Non JW wife/JW husband Christmas tree debate
Yes, he is supposed to allow you your tree, although why any person would ever feel that it is up to him to "allow" you to put up a tree or not is crazy to me. Do you throw away his Watchtowers? Why should he throw away your posessions?
When you got together he wasn't a JW, so he is the one that changed not you, so why should you be expected to make all the compromises?
But unfortunately that is the situation, he is in a cult and that cult will dictate his choices from now on, all you can do is decide if this is something you can live with.
A christmas tree is about art then religion. In fact it is not religious unless you make it that. If he didn't find it uncomfortable in the past (maybe he did but refrained from making an issue about it) what has changed? Obviously he has rejoined his religion and it compels one not to celebrate Christian. He is free not to celebrate Christmas it's your choice not his.
Perhaps he is uncomfortable about JW relatives stopping by? Or worse an Elder or a friend from his congregation. Simply tell one and all not to visit.
One solution may be that He leaves home for a few days and visits his JW family.
The modern custom of a Christmas tree does not come from any form of paganism. There is no evidence of any pagan religion decorating a special holiday tree for their mid-winter festivals...................
Late in the Middle Ages, Germans and Scandinavians placed evergreen trees inside their homes or just outside their doors to show their hope in the forthcoming spring. The first Christmas tree was decorated by Protestant Christians in 16th-century Germany. Our modern Christmas tree evolved from these early German traditions, .......................
There is nothing in the Bible that either commands or prohibits Christmas trees. It has been falsely claimed by some that Jeremiah 10:1-16 prohibits the cutting down and decorating of trees in the same manner as we do at Christmas. However, even a cursory reading of the text makes it clear that the passage is one in which Jeremiah sets forth the prohibition against idols made of wood, plated with silver and gold, and worshipped. A similar idea appears in Isaiah 44, where Isaiah speaks of the silliness of the idol-worshippers who cut down a tree, burn part of it in the fire to warm themselves, and use the other part to fashion an idol, which they then bow down to. So unless we bow down before our Christmas tree, carve it into an idol, and pray to it, these passages cannot be applied to Christmas trees.
There is no spiritual significance to having or not having a Christmas tree.
Whatever choice we make, the motive behind a believer’s decision about this, as in all matters of conscience, must be to please the Lord. Romans 14:5-6a sets out the principle in a passage about liberty: “One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord.” ................
When we feel that somehow we have achieved a higher plain of spirituality by doing or not doing something about which the Bible is silent, we misuse our freedom in Christ, create divisions within His body, and thereby dishonor the Lord. “So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God” (1 Corinthians 10:31).
The issue is how do you resolve this? For you it is an honored tradition. For him knowing he has to be the head of the house...... his duty.
That concept 'being the head of the house' must be challenged. He needs to understand that your role is equal to his. He goes to meetings takes time away from time you could share. Do you interfere with his worship time?
This is part of the compromises your marriage will have to deal with.
I find it interesting that the JW's set Thanksgiving Day aside for a family gathering (because many people are off from work on that day) and often have turkey (cause it's cheaper then) and have no problem thanking Jehovah for the Turkey.
Husband needs to understand Romans 14: 5-6 and then keep that information to himself. The Watchtower Society trumps the bible in all matters.
Thank you everyone for the replies. I've been upset all day about this, so to get home and read this all now is comforting...a bit.
I will say, I am an opinionated, tough east coast girl that had a pretty major career back home. He likes that I am so independent, have a voice and am not a pushover. All that being said, I'm a good wife and am always thinking of his needs. I think he knows better than to try to strong arm me and pull the "head of house" card. He really isn't like that, haven't seen any inkling in 4 years and I pray that he never shows me that side of himself. I would never have moved across the country for anyone that wasn't 100% good to me.
We have planned to not have kids, which I know would be a major challenge as to how they would be raised. I find it interesting but very, very sad how much I've read on this site about JW's and pedophelia. There are molesters in his family, and its a major reason he doesn't want to have kids.
He doesn't leave watchtowers around, in fact I've never seen one in the apartment. He has his bible on a kindle, so that was a good point by The Fall Guy, but sadly, its lost on this argument. I do always iron his clothes for him when he goes to his meetings. He just got accepted back in, and I was happy for him because I know it meant a lot to him and his family. I'm sure deep down they all hope I'll convert someday, but I'm never joining their cult. I've made it very clear and they seem to be ok with it.
I hope I can reason with him and cite some of the things I've read here in the comments. He is very quick to talk about pagan symbolism and Christian holidays, so I'm sure thats where the argument is heading. To me, my tree is family history, tradition, winter, beauty, art and nostalgia. I'm happy to remove any Santas or religious ornaments (or at least put them on the back of the tree!) if that's what he wants. He mentioned just decorating for winter, but the tree is the only thing I want. I don't care about other decorations. I'm happy to call it a "winter tree" or a "nostalgia tree" if that will make this go smoothly.
He said he never had a problem with my tree when I lived on my own because it wasn't "his house". He would come and stay with me 3 days a week at my apartment until I moved out here in august. If there's no compromise and I'm forbidden to put the tree up, well, that's unfortunately where our marriage will start to crack. I can't be expected to give up everything...
I will report back after we talk. Thanks again for your insight :)
So xmas trees are pagan. yep so what?
There are a whole lot of things in the day to day life of jw that are pagan in ancient origin. The wt cherry picks what it will allow what it wont. Its about power and keeping the masses happy.
Imagine the furore if the gb decided that weddings white dresses rings were all to. Go.! They are not incapable of such.
what the f*** is he going back for? I feel its the love bombing and pats on the back he will receive. You speak of child molesters known and he doesn't want kids because of this.. so the roads are dangerous so I wont have a car?
Just a few of my thoughts. I fear for you. Please this is not to early to see a counsellor.
Live long and prosper
If you were with any other person in a thousand different religions it would no problem.
He has move back into the "our way or the highway" group. I know I was there for fifty years. So no matter what he as said to you verbally. His goal from here on out with to assimilate you into the "Borg" and as they say resistance is feudal.
I am sorry to hear this and fear your JW husband is going to try and have his way with regard to the religion. I hope your marriage can survive the strain!
Just for your information: the JW religion tries to use the "pagan" excuse as to why they are against Christmas and holidays. That's BS because everything is pagan: days of the week; the months of the year; wedding rings, etc. You'd have to get off the planet to escape it.
The real reason is because they want to separate the JW from their non-JW relatives and friends. They are afraid if a JW spends time around people who are not judging them they won't want the religion anymore.
Good luck to you.
Welcome Spacegirl - I am also a UBM and Christmas time in our home is also difficult. I married an inactive jw a few decades ago and we celebrated xmas for many years. He took part in decorating including all of the outside decorations. Anytime jws would stop by he would lie and say it was all mine and he had no part in it. Fast forward 20++ years and those old jw ways and beliefs resurfaced. It got to the point that the arguments weren't worth it to me anymore and under pressure, I got rid of all my xmas decorations, including the sentimental ones. It was difficult to do and I regret it. A few years passed and I decided that I had given up enough to make the jws comfortable. I was the only one making the compromises. So I bought all new decorations and even though I'm enjoying them alone it's better than nothing. Sorry to ramble on so much about myself. My advice to you is to keep your decorations and make it clear from the beginning that you won't give up what is important to you.
I look forward to more posts from you
Men Are from Mars, Women Are from Venus
Now magnify that 10 fold.......good luck.....
The jokehovian witlesses do not compromise on anything. You cannot agree to ditch other holidays in exchange for putting up your tree for this holiday. They simply will not accept the tree. Even putting it up just in your area of the apartment or home will not be enough for these dingbats, since they feel everyone needs to live miserably.
And since the jokehovians believe he is the head, you will be forced into submission with their will. This means that he is responsible, in their eyes, if you put up a sun worship tree in the apartment. If it was the husband that was the unbeliever, then he might get away with it--further proof that joke-hova hates women. And, that he has recently been reinstated will make the hounders that much more likely to look for items like Christmas trees. You put one up, and they will go after him for allowing you to put it up. As he has recently been reinstated, chances are good that he is seeking "privileges(??)", and this could hold him up from receiving any. (And by "privileges", I mean things like commenting at washtowel boasting sessions, saying prayers in the congregation, and reading damnation book scriptures in the congregation).
I would just go ahead and put it up, but discreetly. Leave an area totally undecorated for him to be miserable in, and put your tree in your area. Let him go in field circus on Christmas day while you enjoy the holiday(s). Of greater worry, if (when) children come along, they are going to be taken to the boasting sessions and in field circus because believing husbands in these households are required to raise their children as jokehovians and not to allow them to be exposed to regular church (or no church at all), or to engage in these banned activities. They will be watching him (more than a regular jokehovian because of his reinstatement).
Welcome Spacegirl ,just make sure you lay the law down fast and hard ,otherwise he will do the bidding of the WT corporation/cult and your life will become hell.Give them an inch and they will take a mile.
By the way I`m a male not a female .All good advice from above.