What ELSE is wrong with the WT Society and JWs?

by fjtoth 33 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Farkel


    My personal thoughts?

    They will fuck you up, that's what.


  • gumby


    . Jesus washed the feet of the disciples, but JWs don't follow that example in any way, shape or form. With all the wealth the Society has accumulated, they ought to be building hospitals and homeless shelters and at least setting up soup kitchens for the needy

    When is the last time you washed someones feet herk?

    When is the last time the local church around your area built a hospital or homeless shelter.

    You say their wealth could fix problems of the needy yet I don't see churches using their wealth like this for the most part.

    If various religions would sell there belongings and meet in homes they could feed all the hungry in the world if they were that desperate to help. I realize some churches do some worthy things.....but not what they could do.

    My point is the dubs aren't too far behind the rest of them.


    And if you make anymore cartoon drawings I'm going to piss on your shoe

  • jst2laws

    Wow Ozzie,

    What our daughters need is not the downfall of the Borg. They need to see the Borg for what it really is. Just like we did. That's the challenge we have. Or maybe the prayer we have. Of course, if the lack of support for the Borg results in its downfall, so much the better.

    PROFOUND! Exactly what is wrong with any "bring the Watchtower down" mentality. It will not happen. The WT will become impotent when its supporters "see the Borg for what it really is". Then it will no longer infest new victims. (proselytes, which seem to be statistically down now)


    we need less people who think the only solution to their problems is a gun in their hand.

    Great point. Cool heads. The feelings expressed are understandable.


  • fjtoth

    A REVISED LIST, BASED ON ALL THE ABOVE Some Teachings and Practices Jehovah's Witnesses Need to Abandon in Order to Experience a True Reformation (55 Reasons why JWs will never be reformed) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. Teaching that true Christianity is an organization instead of a way of life 2. Claiming salvation is dependent upon belonging to the JW denomination 3. Claiming that the organization speaks for and is controlled by Jehovah, thereby equating the organization with God himself 4. Centralizing authority in an organization instead of letting Christ be the head of each Christian 5. Claiming that the "faithful and discreet slave" is the "anointed class" rather than each individual Christian who shows himself or herself to be responsible and obedient to Christ 6. Teaching that the early Christians were led by a governing body 7. Teaching that Jesus appointed the "anointed remnant" as his true church in 1919 8. Viewing the so-called "anointed" class (actually, the governing body) as God's channel and prophet 9. Placing WT literature above the Bible 10. Frequently taking Bible texts out of context in order to build support for the organization's man-made teachings and procedures 11. Teaching that Jesus returned in 1914 and is "invisibly present" since then 12. Teaching that Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BCE when no historical records confirm this and the actual date is believed by nearly all historians to be 587 BCE 13. Falsifying the fact that Charles Russell predicted for 1914 the end of the world, not Christ's return 14. Lying about a so-called "increase" in earthquakes, warfare, famines, persecution, etc., since 1914 15. Contradictorily condemning military organizations and frowning upon JWs who choose alternative service in lieu of military service while the headquarters organization at the same time owns stock in a military product organization (REGI) 16. Taking a conflicting stand with regard to the United Nations, claiming that it is the "wild beast" of Revelation that leads all nations in a fight against God and Christ at Armageddon, but signing on as an NGO member and publishing articles that present the UN in a favorable light 17. Teaching that it's wrong to celebrate birthdays and all holidays 18. Teaching that Abraham and the faithful men and women of old are not among the holy ones who will rule with Christ in his Kingdom 19. Interpreting Jewish restoration prophecies as fulfilled in "the anointed remnant" 20. Teaching that the Scriptures are directly addressed only to "the remnant of anointed ones" 21. Teaching that only the "anointed" must be born again 22. Teaching that the "great crowd" are not begotten or anointed by the Holy Spirit 23. Teaching that the "great crowd" are God's grandchildren and not his sons and daughters 24. Teaching that the "great crowd" are not members of the bride of Christ 25. Teaching that Jesus is not the mediator between God and the "great crowd" of Revelation chapter 7 26. Teaching that the resurrection of the "anointed" precedes the resurrection of the "other sheep" and that it has already begun 27. Teaching that only "anointed" JWs will receive immortality in the resurrection 28. Inviting only the "anointed" to partake at the memorial 29. Claiming that spiritual food comes from the "anointed" class whereas nearly all the writers of WT publications are members of the "other sheep" class 30. Creating a climate of fear by authoritarianism 31. Controlling what individual JWs may read of Bible-related publications that are not produced by the WT Society 32. Arrogantly pretending that the JW organization maintains higher standards than any other religion and proclaiming publicly that all other churches are members of Babylon the Great 33. Forbidding attendance and participation at other churches 34. Class distinctions such as "governing body," "anointed remnant" and "great crowd of other sheep" 35. Class distinctions such as publishers, auxiliary pioneers, regular pioneers, special pioneers, circuit overseers, district overseers, Bethelites, Governing Body, etc. 36. Prohibiting women from serving in any meaningful role in the congregation while expecting them to do the bulk of the work in "field service" 37. Constantly prodding the membership by means of literature, meetings and conventions to do ever more and more in the service of the organization, promoting an atmosphere where many feel their best is never good enough 38. Setting dates for Armageddon and thereby urging the membership to abandon normal living, this often resulting in the ruination of health and family life, as well as creating employment and financial hardships 39. Teachings that lead the members to believe righteousness and salvation can be earned by devoted and loyal support of the organization's slavish programs 40. Keeping meeting attendance and field service records as a gauge of an individual's spirituality 41. Organizationally requiring no blood transfusions instead of letting it be a matter of conscience, thereby cruelly informing all members that they will be shunned by the organization if they accept a transfusion that might restore health following a life-threatening accident or illness 42. Allowing their own infants and children to die instead of allowing doctors to give them necessary blood transfusions 43. Teaching that the "congregation" of Matthew 18:17 is the body of elders 44. Holding heresy trials and disciplinary hearings in secrecy from the rest of the congregation 45. Withholding information that would be helpful to persons who have been accused of wrongdoing 46. Conducting heresy trials of members who have doubts or who think differently upon the Scriptures 47. Defining apostasy as against the organization instead of against God 48. Being quick to disfellowship instead of making efforts to restore persons who have done something wrong 49. Unnecessarily and abusively shunning members even for minor infractions such as smoking or not complying with the whimsical directives of elders, thereby causing personal and family turmoil that often results in immense guilt, shame, fear, depression, bitterness, hatred, murder and suicide 50. Prohibiting fellowship with disassociated persons who show no inclination toward causing dissension 51. Showing favoritism by advising innocent victims to "leave it to Jehovah" instead of the elders taking decisive action to deal with some members who have been accused of harmful wrongdoing. 52. Ignoring or minimizing clear evidence of child molestation and other abuses simply because only one witness is available to testify against the member accused of such serious wrongdoing 53. Covering over and hiding damaging facts about the JW organization 54. In many cases, neglecting the care of their own sick and elderly members who no longer have the strength and energy to attend all the meetings and to be regular in "field service" as they did for most of their lives 55. Blatantly lying to the public by declaring to news media that members may leave the organization at any time, of their own free will and without any repercussions from the organization


    The above list can be found at my website: http://formerjw.homestead.com/steps.html

  • avengers

    Whether you realize it or not, your attitude is more likely to drive your daughters even further away from you and even more toward the JWs.

    You know you're probably right, but there are times when words don't help anymore. The biggest example we have from Jehovah God himself.
    He's gonna destroy Babylon the Great with a great violence. This is not something I said. This is not my idea. Why would you want to keep these leaders of the WT around. There is no place for organizations that deceive, lies, wreck families., etc. etc.

    In this way Jehovah is right. Get rid of this garbage and free the people. Moses said that too. "Let my people go".


  • fjtoth


    As I've stated elsewhere, I'd rather have JWs in the neighbourhood than persons such as you. Your kind of thinking is one of the BIGGEST reasons this world is such a dangerous place.

    Even your citing of Jehovah as an example of resorting to violence is idiotic. Only God is wise enough to determine who should be destroyed and who should be spared. You give none of us any reason to suspect that you have that kind of judicious wisdom. Your recommendation that people and buildings be violently bombed out of existence leads me to the conclusion that you don't know how to be reasonable in your thinking to any extent at all. You're nothing like Jehovah, Andy. Instead, you show all the appearances of being a puppet of the Devil.

    If I knew who and where you are, I'd report you immediately to the police before you get a chance to carry out any portion of your viciously evil plan. You would never get away with such kind of talk if the authorities concerned with the spread of violence and terrorism knew of your whereabouts.

  • gold_morning

    You are right on!!

    I have always said that it is funny we went door to door and asked people to question their faith..... and yet as witnesses we were not allowed to question our own!!

    To prove that they do indeed make themselves mediators between men and God ask yourselves this.

    If a disfellowshiped person repented of their sins to God personally (as they teach) and prayed thru Jesus Christ as their mediator (as they teach)...........then why can't a disfellowshped person attend the kingdom Hall and not be shunned until the elders feel they are repentive enough and grant them acceptance again before other brothers and sisters and God.



    Whoa...ok, folks...let's settle back a bit.

    There are many people who are highly charged when it comes to topics related to the WTBTS/JWs etc., and sometimes strong words, language, and phrasing are used.

    Sometimes, it is simply that. Never acted upon - wishful thinking - possibly.

    Frank, I think it is an incredible thread. Interesting, this list, which I am sure will only get longer over time.

    Andy, I doubt he'll do anything brash. Even I have had a moment where I was very upset and expounded my thoughts to written word. When we don't know a person personally on the forum, nor hear them speak, or if they do not use emoticons etc., it's really open to interpretation.

    I say we just relax a little, not get too worked up about a particular post.

    Let's step back, give it a bit of rest, then contribute in a constructive way. So many emotions, hurt and pain for those who were affected adversely by the WTBTS. We all react differently.

    I wish everyone well.

  • fjtoth


    I lost some good friends in the 9/11 terrorist bombings in NYC. I think you'd understand a bit better my response to Andy if you read his four posts at


    Personally, I wonder why very few have felt incensed enough to repudiate his incendiary messages. This is not a time for anybody to be even making jokes or wisecracks about the use of bombs and terrorism for the purpose of destroying people we don't agree with. Angry as any of us may be against the WT Society, we do more than just cross the line when we speak in such terms. There is no excuse for such foolish speech.

  • gumby


    Your recommendation that people and buildings be violently bombed out of existence leads me to the conclusion that you don't know how to be reasonable in your thinking to any extent at all. You're nothing like Jehovah, Andy. Instead, you show all the appearances of being a puppet of the Devil.

    No .....Jehovah is more like the devil. Let me explain

    Jehovah was more like hitler and the devil according to the bible.

    In this war we are in.....our soldiers TRY to kill as few civilians as possible, they are kind to those who surrender and hug them back.

    If Jehovah were in charge.....he would command like this..."go in and kill every man, woman and child. When your done killing them....., take all their shit too and keep it for yourself and put some of it the churches (the temple). Don't feel sorry after the slaughter, and let not yor heart feel bad"

    There now....isn't that the way Jehovah did things to a people he had nothing to do with that barely knew him.......and the children knew nothing of him? D

    Wasn't he more of a cold blooded killer worse than our army could ever be accused of? You can have him!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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