New Light on the United Nations (U.N.) (Scarlet Beast)

by UnDisfellowshipped 126 Replies latest jw friends

  • dmouse

    Wait a minute. I read this bit from the Daniel book again:

    With the disbanding of the Soviet Union in December 1991, the king of the north suffered a serious setback. Who will be this king when Daniel 11:44, 45 is fulfilled? Will he be identified with one of the countries that were part of the former Soviet Union? Or will he change identity completely, as he has done a number of times before? Will the development of nuclear weapons by additional nations result in a new arms race and have a bearing on the identity of that king? Only time will provide answers to these questions.

    So there you have it, you cynical apostates! The WBTS weren't wrong or clueless at all - the wily King of the North went and changed identities!

    No fault with the Org's speculation prophetic insight there then.

  • UnDisfellowshipped

    LOL @ Dmouse!

  • Francois

    I didn't catch this early on when this thread was just a piece of fuzz, but look at this: "...and try to attack the remaining remnant of the "Anointed" Jehovah's Witnesses and their companions, the "Great Crowd" of "Other Sheep"...

    Notice that the UN is going to "try" to attack the remnant of the "Annointed" and their companions, the Great Crowd of Other Sheep. What an absurdly unctuous point of view. I think I might hurl any minute now.

    The UN is going after the geezer crowd of JWs. What MANLY-MEN to take on a few thousands unarmed old farts who wouldn't know a muzzle from a stock butt.

    Add to that the UN is going next to take on the "companions" of these geezer-types ranging in age from infants to their own set of old farts - of both sexes.

    Some battle this is going to be. Sounds like a matchup between "The Rock" and Don Knotts.

    And how would the UN know who was who? It's just too absurd to credit.


  • one

    Interesting things and speculations:

    Obviously GB thinks they are something, king, rulers...

    Goblal dynamics will prevent UN from going out of business, it may evolve.

    As I suggested before, seem the WT has been warned to stop their inflammatory comments about politics, UN etc more than a few countries and the UN itself may not like the WT ‘editorial’ style, specially with that kind of large global circulation and marketing methods of their magazines and books.

    This is not the first time, WT was ordered to eliminate a few pages of politically incorrect comments from a book several decades ago.

    WT still believes the UN stuff, they have to or they would have to scrap the wt and build another religion, but Freddy is gone... no more gurus available the party must continue but making less noise (read inflammatory comments), neighbors are getting upset…

    Freddy’s ‘rationalitations’ or teologies are cracking here and there but still can be supported with some ‘reinforcements’ (read lies and washing), no options anyway.

    As far as I remember the king of the north was going grab the “oil”, exact word used by the WT in a very old green book, but they can fix that by interpolating symbolic entities, Freddy used the wrong bible/map.

    EOE End of speculations.

  • wednesday
    With the disbanding of the Soviet Union in December 1991, the king of the north suffered a serious setback. Who will be this king when Daniel 11:44, 45 is fulfilled? Will he be identified with one of the countries that were part of the former Soviet Union? Or will he change identity completely, as he has done a number of times before? Will the development of nuclear weapons by additional nations result in a new arms race and have a bearing on the identity of that king? Only time will provide answers to these questions

    I'm not sure the soviet union is down for the count. they are involved in helping these terriorists nations. Don't think we have not heard the last of them.

    just a wild thought, what if the king of north, is the entire eastren world, and king of south is the westren world?

  • UnDisfellowshipped

    I went to the "Special Talk" intentionally (gasp), in order to see what they are saying about the United Nations now, especially after the new 6-01-2003 Watchtower Article. Below are the interesting things that were mentioned in the "Special Talk":

    "Has Babylon's Judgment Hour Arrived?" (Special Talk, April 27th, 2003)

    First, in the prayer, the Brother asked Jehovah to make sure that this Special Talk infiltrates everyone's hearts.

    Then, the Brother who was giving the Special Talk started his Talk.

    There was absolutely NO mention of the United Nations or the Scarlet-Colored Wild Beast in the entire Talk about Babylon being destroyed!

    He quoted from the "Revelation - Its Grand Climax At Hand!" Book twice during the Talk.

    Now, here are some of the comments in the Special Talk:

    At the beginning of his Talk, the Brother said: "Babylon the Great will be destroyed by Political Powers".

    Then, later in the Talk, he said that "Jehovah was going to send Jesus and the angels, and Jesus and the angels would DIRECTLY destroy Babylon the Great."

    Then, later, he said "Jehovah is going to send Jesus and the angels to wipe the filthiness of Babylon off the face of the earth!"

    (UNDISFELLOWSHIPPED'S COMMENT: That seems very interesting -- it sounds like they may be teaching "New Light" that Babylon will be destroyed directly by Jesus and the angels, and NOT by the United Nations!)

    "Babylon the Great is made up of all religions on earth, EXCEPT for Jehovah's Witnesses."

    "There is a giant chasm between Babylon the Great and the Jehovah's Witnesses."

    "Merchants who buy and sell with Babylon will be upset when Babylon is destroyed because they will say 'Who will buy or sell our stuff now?' "

    "Babylon the Great will do anything for money, Babylon has absolutely no morals at all -- she is a harlot -- she is the madam of all harlots!"

    (UNDISFELLOWSHIPPED'S COMMENT: Please visit this Thread for some interesting information about Jehovah's Witnesses buying and selling Buildings with Babylon the Great:

    "The Anointed Ones and the Great Crowd will be very happy and joyful when Babylon the Great is destroyed!"

    "The imminent destruction of Babylon is beautiful!"

    "Babylon has absolutely no cleanliness at all!"

    "Babylon is guilty for all of the blood that has ever been shed on the entire earth -- from Abel all the way to the modern-day people!"

    "Babylon the Great has made their Churches into Voting Places and Places to Organize Army Troops for so-called 'Holy Wars'!"

    (UNDISFELLOWSHIPPED'S COMMENT: According to the November 1, 1999 Watchtower, it is now "Up to your conscience" for Jehovah's Witnesses to Vote in Political Elections)

    "Every remnant and spec of Babylon will be destroyed because she has told terrible lies about God and has caused horrible injustices to be done on earth."

    "Babylon holds fast to the traditions of men and doesn't care at all about truth."

    "Babylon tells people 'Trust me, trust me, trust me -- give me your money and I will take care of your salvation.' "

    "Babylon's main teachings are all LIES, LIES, LIES -- the Trinity, Hellfire, and the immortal soul -- ALL LIES!"

    The Brother then says he is Quoting from "Revelation Book", Page 237, and then says "The Catholic Church supported and helped Hitler and the Nazis, and the Catholic Church allowed the Holocaust to happen!"

    "It is a Bible fact that the Last Days began in 1914!"

    "Eve taught Cain to be a wicked, evil person!"

    "The Judgment of Babylon is IMMINENT!"

    "WE, yes WE are going to see the FULFILLMENT of the destruction of the 'Man of Lawlessness'!"

    "Because of world events, such as the War in Iraq, the Governing Body is now saying that Babylon the Great is in the 'Target Zone' for IMMINENT destruction!"

    "How can you get out and stay out of the 'Target Zone' of Babylon the Great? YOU MUST HAVE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH BABYLON THE GREAT!"

    "You do not even have to be a member of Babylon in order to be bloodguilty and be in the 'Target Zone'. YOU MUST BECOME A JEHOVAH'S WITNESS IN ORDER TO BE FREE FROM BLOODGUILT!"

    "People are leaving Babylon because they see so much hypocrisy!"

    "Jesus won't execute us if we stay in 'The Truth'. As long as we stay in 'The Truth' we are safe!"

    "There are a lot of things people are scared about now, there's SARS, AIDS, Anthrax, Wars -- but Jehovah's Witnesses are not scared of any of that. BUT THIS SHOULD SCARE THE DAYLIGHTS OUT OF EVERYONE -- JESUS CHRIST IS GOING TO DESTROY EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON EARTH WHO IS NOT IN THE WATCHTOWER ORGANIZATION!"

    (UNDISFELLOWSHIPPED'S COMMENT: There goes China and most of the Muslim Countries who have NEVER gotten to hear from the Jehovah's Witnesses!)

    "Jehovah's Witnesses MUST NOT get curious about any of the things that are going on outside of the Watchtower Organization right now."

    "All Jehovah's Witnesses need more time to think."

    "Having an independant attitude could cost you your life! Always trying to think about what 'rights' you have, especially in the Western World, could cost you your life!"

    "Token Field Service is NOT acceptable to Jehovah God -- Jehovah will NOT accept you if you squeeze in Field Service between the things that you have to do in life."

    "After Babylon goes down, IMMEDIATELY BILLIONS OF PEOPLE WILL BE DESTROYED BY JESUS CHRIST! Jehovah's Witnesses should REJOICE!"

    "Jehovah's Witnesses should AVOID being sentimental toward the BILLIONS of worldly people who are going to be destroyed!"

    "Being sentimental could cost you your life!"

    "Jehovah's Witnesses should AVOID being too tolerant of worldly people -- that could cost you your life!"

    "Toleration can be used to allow wicked acts to be justified, like homosexuality!"

    "I do not know if weak faith will save you -- you must strengthen your faith NOW!"

  • Guest 77
    Guest 77

    Will someone please play the song, "Send In The Clowns"

    Guest 77

  • xjw_b12

    Interesting post.

    A Question for Undisfellowshipped and others:

    On page 2 of this thread you quoted from the Isaiah book, and there are 2 expressions that caught my eye, that I have highlighted in red

    Isaiah's Prophecy - Light For All Mankind Book, Volume 1 (2000), Pages 153-154:

    20 Whom will Jehovah use to discipline rebellious Christendom? We find the answer in the 17th chapter of Revelation. There we are introduced to a harlot, "Babylon the Great," representing all the world’s false religions, including Christendom. The harlot is riding a scarlet-colored wild beast that has seven heads and ten horns. (Revelation 17:3, 5, 7-12) The wild beast represents the United Nations organization.* [FOOTNOTE SAYS: Additional information regarding the identity of the harlot and the scarlet-colored wild beast is found in chapters 34 and 35 of the book Revelation—Its Grand Climax At Hand!, published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc.] Just as the ancient Assyrian destroyed Samaria, the scarlet-colored wild beast "will hate the harlot and will make her devastated and naked, and will eat up her fleshy parts and will completely burn her with fire." (Revelation 17:16) Thus the modern-day Assyrian (nations associated with the UN) will deal Christendom a mighty blow and will crush her out of existence.

    Isaiah's Prophecy - Light For All Mankind Book, Volume 1 (2000), Pages 345-346:

    7 How does Isaiah’s prophecy apply in our day? The spiritually sick nation of Israel can be compared to unfaithful Christendom. Just as Jehovah used Assyria as a "rod" to punish Israel, so he will use a "rod" to punish Christendom—as well as the rest of the world empire of false religion, "Babylon the Great." (Isaiah 10:5; Revelation 18:2-8) That "rod" will be member nations of the United Nations—an organization pictured in Revelation as a seven-headed, ten-horned, scarlet-colored wild beast.—Revelation 17:3, 15-17.

    Unfortunately I no longer have the publications to go back and research myself, but if the 1988 Revelation book contained little or no mention of the UN, and the quotes you provided from the 2000 Isaiah book mentions ' nations that are members of the UN ' could it be that as early as 1987 the GB 's hard line against the UN was going through a metamorphosis....... shifting suspicion from the UN to its member nations ?

  • Hamas

    How many more chances are the dubs ready to give the Watchtower ?

    The list just goes on and on, and now it seems as though they are changing their minds again. What a waste of life.

    Oh what a tangled web we weave.

  • Room 215
    Room 215

    Undisfellowshipped, the speaker didn't actually say those things, did he?? That would have been one to have gotten on tape! I can just see his bloodshot eyes bulging as he strove for emphasis! What hallucinatory delusions, and I guess we can presume he wan't medicated, right?

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