by justhuman 34 Replies latest jw friends

  • blackguard

    Hi, Psychology literature which I've read claims that subliminal conditioning is effective, but not upon all people. Is the Watchtower spiritistic? My research says unequivocally, Yes. It has been since its inception. Is it FreeMasonic? Yes and no. Freemasonry until recent times has been relatively secretive. But Illuminism which is a secret society within FreeMasonry is still such. Russell and all his corporate successors have been following a Marxist agenda that's dictated by Illuminists. But to think this way one runs the risk of being labelled as some sort of weirdo or conspiracist. Besides, everyone knows today that only Moslems are conspiratorial---Right? Enron executives didn't conspire to defraud: Tony Blair's Iraq dossier isn't a conspiracy to decieve: The secret US-COG scheme isn't the result of covert planning:The corporate Watchtower was never affiliated with the UN and it doesn't hold stocks and doesn't make beaucoup bucks trading on the bourses. So it doesn't behoove anyone who thinks outside the reality presented by the six o'clock news to say anything different---no-one's gonna listen.

  • abbagail

    Is this the paragraph you were referring to, Brummie? Page 124, Paragraph 17, of the Grand Climax book:

    The Great Crowd Makes Its Appearance
    From the time of the apostle John and on into the Lord's day, anointed Christians were puzzled as to the identity of the great crowd. It is fitting, then, that one of the 24 elders, representing anointed ones already in heaven, should stir John's thinking by raising a pertinent question. "And in response one of the elders said to me: 'These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?' So right away I said to him: 'My lord, you are the one that knows.'" (Revelation 7:13,14a). Yes, that elder could locate the answer and give it to John. This suggests that resurrected ones of the 24-elders group may be involved in the communicating of divine truths today. For their part, those of the John class on earth got to learn the identity of the great crowd by closely observing what Jehovah was performing in their midst. They were quick to appreciate the dazzling flash of divine light that emblazoned the theocratic firmament in 1935, at Jehovah's due time,

    If they are "communicating," they are still giving out erroneous info, lol! And love that word, firmament, lol.

  • Utopian_Raindrops

    Brummie and Grits,

    I am so embarrassed to say that when I went to my shelf to look up that paragraph in my old Revelation Book not only did I find the quote but also it was HIGH LIGHTED in BRIGHT PINK!!!!!!!

    I must have been so EXCITED to learn of the spiritistic practices of My Anointed Saviors of whose skirts I was clinging too!!!

    I am sooooooo happy for this sight!!!!

    If not for this forum I would have been forever lost!!!!

    {{{{{{{{{Hugz}}}}}}} EVERYONE HERE!!!!!

    Gotta Luvz U Guyz!!!!


    P.S. Whats with the face in the angels hand? Its in my book too. Very weird.

    Edited by - Utopian_raindrops on 11 February 2003 5:35:17

  • Brummie

    I dont believe the Watchtowers subliminal imagery has any effect other than tricking the eye. I wouldnt know why its hidden in the pictures, the ball is in their court to explain why.

    Larc, did Ron put a good argument forward? Would be interesting to hear the compelling evidence that CT wasn't a freemason. Is all I have seen so far is a couple of quotes from Russel that ask people not to be part of the masons, this is no evidence to suggest that he himself wasnt a mason. Russel himself also admitted to joining pagan eastern religions before he founded the Watchtower, later he would shun such and that could be used to assume he never was part of them, but he was.

    Its true that the masonic symbols appearing all over WT literature doesnt prove that he was a mason, but they certainly do not prove he wasnt.


    Some of you know a great deal more about Freemasonry than I do, and I am not here to say anything against it, because I do not know anything to say, and I do not know as I would say it if I did know it. 1908; Convention Question Meeting ("The Question Book" pg. 318)

    He speaks like he doesnt know enough about masonary to speak out against it. However he was very familiar with the Masons and his language in his earlier writings was full of masonic garb.How can some just assume that ALL the evidence is merely a conspiracy theory against Russel. Using that line of argument could free anyone from being a mason, even its founder.

    Its an interesting topic...I think Fritz Springmeiers "The Watchtower and the Masons" evidence is far more compelling, though I was about to throw the book out because I thought it was tripe, I stuck with it and it turned out better than I thought.


    Edited because I am up on my posting limit:

    Grits...THANKS, I didnt want to getting that disgusting book from up the loft, yes U_R I too underlined it while at bookstudy, but with a yellow pen (tis a male thing, pink isnt cool right?) ...bwahahahaahaha
    Grits yes that is the quote, shows they dont have a clue who is guiding them. If they knew it was the Holy Spirit they would never have to suggest it was anyone else.

    Edited by - Brummie on 11 February 2003 5:43:39

  • greven

    A lot of artists put sublimal images in their paintings just for fun. Sometimes this is also an identifying factor. I think the artists for the WT publications, knowing it would be published anonymously (sp?) 'signed' their artwork in that way. There are faces and objects that shouln't be there. They are easy to see once you try to find them. Ofcourse the WT doesn't like it and uses a tried and tested tactic: flat-out denial. even accusing people of finding fault. claiming they see evil things because they are evil, or think that way.


    Edited by - greven on 11 February 2003 5:47:22

  • berten

    >How many of you out there you believe that the WT it is still involved in spiritism?

    I think the WTS is an excellent front for a satanic organization,because in these

    groups everything is reversed.To the outside they pretend to be against anything

    connected to spiritism and satanism, methinks they fulminate *way* too much against it.

    Whether you believe in satanism or not (I certainly don't ) is beside the point,*they*

    believe it to be effective and so they prey on the "psychic energy" coming from their followers

    who devote most of their time and energy to this belief system...

  • abbagail

    Good point Brummie re the FDS should know the Holy Spirit is the "helper" to guide them in understanding of scripture and prophecy. Tsk Tsk on them. What in the world were they thinking with that "guess" in the Climax book? Simply amazing. Thanks for pointing that out. As usual, it had gone right over my head back in "the day." I loved and hated that Revelation book, all at the same time. Parts of it I found thrilling. Yet I distinctly remember the knot in my stomach at the frequency they used the word "organization" and their too-numerous-for-comfort efforts to "force" the prophecies to apply to themselves.

    Re Russell/Freemasons, etc., I find it all fascinating and wonder: Why would Russell have put their symbols on his WT if he wasn't?

    To what Greven said about subliminal images in artwork "just for fun." We used to do a similar thing when I did paste-up for a newspaper years ago (before computers). My associate's favorite thing to do would be to add a third arm/hand/leg or foot in a photograph, and after publication of the paper, wait to see who would notice it. Then we'd all crack up laughing. The boss, however, never thought it was funny, lol! If anyone ever watches Jay Leno's "Headlines," he frequently shows things such as this.

    But as far as the WT Art Dept. doing it, tsk tsk. I guess boys will be boys... I wonder if they were given their "walking papers" when they were caught? "Here's your severance pay, five bucks, now off with you!"

    Lastly, to UR: Your excitement is contagious. There's been many topics on this subject, some with many more pictures scanned in than what have been posted here. Do a search for "subliminal" and you will get 120 links to check out, some of which have these titles (too many to post the direct URLs). Have fun with them!

    Watch Tower subliminal techniques
    Please Help To Find Ram's Head Subliminal Image
    Subliminal image
    Subliminal Messages?
    Watchtower methods of subliminal messages
    More subliminal messages
    Subliminal or Not Subliminal What was the question
    Is there a SUBLIMINAL ART conspiracy?
    Subliminal Messages In WT Pictures???
    subliminal pictures in WT publications
    Subliminal Messages In WT Pictures???
    New subliminal picture
    WT Subliminal images
    The hidden meaning in WT subliminal art
    Pictures in French/Italian editions of the WT
    Occult pictures in JW books?
    Occult symbol in the WTS literature?
    Is There "Something Of The Night" There?
    JW pictures
    Is there porn in the wt-literature?
    A few tidbets worth bookmarking...(Kent)
    SEX, WTS, & Advertising!
    The Hour Of Darkness
    Satanic symbol in the WT literature?
    Quick review of several OTHER Books on the WT
    New Designs for Bethel Submitted Last week
    Has anyone played a JW song backwards?
    Jesus check this out.
    Borg Hypnosis?
    Satanic pictures in Wt Pubs?
    Whats wrong with this picture??
    Russell-Illuminati Connection article - D. Icke
    Is There Something Sinister At The KH?

  • avengers
    RR, who is a Bible Student, has shown that Russell never said he was a Mason, from quotes from Russell's own words

    Here are Russel's own words: "

    If that doesn't say Russel is a mason, then I don't know what does.

    And still he's not a Mason. How do you like them apples?

  • Guest 77
    Guest 77

    Avengers, would you kindly name the Pub & date of the info you submitted? Are you aware that there is a 'visable' and an 'invisable' element of the Masons?

    Guest 77

  • Sirona


    I think that there are things within the watchtower pictures that should not be there. Personally I think it was something the artists did for some unknown reason, I don't believe it was done as subliminal messaging.

    As for spiritism in the JWs, if you are talking about occult stuff, I would say not, but then nothing would surprise me about them.


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