US Patriotism VS the Rest of the World

by Xena 107 Replies latest jw friends

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  Prisca

  Maybe some Americans (don't want to generalise here!) could use some tact when they are declaring how wonderful America is, America is the greatest, everyone should be grateful for America, etc etc. It is this type of patriotism (trying to get back to the original topic!) that comes across as in-your-face, my-country-right-or-wrong patriotism that turns gives America (and Americans) a bad name. As I stated in my original post, it does come across as ignorant because I don't believe Americans have the same opportunities to experience/learn what other countries have to offer, so in that case, how can they logically declare that America is the bestest country in the whole wide world?

  I challenged your position and the actual "points" you made.

  Hmm, y-e-a-h. By asking me what I knew about American history? How does that prove that America is the greatest country in the world, compared to other countries? If you claim that it would prove how little I know about your country, then most likely it would prove that I know much more about the history of your country than you do about mine. How many history programmes on Australian history have you watched? How many books on Australian history would you have read in your lifetime? And not just you, but Americans in general?
• 

  LyinEyes

  Who is outright saying that ........"America is the best country in the whole world, America is so wonderful, everyone should be grateful to America, etc. etc........ "? And even if some do, why does that great on your nerves so bad??

  I for one do am not so naive to think that America has no faults, or problems, and I can tell you I dont agree with everything my country does, but I can tell you I did support our troops over there and let that be known.

  I have never been to Austrailia, United Kindgom, Norway, or any place other than the USA, but I am proud to be in America for the freedoms I do have. I would never say that I think my country is better than Austrailia , UK, etc. etc. because I don't know, I am sure they are great places to live too.

  But really Prisca, if you went around praising the wonders of where you are from, why should that piss me off? Why would that grate on my nerves ? It wouldnt, I would be ,,,,,,,cool, she loves her country good for her, that's good she is proud of where she is from. Personally, I think you are trying to stir the pot, regardless of what you say,,,,,,,,,why ??? I have no idea, you seem to stir the pot quiet alot,,,,even thou you are asked to "refrain" from doing so.

  Most of this started over the support so many here had for our troops over there and hoping ,and wishing for them a safe return. Why did that make some people so mad, why were we not allowed to put a yellow ribbon on our threads,,,,,,, it was harmless. We were asked not to do it because it would cause trouble..............well 3 weeks later,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, this is still going on and there is not a yellow ribbon that caused it here lately. Now Simon suggest we limit the war talk,,,,,,,,, many have already done this, and some even refuse to read anything war related.
• 

  jurs

  I suppose I'm guilty of the pariotism that Prisca describes but I wouldn't apologize for it. I like where I live. I like the freedom and opportunities I have here. Prisca's comment that Americans are ignorant because they don't have the opportunity to experience and learn what other countries have to offer is ridiculous. Of course whe have opportunity. We are free to travel. Our satilite dishes freely bring news from all parts of the world. We have opportunity to learn through newspapers the internet and books. What do you mean we don't have opportunity????? I can see making a statement like that about China for instance. They are restricted as far as info that they can receive.

  Fortunately, I've had opportunity to travel to different countries to experience ,appreciate and learn from them. I loved Austria and Germany and could live there in heartbeat other places made me appreciate home and be thankful for what I had. I think that if someone believes that they live in the bestest counrty in the whole wide world then thats great!!! What I don't understand is why that drives other people nuts. I guess some people don't like to see other people happy and sucessful. Misery loves company.

  jurs
• 

  VeniceIT

  great post Lyin!!!!

  I don't agree with a lot this country does, and I have never stated that I did. I do hope the troops stay safe over there because well they're just doing what their told and I'd hate to see anyone get hurt.

  I have been to Au and stayed with some locals there as well up in Noosa and had a wonderful time (except for dad driving the rental car, and having to drive on the wrong side of the road and figure out the 'round abouts). I had no problem with the locals being proud of their country which they were and there is much competition between AU and NZ about who's country is better and I just thought it was fun to finally be able to voice that kind of thing.

  And calling people ignorant on a general scale is in my mind equally as ignorant. I mean hellooo you don't know each persons experince or opinions. and there is noo need for anyone to get all high and mighty over this or their intentions.

  Ven
• 

  xenawarrior

  It is this type of patriotism (trying to get back to the original topic!) that comes across as in-your-face, my-country-right-or-wrong patriotism that turns gives America (and Americans) a bad name. As I stated in my original post, it does come across as ignorant because I don't believe Americans have the same opportunities to experience/learn what other countries have to offer, so in that case, how can they logically declare that America is the bestest country in the whole wide world?

  Actually Prisca I think if you read what folks are actually saying I don't see them here saying that America is the "bestest country in the whole wide world" or "my country-right-or-wrong". What I have seen here consistently is alot of Americans saying over and over that they love their country and they DON'T believe in all of the stuff that is happening or has happened or all of our policies etc. You find something different for me in the general postings of the many Americans on this board and I might agree with you.

  Hmm, y-e-a-h. By asking me what I knew about American history? How does that prove that America is the greatest country in the world, compared to other countries?

  I have never said this. Ever. I do believe that we have a great country but I also see other countries having better systems in place for certain things. I am objective about this and I think the theme here is that so many other American are also.

  You seem to throw us all into a basket based on how your view of us as Americans was formed through media and other sources which aren't quite the actual representation of our country and our citizens. The same media that slants other things in one way or another slants our country and it's citizens as well.

  If you are really interested in getting a reasonable and real view of Americans- read what the reasonable folks on this board are saying. Set aside the opinions you have formed and listen to the folks here describe how they really feel. The don't feel it's our country right or wrong. They don't blindly follow our government nor do they believe everything coming out of any administration in office here no matter what party is in office. They aren't war-mongers and they don't feel the majority of the way you think they do. And there are alot of them here.

  And give us some credit Prisca- we do have education and we do have knowledge of other cultures and countries whether folks have ever left the states or not. Your view that people have to travel to amass knowledge is simply baseless. My mother has left the country maybe twice to go to Mexico and she has more knowledge of other cultures and countries than anyone I know. My grandmother never made it past the 8th grade because she was needed at home on the farm and she is one of the most intelligent and knowledgeable people around- about us and other cultures.

  Hmm, y-e-a-h. By asking me what I knew about American history? How does that prove that America is the greatest country in the world, compared to other countries? If you claim that it would prove how little I know about your country, then most likely it would prove that I know much more about the history of your country than you do about mine. How many history programmes on Australian history have you watched? How many books on Australian history would you have read in your lifetime? And not just you, but Americans in general?

  It doesn't matter Prisca- I wasn't slamming your country or it's citizens. If you are going to slam our country and it's citizens and have such a negative opinion formed about us I don't think it's unreasonable to ask you just how that opinion was formed. How much actual knowledge went into the forming of that opinion. You say that we are blindly patriotic. How did you get to that opinion? Based on what you have read in the media or have seen on television? That is hardly a true depiction of us. If I was slamming Australia or it's citizens you would have every right to ask me how that opinion was formed. The point is that I wouldn't slam your country or it's citizens. "In your face" eh? Hardly.

  XW
• 

  Xena

  WOOHOO four pages!!!!! uuummm that is, it's nice to see everyone expressing themselves in such a delightful manner....bar a flame here or there....

  Sadie5 - I liked the way you explained the expression of "best in the world" It being best in the sense this where we are at and we are happy here, so for us it is the best.....maybe not the best for you or for someone else, but the best for us. lol we don't expect you to agree with us, we expect you to think your country is the best too...

  Funny thing I think we expect other people to feel the same way about THEIR country that we feel about ours....so we can't understand why you can't understand why we feel the way we do...did you follow me there??? lol

  Simon, I am curious if you saw this statement:

  I have found most British men to be f**king idiots

  Wouldn't you want to tell the person who said that, that not MOST British men are f**king idiots? Some might be, but surely not MOST????

  Englishman - Now this was very thought provoking for me anyway:
  

  Now this kind of patriotism gets passed down through the generations, and is particularly necessary when a country hasn't inherited the same sense of history that Europeans have. In a way, the new country strives mightily to create it's own history through it's achievements, which is what we are seeing in the US today.

  So how do you suppose the patriotism will change in the US as it ages? Will we become more like the Europeans? Actually I think as the internet grows and more people meet and mix like we are doing here the lines between ALL the countires will become more blurred...we will become more aware of the fact that we are all just people.

  lol enjoyed the rant safe...hope school and life are treating you well

  I don't have any problem with people being critical of AMERICA. I DO have a problem with what I perceive to be double standards and lumping the majority of us together as "ignorant" and "blind".

  Same here!

  nowisee -

  blind nationalism/patriotism is very frightening to me.

  Isn't it though? Any kind of blind faith is scary. It is just so mindless....
  

  and i do think that the us has seen a lot of it particularly since 9ll, much of it certainly rooted in fear rather than love.

  That's interesting I hadn't thought about the motivation for the surge in patriotism....I mean I knew it centered on 9-ll but I never really looked at it from that angle....hhhmmm I am not so sure about fear though....more like anger maybe or outrage....just my thoughts of coures...but yes I agree at this moment in history love of country probably isn't the prime motivator...

  forward - I agree with you on that insurance stuff...total scam...you have to have it...and you have to buy it..and it isn't regulated..lol and if you can't afford it they give you a ticket to pay so now you REALLY can't afford it.....I am not sure though I would relate corporations with Saddam...while they do cause financial ruin...which is extremely devistating..they don't torture and kill innocent people themselves.

  lol heck lying I don't know about you but I have a hard time understanding those yanks up north that post on here So how can anyone from another country imply that they understand ALL of us?

  lol yes Tim, imagine that

  Realist -

  i think it was time a girl takes over

  You DO NOT EVEN want to be me started on why women should run things instead of men!!!!!

  Glad to hear you enjoyed your tiime in the States! Where did you go? So you are from austria huh? lol I was wondering after reading some of your posts...you were obviously NOT from the US...I visited austria once when I was very young..all I remember was beautiful trees and icy cold streams that we waded in once on the side of the road..oh and we went to a salt mine and I got to lick the pillar of salt and slide down some type of chute....that was really more information than you needed wasn't it???

  Nice to hear you only have a few weirdos..*sigh* wish we could say the same...

  BG-

  Granted, I will agree that American's, as a whole, can be rather obnoxious with their patriotism and pride of country

  You really think that as a whole we are that way? I would have defined it as a smaller portion....I would say from my perspective that only about 1/4 of Americans are this way....I mean obnoxious with it...I would put as a people who are patriotic in moderation at the majority level. Course it depends to on how you define obnoxious patriotism..I mean for some it is just saying you support the war...for others it takes a bit more...

  Hey Email haven't seen you in awhile..

  manon you need to write a travel brochure for the US...lol after reading your post I wanted to visit here! I think people tend to forget how many different ethnic, cultural and national groups we have in our "melting pot" of a nation....

  Pleasuredome - might I ask, what is troopping the color? and the edinburg tattoo?

  Ok I am taking a break from this book I am writing...(everyone breathes a sigh of relief)

  BUT I will be back...unless it gets locked
• 

  jurs

  I wanted to add one more thing about us IGNORANT Americans. I happen to have worked with 4 Russians, 1 Indian from India, Mexicans,Cubans, Germans ect. ect. Prisca, in case you didn't know it, America is a big ol melting pot. I've learned alot of interesing tidbits and swear words from all parts of the world by visiting with those in my own community.

  jurs
• 

  manon

  Xena that's so funny. The way to combat anti american sentiment is to send out an invitation. Again, I stand on my original post. If you feel you dislike america/americans you definitly need to have a vacation here a nice long one. Promise you'll have a change of heart.
• 

  Farkel

  xena,

  Please frame your question. You talked around your real question, but you didn't frame it. When you can frame it, I will do my best to answer it with my point-of-view. Put it forward succinctly and directly. Save the stories and dialogue for later discussions on the subject. Threads go smoothly this way. People don't have to wonder how to figure out what you are saying/asking because they think you don't exactly know what YOU are saying/asking.

  Help us out here.

  Farkel
• 

  Farkel

  Prisca,

  : By asking me what I knew about American history? How does that prove that America is the greatest country in the world, compared to other countries?

  That question proves nothing. You are right.

  : If you claim that it would prove how little I know about your country, then most likely it would prove that I know much more about the history of your country than you do about mine.

  That rebuttal is utterly stupid, Prisca. Let's see why:

  "A" claims that Prisca knows very little about about "A's" country.

  Prisca rebuts that that proves Prisca knows MORE about "A's" Country because "A" claimed that Prisca knew little about "A's" Country.

  Arguments don't get more stupid than that, folks.

  Prisca continues with her red-herring:

  : How many history programmes on Australian history have you watched? How many books on Australian history would you have read in your lifetime? And not just you, but Americans in general?

  Of course, lots of Americans love the Ossies (me too) and of course, lots of Americans watch a LOT of shows about Australian history and Culture. But that is a just a red herring, as I said.

  What do YOU know about American History, Prisca? Well? That WAS your challenge, and you ignore it. The challenge was not about how much your challenger knew about Australian history, but about how much YOU knew about American history. Answer the challenge, or shut up. Your call.

  If you take that dare, THEN we'll discuss why America IS the greatest Country that ever existed in the entire history of mankind. (Despite its problems which I'm well aware about.)

  Farkel