the bottom. The higher the increase in the worldwide publisher number then the more likely that the baptism number will increase in the following years.
Thanks for the explanation freddo. It was clear except for the above point.
If we assume that there are less converts and more born-ins who are getting baptized, would the above statement of yours take the premise that more and more JW kids are staying in the religion and then having kids who are becoming JW's, thus repeating this cycle and the rate of publisher increase is equaling the world population growth?
Because, if JW's have low retention rate( born-ins are leaving the cult) and outside converts are also less, then the peak publishers should go down at some point.
For e.g. In my congregation of 40 publishers, almost everyone is a born-in JW, i.e. all had witness parents. There has not been a single convert in years, but the publisher number is increasing because existing witnesses are having kids who are growing up as JW's. So, in reality, in my cong, born-ins are staying in the org. Is this a worldwide trend?
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shepherdless
If we assume that there are less converts and more born-ins who are getting baptized, would the above statement of yours take the premise that more and more JW kids are staying in the religion and then having kids who are becoming JW's, thus repeating this cycle and the rate of publisher increase is equaling the world population growth?
It would appear from past figures that in places such as USA, Canada, Europe, Japan and Australia, this is what is happening. There seems to be few converts, and the numbers are made up of born-ins. Unsurprisingly, numbers are stagnant in such countries.
In Latin America and other strongly catholic countries, there is still growth. In Christian African countries, where there is strong population growth, there is often a massive increase in numbers and a lot of those countries already have higher ratios of JWs to population than many Western countries.
Because, if JW's have low retention rate( born-ins are leaving the cult) and outside converts are also less, then the peak publishers should go down at some point.
That is probably already happening in some Western countries. On another thread I all but proved (using Australian census data) that decline is now inevitable. Better to just rely on “average publishers” not “peak publishers” when trying to work out what is going on, by the way.
For e.g. In my congregation of 40 publishers, almost everyone is a born-in JW, i.e. all had witness parents. There has not been a single convert in years, but the publisher number is increasing because existing witnesses are having kids who are growing up as JW's. So, in reality, in my cong, born-ins are staying in the org. Is this a worldwide trend?
From memory, you are in India? In many Western countries, a number of born-ins leave when in the 15 to 25 age bracket, but a lot of them drift back in, particularly when having their own kids, sometimes dragging a spouse in with them.
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ttdtt
The numbers are on the Website now:)
FYI
Memorial Partakers Worldwide: 18,564
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/2017-service-year-report/2017-grand-totals/
2017 Grand Totals
Branches of Jehovah’s Witnesses: 90
Number of Lands Reporting: 240
Total Congregations: 120,053
Worldwide Memorial Attendance: 20,175,477
Memorial Partakers Worldwide: 18,564
Peak of Publishers *: 8,457,107
Average Publishers Preaching Each Month: 8,248,982
Percentage of Increase Over 2016: 1.4
Total Number Baptized *: 284,212
Average Pioneer * Publishers Each Month: 1,249,946
Average Auxiliary Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 439,571
Total Hours Spent in Field: 2,046,000,202
Average Bible Studies * Each Month: 10,071,524
COMPARISON FOR ANYONE ONE INTERESTED
From 2016:
Branches of Jehovah’s Witnesses: 89
Number of Lands Reporting: 240
Total Congregations: 119,485
Worldwide Memorial Attendance: 20,085,142
Memorial Partakers Worldwide: 18,013
Peak of Publishers in Kingdom Service: 8,340,847
Average Publishers Preaching Each Month: 8,132,358
Percentage of Increase Over 2015: 1.8
Total Number Baptized: 264,535
Average Auxiliary Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 459,393
Average Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 1,157,017
Total Hours Spent in Field: 1,983,763,754
Average Bible Studies Each Month: 10,115,264
From 2015:
Branches of Jehovah’s Witnesses: 89
Number of Lands Reporting: 240
Total Congregations: 118,016
Worldwide Memorial Attendance: 19,862,783
Memorial Partakers Worldwide: 15,177
Peak of Publishers in Kingdom Service: 8,220,105
Average Publishers Preaching Each Month: 7,987,279
Percentage of Increase Over 2014: 1.5
Total Number Baptized: 260,273
Average Auxiliary Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 443,504
Average Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 1,135,210
Total Hours Spent in Field: 1,933,473,727
Average Home Bible Studies Each Month: 9,708,968
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slimboyfat
So I guess that's it then? We're not getting the full report, only the worldwide figures?
Also notice the financial figure is down: $202 million spent this year compared with $213 million last year.
And bethel members down slightly too.
The cutbacks continue, although the pace has slowed down.
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sir82
I don't trust the Watchtower numbers at all.
Actually, they are scrupulously meticulous about "numbers" in themselves. So I believe whatever numbers they print.
They quote mine, take things out of context, misrepresent, dissemble, etc. so I don't believe much of anything they write about as doctrine or defense of doctrine.
But the numbers, I think, are meticulously accurate.
Sort of like the Nazis.....but that's a different topic.
"Publishers" can count both baptized and unbaptized.
That's the way it's been for at least 80 years....not sure why it would be an issue.
They can also count children who accompany their parents as they go door to door.
Nope. They count people who turn in a "field service report". Turn in the report, you are counted. No report, not counted. A 5 year old kid who is not "approved" as an "unbaptized publisher" does not turn in a report, so he doesn't appear anywhere in these numbers.
I agree with the rest of your post though!
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The Fall Guy
With all their cutbacks on printing, Branches, and various other outgoings, they've only saved $11m?????
Sounds like the "truth" to me.
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OrphanCrow
TheFallGuy: they've only saved $11m?????
Yeah, that would be a whopping savings of $1.33 per publisher. Annual savings of $1.33 and monthly, each publisher saves eleven cents
Well done, WT, well done
*lol! jus' thinkin'....that 'savings' most likely includes their Russian tax bill. Betcha they didn't pay that last year
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Doubting Bro
It would be really interesting to find out what portion of the new publishers and what portion of the baptized are born-ins as opposed to converts. In English US and likely majority languages in EU countries and Japan, I would guess based on my observations that the overwhelming majority of the growth are coming from born-ins. In the 3rd world countries and non-majority languages in the industrialized countries, I think there is still a good amount of convert growth.
Because of this, I would imagine that there is enough growth in the 3rd world countries still to offset any retention issues and lack of converts in the industrialized countries. Only when the convert growth slows down in the 3rd world countries will we see a decrease.
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EverApostate
I don't think its worthwhile to analyze these statistics seriously.
After all religions grow, stagnate and die. Its all a matter of time.
All Christendom sects grow tremendously in developing countries. Likewise Islam ,Hinduism,Buddhism and other new religions.
Growth is not an authenticating factor for religions.