Science News article: ‘Case closed’: 99.9% of scientists agree climate emergency caused by humans

by Disillusioned JW 146 Replies latest social current

  • Disillusioned JW
    Disillusioned JW

    road to nowhere, neither I nor climate scientists are saying we need to live in a a pre-industrial world, except in regards to limiting the world's CO2 emissions to very close to such an era. The idea is do such by using different sources of energy (such as solar and wind) than those which primarily fueled the industrial era. It is also by using energy more efficiently (such as in automotive transportation) than that done during the 20th century.

    Vidqun, I don't believe everything I read and hear, but apparently you and I disagree about some sources in regards to whether they are reliable.

  • Rivergang
    Rivergang

    Vidqun,

    That illustration is not exactly a scale drawing of where the planets are in relation to the sun.

    The sun is 1.39 million km in diameter, whereas the earth is 148 million km away from the sun. Going by that picture, though, you wouldn’t think so!

  • Disillusioned JW
    Disillusioned JW

    Vidqun, just because CO2 makes up only about 0.04% of Earth's atmosphere that doesn't mean it has an insignificant effect on the global air temperature. My study of science books and my own experiences with human made greenhouses makes that very clear.

    If you have a car think of how hot the air in the car gets inside of the car (relative to the air outside of the car) on a sunny hot day when the windows are closed and sunlight is entering the car through the closed glass windows. The glass is much thinner (less than half an inch) than the several foot length of air in the car, but it is enough to let in UV waves (which are later converted into infrared waves) and to trap in infrared waves, and that results in the air within the car becoming considerably hotter than the air outside of the car. That is the greenhouse effect in work.

    Likewise in greenhouses in which plants are grown, the length of air from the ground to the top of the greenhouse is even much greater than the length of air in a car, though the thickness of the glass is about the same as that of the car, yet the greenhouse effect is still produced. Some greenhouses used to grow plants, don't even use glass, using only plastic sheets (and thus much thinner than glass panes) yet a greenhouse effect is still produced, allowing the plants in the greenhouse to grow.

    In my metropolitan area I have personally noticed that the summers and early portion of fall have become hotter over recent years, and that the winters have become warmer over recent years. I have also noticed that wildfires in my state have increased dramatically over recent years, resulting in the smoke from the distant wildfires getting into the air of my metro area on several days of each recent year. I don't remember such smoke every being in the air of my metro area prior to a few years ago, except on extremely rare occasions.That is extremely alarming to me. Furthermore, when I watch the televised news I see that such warming of the climate and increasing frequency of wildfires are happening across much of my nation and in many other nations.

    I thus see the very clear evidence from my personal experiences. I also see the data presented in scientific sources about the Earth's climate. It is undeniable to me.

    Whether global warming needs to be limited to 1 degree Celsius, 1.5 degrees Celsius, 2 degrees Celsius, 2.5 degrees Celsius, 3 degrees Celsius, or by some other amount, over pre-industrial levels, it is very clear to me that is needs to be limited in order for the human species (and numerous other species) on the planet to survive and in order for it (and them) to continue to thrive. [Life on Earth is interdependent. For example, the continued existence of our species is dependent upon the continued existence of numerous other species.] It also very clear to me that humans need to do more to reduce their CO2 emissions, in order to limit increases in the global temperature.

  • Vidqun
    Vidqun

    Perhaps we should look at the big picture. Here's a few informative graphs with data from the ice cores. Let's start with temperature:



    Let's now look at temperature vs. CO2 concentrations:


    .

  • Anony Mous
    Anony Mous

    @disillusioned: going back to the book, you are claiming that if we don’t make a change, earths temperature will suddenly rise 2C in 30 years if the predictions are correct? I know that it is talking about pre-industrial levels.

    Even so, we have seen minimal variations since pre-industrial times, despite China/India nearly doubling the US output over the last few decades, I wouldn’t expect abrupt changes after the world starts slowly decreasing its total output (which is again, very hard to measure in comparison with the output from volcanoes and the Amazon).

    If anything warming out of the mini-ice age the world was in during the Middle Ages has been put on a slower curve based on other data points we have from the past to the point scientists in the 70s thought we would CO2 ourselves back into an ice age. Now global warming has once again morphed into global up-and-down temperatures. Super-heating and global warming have been completely debunked, the term of the decade is global change which could be up or down. So the book is unlikely to be correct, IPCC currently models a 1-1.5C temperature change by 2100 with a 2.5-3C in the worst case where everyone goes back to coal/wood burning. Oh, yes, since pre-industrial time. That is still more than 50 years off the prediction of the book and several degrees as well, depending on outcome.

    That’s always the problem with prophecy; besides the vagueness and number of prophets, it’s always some distance away and they’re also always correct until they’ve been completely debunked and then we will hear about how we misinterpreted it.

  • Vidqun
    Vidqun

    Here's an Australian 10 year graph of temperatures in the lower troposphere (which would reflect world tendencies) to confirm what Anony Mous said. This is not a version we hear from MSM and the UN. Why? Follow the money:

    According to Bank of America and one of their “Thematic Research” tomes, to achieve Net Zero carbon emissions by 2050, will have a hefty price tag. It will be costing the nations in the vicinity of $150 trillion over thirty years. This amounts to about $5 trillion in annual investments which is two times the current world GDP. Simply put, it provides an endless stream of taxpayer and debt-funded "investments" which in turn need a just as constant degree of debt monetization by central banks.


  • Rivergang
    Rivergang
    Here's an Australian 10 year graph of temperatures in the lower troposphere (which would reflect world tendencies) to confirm what Anony Mous said. (Italics added)

    This is not necessarily the case. Neither the surface (land or sea) nor the atmosphere warms - or cools - at an even rate. That is why springtime in the middle latitudes is often a very turbulent time.

  • Vidqun
    Vidqun

    This is an Australian graph. Look at the gloabal monthly temperature anomalies (1880-2021). These follow a similar pattern.

    https://svs.gsfc.nasa.gov/4975

    Interestingly, data had to be suppressed, indicating that "Earth's temperature hasn't risen for the last 15 years." I wonder why.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2425775/Climate-scientists-told-cover-fact-Earths-temperature-risen-15-years.html

    England as an example:


  • TonusOH
    TonusOH

    Current world GDP was $85.24 trillion USD in 2020. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/268750/global-gross-domestic-product-gdp/)

    Something tells me that the figure of $150 trillion over 30 years is... optimistic. Government planning tends to underestimate the time a project will take, and vastly underestimates how much money will be poured into the project, due to the amount of graft and outright theft that are usually involved. Oh yeah, they probably won't come close to achieving their goals, either. But lots of people will become very rich along the way.

  • joey jojo
    joey jojo
    Vidqun
    This is an Australian graph. Look at the gloabal monthly temperature anomalies (1880-2021). These follow a similar pattern.
    https://svs.gsfc.nasa.gov/4975
    Interestingly, data had to be suppressed, indicating that "Earth's temperature hasn't risen for the last 15 years." I wonder why.

    Wow Vidqun, you have outdone yourself this time.

    After you make the claim that it hasnt risen, you link the climate spiral from NASA that shows proof that earths temperature has risen.

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