Non JW wife/JW husband Christmas tree debate
You didn't agree to this in your marriage vows. It's not fair of him to expect you to give up your tradition because of Watchtower rules. As long as you don't expect him to help you set up the tree, decorate it, sing Christmas carols around it, take it down, it's none of his damn business. Don't let him force his Watchtower rules on you. If he doesn't understand that you have rights to your beliefs and traditions then he is a bit controlling.
Again, i hate to be overly blunt, but your husband has pulled a huge bait and switch on you.
He was willing to sleep with you prior to marriage (at least thats what it seems like based on your op), which is a HUGE jw nono, ends up marrying you so he can be accepted back into his cult.
He now expects YOU to be ok with his adherence to cult rules, something he clearly wasnt asking at the start.
i understand marriage asks for compromise but he has misrepresented this from the start and its unfortunate but you have no idea how deep this rabbit holes goes. You were never raised a jw and seem to think this is nothing more than him going to church.
It isnt. Its a cult and will dominate EVERY aspect of his life. You are just one of those aspects.
Again, im sorry to be blunt and i hate to come accross dogmatically but you dont seem to fully understand or appreciate what he has gotten the two of you into by his return to that “religion”.
I hope his return was based on being able to talk to his family if indeed he was being shunned. A lot of people go through the repent process to be able to get reinstated and have normal family contact.....then after a while they leave the religion. Sometime this happens when they move out of the area.
You have the green light for the Christmas Tree and the proper quotes from the Watchtower.....(you Googled that information...right?)
Give us an idea as to his reasons for returning.
He may be subject to WT rules; you are not.
I would let the argument develop...and at the end for impact, you can ask, "If the WT has given the right for a non-JW mate to have a Christmas tree, would that end the argument?" Then produce the quotations previously mentioned.
I think you must understand as well that if he recently went back to the org or has recently been to an assembly or convention he will be in high dub mode for awhile. Carry on as usual and try your best to minimize the cult effects. Meaning, ignore his super dubness for now, it will fade in short bit. They seem to go in cycles according to whatever the recent message is. You can actually determine ahead of time just where your jw is emotionally and 'spiritually' by what they are studying at any given moment. It seems to go on a yearly recycle (in my mind anyway) and some months I dread because I know this will be a doom and gloom month or a very judgmental month, or time to be a hardass 'they deserve it ' mentality. Unfortunately you will come to know this ahead of time if you research and keep somewhat up to date and sadly it becomes part of normal life.
If they are in super dub mode full of gloom and doom have ready some really uplifting human interest type stories! Stories of regular people helping others, being selfless and you will be cheerful and so full of love and hope at these stories that he will be disgusted and let the whole conversation drop. Back to what's for dinner if you must......
If you absolutely must have a conversation then use the scripture Romans 14:5- NIV -One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind.Under no circumstance should you ever accept the NWT as an acceptable Bible translation. jw's will accept other translations but you must not accept their perverted version. I think they will, reluctantly, accept the King James if you are acceptable to that. My jw did accept Revised Standard Edition at one time. Who knows now though.
It is very odd, we went through sheer hell (and that is being charitable) when he joined up and years later he seems able to separate his jw-ism and normal life. Like living 2 different lives sometimes. But, make no mistake jw-ism is always right under the skin of things, always. We often have conversations that we both know are jw related but never mention actual jw/religious things. It is a weird dance we have developed over the years and I do not recommend it for anybody. I still remember our pre jw relationship and still miss it to this day.
I just want to shake your jw and mine and say what the hell is wrong with you? wake up. That doesn't work, trust me on this one.
Wish I had a magic wand for you and all the rest of us with loved ones caught in this cult.
Hope springs eternal, maybe one day.
Oh my, another long post, my apologies.
Yes, I guess this one is hitting me on a personal basis huh? lol
Carla. What an astute and beautiful posting.
Thanks for saying what you have.
Everyone, thank you truly for this information. I would call you out personally, but I don't know how to link your names on here!
Regarding our choice to not have children: I am in agreement on this, it wasn't all his decision. We were 40 when we married, so if we were younger this might have been something I thought about. I was always on the fence about having kids, but seeing close friends and what they and their marriages have gone through, I concluded a long time ago that it wasn't for me. I was actually relieved when he told me he didn't want kids because the guy I was in a serious relationship before him wanted many. My husband is from a huge family himself and frankly I don't think there was enough affection, money, food or attention to go around. His mom and her siblings were molested as kids by older family members. I'm pretty sure one of these aunts and/or a "brother or sister" at the kh molested some of his siblings too. His feeling is that you can't watch your kids all the time and you never know who's hurting them, which is a terrible thought :(
Yes I moved and gave up a lot by leaving my home state, but it was our only option to try to have a normal relationship. I should have hammered out the details better before moving, especially the day the movers came and he told me to toss the tree. He consoled me and I thought he understood that it was too big a deal to me to not have. I should never have assumed. The way I feel now is that I should have made him put it in writing or everything was coming off the truck and I was going to stay put.
I feel manipulated and it sucks.
Giordano, yes, his reason to return was really to reunite with the family and stop the shunning. They had a brother die tragically a few years ago and it broke them all a bit. It was his closest sibling, so to return to his family was important (I thought).
Before we married I offered to look into other religions with him to try to find common ground we could both agree with. Unitarianism was one thought. He shot it down quickly because the only way back to the family was to get reinstated. I wish I had asked more questions or done my own research before we married, but I trusted that we were going to stick to our own beliefs and that was it.
If there is any more
ammoinfo anyone can provide, I would gladly appreciate it. I pray that he will be reasonable and take into consideration everything that I've been through and sacrificed to be with him. He is the love of my life, but I WILL NOT be compromising on this matter.
Marriage in JW land is NOT an equal partnership; it is not a partnership. The WTS considers the man the head, the wife to be in subjection to him. I've been out a long time, so if things have softened, I've missed it. I believe the elders would push him to do everything he can to refuse to have a tree in the house or any touch of celebration. As for children, he would fight to not have you take them to your church. I'm so sorry you do not have the marriage arrangement you signed up for, what you made your vows to. There is no equality in lives of JWs, they are right in their own eyes and must have their way. You've seen this from his mother. She'll feel she has a right to direct you, too. Unbelievers are considered by some to be weak minded. My heart goes out to you.
Ok good to know he wants to be in contact with his family as the reason he went through what he had to do to be reinstated. But you need to ask him does he really believe the BS that the non witness world understands about the WTBTS.
But you didn't marry him for his religion. If you are accepting him with his religious ideas he has to accept you with yours. You are not a believer in his religion and he is not a believer in yours.
He doesn't get to tell you what is acceptable and what is not. You are more important then his family........... if he can't make that transition you are going to have to decide what you can tolerate and what you can't.
Here's what I learned on this forum re a mixed couple........they have to find accommodations. One believes............ one does not. But within this confusion do they love one another, do they or can they respect one another? Because without that respect there can be no real and true relationship.
I've been married for 54 years to my ...... still young......... pioneer partner. She is first in my life. And while I refer to her as the love of my life and she refers to me as her current husband...................... pausing as you laugh that one out. What I am trying to say is that you need to respect and love one another. Adjustments have to be made.
Nothing can or should come between you and your relationship. Not Family, friends or a corporation pretending to be a religion.
The marriage comes first and if it doesn't then heed the advice of these many posters.
The guy you married was a guy who wasn't practicing a religion........ you didn't sign up for his religion. You want a freaking Christmas tree......... if he can't reason on that then
well..............I guess you are going to have to think this situation out.
I hope he realizes what a wonderful wife he has. It didn't take a bunch of us very long to understand who you are and what you stand for.
You have made friends here......and supporters in just one day. How is that possible?
Because we have all been through what you are going through in one form or another...........
And honestly we don't want you hurt.