Does Paul preach a fundamentally different religion than Jesus? (page 2)

krismalone

Jesus did indeed contradict YHWH. The two couldn't be more different.

The OT god was very legalistic. For example killing Aarons sons for not burning the right incense. Killing a man for picking up wood on the Sabbath. Yet Jesus preached reasonableness and aplying the spirit of the law.

The OT god sanctioned killing, taking revenge on enemies, yet Jesus taught to turn the other cheek and be forgiving.

OT god said it's OK to have slaves, beat them up (as long as they don't die within 3 days) Yet Jesus preached humility.

The OT god sanctioned poligamy, kidnapping women and rape (Deut chaps 20-22) Yet Jesus preached the golden rule of doing unto others...

OT god blessed his servants with wealth yet Jesus preached a simple eye.

It is very traumatic to accept the reality that what we have been taught to believe all our lives was just fables and myths. So our confirmation bias kicks in and many dismiss or ignore the reality that the Bible and all religious scripture for that matter is the invention of imperfect men. The contradictions are too glaring.

eyeuse2badub

The Gb of the wtbts ignores them both and preaches their own brand of religion! IMHO

just saying!

cofty

Jesus did indeed contradict YHWH. The two couldn't be more different.

When faced with awkward questions about the morality of god many christians respond by distancing themselves from the Old Testament and focusing on "gentle Jesus meek and mild" of the New Testament.

For bible-believing christians this is intellectually dishonest.

According to christian dogma Jesus was the god of Abraham Isaac and Jacob. The Logos, the Alpha and Omega who is "the same yesterday, today, and forever."

He claimed that "he that has seen me has seen the Father" and that "I and the Father are one".

In short, christians assert that Jesus is Almighty God from all eternity.

It therefore follows that Jesus was the god who ordered the nation of Israel to take slaves as inheritable possessions. Jesus instructed the armies of Joshua to commit genocide, to murder women and babies in cold blood and to kidnap virgins for sex-slaves.

Jesus of the gospels is like a Nazi leader with a new identity living like a harmless, friendly old man in South America.

Like Father Like Son...

Village Idiot

Crazyguy,
Jesus contradicts Yahweh...
Cofty,
I'm not convinced about that.

He's right cofty. For example, Moses had a man executed for gathering firewood on the Sabbath (Numbers 15:32-36.) yet Jesus was very lax (Matthew 12:1-5.). And yes, it stands to reason that Jesus be interpreted as the same god by the doctrine of the Trinity but this does not contradict the fact that there were contradictions or at the very least a contrast between Jesus and the Old Testament god.

cofty

I disagree that Jesus was lax about the sabbath. He kept the Law meticulously but refused to bow a legalistic application of it.

Christians can't have it both ways. Either Jesus is one with father in which case he approves of slavery and infanticide, or he is not one with the father and he is not the christ.

Village Idiot

Cofty,
I disagree that Jesus was lax about the sabbath. He kept the Law meticulously but refused to bow a legalistic application of it.

And killing a man for gathering firewood is not legalistic?

John_Mann

The Jews were trying to continue the original monotheistic thought that started in Egypt (Aten). Maybe Moses is the link between Aten and YHVH. Maybe he had access to the secret cult of Aten.

YHVH was just one god among many gods. And for some reason they chose YHVH to be the monotheistic God.

The purpose was to stablish monotheism.

YHVH is not the equivalent of the First Person, the Father.

YHVH is the Hebrew equivalent to the Godhead. But to Christians the Godhead is a complete mystery.

Jesus revealed the Trinity. YHVH it's not the Father.

Christianity brought a new concept beyond the Godhead. This is very complex but that's the very reason why St. Stephen was killed. His speech is about this problem of YHVH vs the Father.

OnTheWayOut

Paul never spoke of the empty tomb and the women there. His Christ who "appeared" to over 500 brothers was almost certainly a Christ of vision and myth. He said he "saw" Christ too, and we know that Paul was not literally in the presence of the man named Jesus of the Gospels. He saw the vision, the myth. Paul's Christ was not a man named Jesus who had recently lived.

Paul preached a mystic mysterious religion just like the others popular at the time. There was no mention of the virgin birth in Bethlehem or anything related to the man named Jesus.

The man Jesus, even if based on an actual person, was created by others long after Paul's existence. They created the mythology that competed with those of Zeus, Dionysus, Isis, and the like. There is bound to be major differences between messages.

Perry

Understanding Dispensations (God's progressive modes of relating to man) clears up any seeming difference between Jesus & Paul. Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Israel, but Paul was an Apostle to the gentiles.

Israel got to keep their beloved LAW (as they wished), and believing Gentiles were grafted into the family of God and inherited the gift of GRACE.

The appearance of Jesus, the long promised Messiah represented a major transitional event from one dispensation to another. Each dispensation (mode in which God deals with man), always ends with 1. The Failure of Man 2. Judgement & 3. A New Beginning.

Using a dispensational template, to "rightly divide the word of God", it becomes apparent that many of Jesus words were spoken to the Jews that were living then (before the age of Grace) AND to the Jews that will be alive during the Great Tribulation (after the age of Grace but before the Millennium). Whereas Paul's message was mainly directed to those living during the age of Grace.

AllTimeJeff

Read the Gospels. Have a notebook and take good notes. Note what speaks to you. repeat for the Pauline letters. Compare what is the same and what is different. Draw your own conclusions. Anyone who can read is just as entitled to your conclusions as "scholars".

Then, live with your conclusions. Hopefully, they won't hurt your neighbor.

Does Paul preach a fundamentally different religion than Jesus?

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