Ladies First

by snugglebunny 70 Replies latest jw friends

  • TD
    TD

    Here where I live, properties facing busy streets have wide easements (Sometimes thirty feet or more..) which are usually landscaped with trees and heavy shrubbery (Oleander is a favorite here)

    Hazards of the type you describe are actually more likely to present themselves from the inside of the sidewalk, where it is very easy for a sketchy person to hide in the shadows. But, again whatever the couple is comfortable with and makes them happy.

    To give you an idea of how antiquated early editions of Emily Post have become, consider what she says in the same chapter about bundles:

    "Bundles do not suggest a lady in the first place, and as for gentlemen and bundles!—they don’t go together at all....And yet, many an unknowing woman, sometimes a very young and pretty one, too, has asked a relative, a neighbor, or an admirer, to carry something suggestive of a pillow, done up in crinkled paper and odd lengths of joined string. Then she wonders afterwards in unenlightened surprise why her cousin, or her neighbor, or her admirer, who is one of the smartest men in town, never comes to see her any more!"

    The harkens back to a time when carrying a woman's larger shopping purchases was the job of house servant. Fine ladies normally didn't do it and gentlemen certainly did not.

    I think the bottom line is that there is a huge difference between what you might volutarily choose to do and what a total stranger would expect of you as social norm.

    To give an extreme example: You might choose to step in front of a bullet if it would save the life of your wife or child, but does a total stranger have the right to expect that of you based on nothing but your gender?

  • stillin
    stillin

    You're right, TD. Good form and manners are dependent upon the situation.

  • Xanthippe
    Xanthippe
    Xanthippe stated she worked part time to support herself - so she worked part time but was financially independent? ... i.e. her part time job paid all her bills and allowed her to be independent?
    You'll have to forgive me because it was unclear from her post. -LUHE

    LUHE I don't understand why you're asking Diogenesister to forgive you when you were extremely rude to me. You said my husband or parents supported me pioneering when I'd stated I worked part time to pay my rent, food and clothing bills. It's clearly in my post, Diogenesister got it, why didn't you?

    Yes I was poor after only working part time from 16 - 22 while pioneering. I left home at nineteen and obviously paid my own bills. Before that I paid my parents board, I had to, my dad was not a JW. My parents didn't pay my way pioneering.

    When I got married at 22 we both worked and both pioneered. On this thread about treating women with respect and gallantry you assumed I'd lied about my life and called me princess as if I was a pampered kid. I wasn't, my family were poor, living in a council house and I remained poor until I left the evil cult and got my degree.

    I think you owe me an apology, what do all these gallant lovely men on here think?

  • blondie
    blondie

    Xanthippe, I think some of us get heated and don't read all the way through thinking they know our story. I too had a father who was not a jw, and my mother was a divorced mother with a teenage son to raise on her own; my father did not pay the ordered support. I too paid rent, food, 1/2 the utilities, etc. I was like a roommate having to pay 1/2 of everything. I even paid for the extras since my job paid more. It prepared me for when I moved out and had roommates sharing the expenses.

    Even if we had 2 parents that were jws, there was no assured expectation that they could support us or would expect to. I knew a very few who seemed to have it all.

    Now that Diogenisister, can now re-read and read your words above, she can see how she would have felt if the shoe had been on the other foot, and apologize.

    Love Blondie

  • Xanthippe
    Xanthippe

    Blondie the post was by LoveUniHateExams, stating I must have been supported by my parents and then my husband pioneering, which is not true and quite plain from my post. Diogenesister is the one that defended me to LUHE because she actually read my post.

  • blondie
    blondie

    Sorry, Xanthippe, I am an example of not reading carefully, Apologies Diogenesister! And to LUHE maybe an apology to Xanthippe might be in order (see post just above Xanthippe).

  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    @Xanthippe - I think it's great that women are taking control of lives, joining the workforce, choosing what careers they want and being financially independent. Kudos to you and all the other women who do that.

    But I still don't think you get it. Women aren't oppressed in the Western world, TBH.

    Traditionally, yes, there have been barriers and women were oppressed. Notice the simple past tense, were.

    But those barriers have already been smashed. There is no glass ceiling. It exists only in the minds of extremist feminists. There is a glass basement - that clearly exists - but the feminists aren't interested in that. They sweep that under the carpet while whinging about STEM.

    Now, in the 21st century, women aren't oppressed in the west.

    Xanthippe stated she worked part time to support herself - so she worked part time but was financially independent? ... i.e. her part time job paid all her bills and allowed her to be independent?
    You'll have to forgive me because it was unclear from her post. -LUHE

    On this thread about treating women with respect and gallantry you assumed I'd lied about my life - no, I didn't assume you'd lied. It was simply unclear from your post, as I explained.

    I called you 'Princess' because you, as a Western woman, live like a princess compared to the millions of women in the third world who are genuinely oppressed.

    I think you owe me an apology - are you a strong, independent woman? In that case, I don't need to apologise and you can accept that.

  • Xanthippe
    Xanthippe

    LUHE, that's twice now you've said you asserted my parents or husband must have supported my pioneering because it was unclear from my post that I supported myself.

    I said, we worked part-time to support ourselves, all of which went on rent, food and ministry clothes. We pioneers were the first to be asked to do demonstrations at the KH

    Which part of this phrase did you find unclear?

    But I still don't think you get it. Women aren't oppressed in the Western world, TBH. Traditionally, yes, there have been barriers and women were oppressed. Notice the simple past tense, were

    Notice that I acknowledged this fact earlier in the thread. Four people 'disliked' my post acknowledging that we know about oppression of women from history books, I presume you weren't one of them?

    The second meaning of princess in the first online dictionary I googled, after daughter of a monarch, is a spoilt young woman, which I suggest you meant. Now you are wriggling out of it.

    are you a strong, independent woman? In that case, I don't need to apologise and you can accept that

    What on earth does that mean? Do you only apologise to weak, dependent woman when you rant at them without listening properly?


  • LoveUniHateExams
    LoveUniHateExams

    I said, we worked part-time to support ourselves, all of which went on rent, food and ministry clothes. We pioneers were the first to be asked to do demonstrations at the KH

    Which part of this phrase did you find unclear? - It was unclear from your post whether your part time wages allowed you to be fully financially independent or not. That was all.

    The second meaning of princess in the first online dictionary I googled, after daughter of a monarch, is a spoilt young woman, which I suggest you meant - exactly. Compared to millions of genuinely oppressed women in non-Western countries, you are a spoilt woman. You may not like to hear this but it's true.

    What on earth does that mean? Do you only apologise to weak, dependent woman when you rant at them without listening properly? - it means that if you're so upset that you're demanding an apology for nothing more than a bit of sarcasm/banter, you'd be a weak, delicate little wall-flower.

    I'm a Spurs fan. I've got facebook mates who I've known from way back who support Arsenal. The banter we have is more offensive than me calling you 'Princess'. I get called 'yid mug' from time to time. It ain't the end of the world.

    I find it amusing when feminists talk of strong, independent women, then reach for the smelling salts and cry hate speech the minute somebody 'is rude' to them on line.

  • Xanthippe
    Xanthippe
    Which part of this phrase did you find unclear? - It was unclear from your post whether your part time wages allowed you to be fully financially independent or not. That was all.
    What did you want a bank statement?
    Compared to millions of genuinely oppressed women in non-Western countries, you are a spoilt woman. You may not like to hear this but it's true.

    When did I say I was oppressed? Why do you keep beating that drum. I agreed with Diogenesister that women are used as workhorses in that cult and used my own example and that of people I knew.
    Who is it you're talking to when you keep saying you're not opressed, I know okay! I said it's in the history books! How many times!
    I find it amusing when feminists talk of strong, independent women, then reach for the smelling salts and cry hate speech the minute somebody 'is rude' to them on line.

    Your mate cofty has several times asked people to apologise to him on the forum and no I'm not going to find examples for you. Ask him. I don't go trawling through online to find things to prove my point I leave that to you. Why on earth do you trawl YouTube for vids of talks by feminists?





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