But Avishai, God is all powerfull, He held the earth together while he stopped its rotation so that those guys had enough time to kill their enemies. And he'll do it again one day soon, you just wait and see.
Fables, Farces and Facts
by Farkel 82 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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LittleToe
Farkel:
There ya go stirring people up again, and being offensive with it.
For the record, I see no straw men.Whilst I find it kinda difficult to believe that either the sun or the earth stopped moving, if the writer is trying to report something, it is merely what he observed. However he explained it, it appears that something "different" happened that day, unless it was merely a parable showing that their God was greater than that of their enema's.
For all your ranting, I don't see any passage of scrpture where God said "This is my book, word for word, believe every last scrap...". He is on record as saying "This is my Son, the beloved. Listen to him.", though.
ThunderRider:Disenchantment with the JW's I can totally understand. I wouldn't make that synonymous with anything else in life, though. Be it religion, the bible, or book publishing (as you well know).
Avishai:
It's the earths rotation that causes a thing called "gravity".
Ermm, actually, it's the earth's mass that causes gravity. The rotation of the earth probably reduces that somewhat, due to centrifugal effect.
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Abaddon
Little Toe:
Ermm, actually, it's the earth's mass that causes gravity. The rotation of the earth probably reduces that somewhat, due to centrifugal effect.
First part is right, obviously. Second part invokes centrifugal force; this suprising does not exist in the way most people think it does, as what it is is a description of perceived centripetal forces, or something;
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/corf.html
Re. your coments to Fark;
I don't see any passage of scrpture where God said "This is my book, word for word, believe every last scrap...".
Nope, but if you published a book under the name Bill Gates, and it mistated things in a harmful fashion, he would sue your ass.
God has shown no signs of taking action to correct the misconceptions in the Bible that have resulted in irrepairable harm to his name. It does say 'All Scripture is cobbeled together by the Council of Nicea to fit the concept they had'... whoops, I mean 'All Scripture is inspired and beenficial' though, so it's scarcely a wonder if people get confused.
He is on record as saying "This is my Son, the beloved. Listen to him.", though.
But you just said anyone taking the Bible as totally believable was going beyond what it said in the Bible, and then you give a quote from a book you admit is flawed. How do we know that bit isn't flawed? This is the seceret decoder ring error that I thought you actually agreed with, i.e. how do you know that bit is right. I mean, if voices from the sky and dove-like appartions are meant to be belivable, how do we know the bit about the ventriloquist snakes is not meant to be believable?
Surely you don't have one... (decoder ring, not ventriloquist snake)
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JCanon
Hi Farkel, you're trying WAY to hard...
If a God chose to give his earthly children a book that would be their sole guide to happiness and salvation, one would expect that book to be full of nothing but clear-cut rules and examples designed to show people the path to that happiness and salvation. Instead, the Bible is full of stories that have no application or meaning in anyone?s life.
Sorry, that's not so. Jesus himself said that he spoke in parables so that OUTSIDERS would not understand and so only his chosen ones would understand. Thus don't think the deep secrets of the Bible are for everyone. They are not. His chosen followers, though, understand the scriptures and the secrets, so they get great comfort from the book. They are "spiritual". Even the Bible says that those who are fleshly would read the Bible and it would seem like nonsense to them....guess that says it, huh?
While some history of God?s so-called ?chosen? people might be helpful in understanding why God gave certain laws, most of the Bible?s history is worthless, rambling narrative that has no application to anyone other than those who lived during those times.
It might seem worthless to you, Farkel, but it's quite pertinent in every detail for the anointed. Case in point, the WAVE OFFERINGS!!! There were two of them that related to the Christ. The first was during the time of unfermented cakes and the second was two loaves from the house "with leaven" that were waved at Pentecost.
To you that might not seem significance. But since the unleavened bread represented the natural BODY of Christ, it being sinless, and that wave offering depicting that; at the second coming, which is represented by the second wave offering with leaven, it tells us that the Messiah would appear in the flesh as an ordinary man at the second coming.
So it's very pertinent. Useless to outsiders, but fascinating and true to the chosen insiders, who understand these secrets and meanings.
Now even you can UNDERSTAND the reference, but it still probably means nothing to you, correct?
Your experience with scripture is frustrating, but mine is sublime.
Even so I laugh and you for not even believing your own evidence that the Bible is true. Do you think the VAT4956 double-dating to 511BCE was an accident? No! It was given to me to prove the Bible is true and to shut up idle talkers of nonsense like yourself.
There is NOTHING YOU CAN DO BUT BE WRONG now, Farkel, about that silly notion that 586BCE was the year Jerusalem fell and that the Persians never changed their records. The VAT4956 PROVES that 511BCE was the original date for that year.
Now as wild as that seems to you, don't you think it is a little too "convenient" for me to coincidentally pull that date out of the text and at the same time have dated that event by the Bible by using 455BCE for the 1st of Cyrus then adding 70 years to get 525BCE for the last deportation ont he 23rd of Nebuchadnezzar? Which is the SAME IDENTICAL DATING for 511BCE for year 37?
How come it all works out so well? Huh?
The "children of the light" find the Bible a wondrous and open book. The children of the darkness find it a closed and mysterious book of little use to them.
I feel bad your experience with the witnesses was so traumatic, but pretending the Bible is just another book is simply nonsense.
JC
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A Paduan
There's a strawman argument that runs the length of this thread and others:
You gotta love it when the Babble freaks try to explain what should have been explained simply and clearly from the Creator himself in the first place!
Really? I would think that to be wrong. It's not difficult to hold up fundamentalist story focus and knock it down - it's the straw in this strawman. You can read about the "wheat" and "chaff" of stories, and "straw" too - it's in the babble - angels gather the wheat, burn the chaff, seed is planted and on it goes. Slaves use the straw to make bricks - and towers - sometimes they even have to find their own. The straw & chaff are part of the growth of the wheat - and as you can see in the post above, chaff is closer to the food than straw, but even so its more useless - angels burn it - but enough babble lessons for now. I think I saw something on tv called "The Day the Earth Stood Still" - maybe the producers need physics lessons.
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garybuss
For the skeptic, no amount of proof is sufficient.
For the true belive, no proof is needed.
The superstitious need their myths.
The pragmatist is happy with reality.
The religious read dead men's delusions and can explain those.
All philosophy and all religion tries to answer three questions.
1... Where did we come from?
2... What are we doing here?
3... Where are we going?
I think it's impossible to accept the Bible without also accepting the Koran. They both have the same credentials. They both say the same thing. Few Bible apologists I have known have even read it. They just "know" it's wrong by magic. -
hooberus
I have read some of the Koran. The Koran actually in places proclaims the Bible as being revelation from God. The problem with the Koran is its denial of of some basic Biblical theology such as God having a Son, Jesus being crucified etc, while at the same time proclaiming the Bible to be revelation from God.
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LittleToe
Abaddon:
Surely you don't have one... (decoder ring, not ventriloquist snake)
I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you and eat you.
(Being hetero, the last option doesn't turn me on too much )Oh, and leave my ventriloquism out of this
As for the court-case - [un]fortunately God doesn't believe in deep-pockets law, prefering to bump off the opposition. Like every good mountie, he always get's his man (allegedly).
As for centripetal forces, if I understand them correctly, it would mean that the earth suddenly stopping it's rotation would have a horizontal (rather than vertical) effect. The earth spins at over 1000mph at the equator. It brings new meaning to the phrase "stop the world, I want to get off".
For centrifugal effect to be large enough to throw us off (combat 1N gravity) the earth would have to revolve over 800 times a day (effectively at 800,000mph).
I knew those science classes would come in handy one day
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Abaddon
Hooberus: Og course, a Muslim would say; "The problem with the Bible is that it is no longr accurate; we kow the Quran is still accurate as it is trnsmitted via word of mouth; it is kept in the minds of thousands of believers at once, and any error or deliberate change would be noted. But the Bible is a dead book of ink, and chnages have crept into through time." And _both_ of you would be wrong, if you were claiming any form of accuracy or provable inspration. Littletoe: As for centripetal forces, if I understand them correctly, it would mean that the earth suddenly stopping it's rotation would have a horizontal (rather than vertical) effect. The earth spins at over 1000mph at the equator. It brings new meaning to the phrase "stop the world, I want to get off". For centrifugal effect to be large enough to throw us off (combat 1N gravity) the earth would have to revolve over 800 times a day (effectively at 800,000mph). I knew those science classes would come in handy one day. You remember more than I do! Re. Earth' rotation; this is one reason why matter transporters would be very messy, and unless 'inertial compensators' are possible, will never be a fact of life allowing simplr point to point transportation even if the considerabl OTHER problems are overcome. Changes in latitdue = chnages in velocity = OUCH! Good noght all!
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LittleToe
Abaddon:
...this is one reason why matter transporters would be very messy...
Ewwww. I hadn't even thought of that!!!