Judge Bans Shunning

by Farkel 83 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

  • Focus
    Focus

    Skeptically Yours wrote:

    I wouldn't be surprised if down the line the WT receives 'new light' which decides that shunning is a thing of the past

    Really? I'm skeptical.

    FAR, FAR, FAR down the line, "Skeptically Yours" (I'd suggest a change to a handle more along the lines of "uncritical, starry-eyed optimist" if your opinion is a considered one).

    Destroy SHUNNING and there will be an EXODUS away from the cult. Shunning is the main factor preventing such a happening.

    Shunning is a cornerstone of the Whoreganization we so love.

    --
    Focus
    (Know thine Enemy better than thine Friend Class)

    Edited by - Focus on 21 December 2002 22:51:57

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Myownseph,

    : We're talking about some slippery dudes here, especially when they bring their big guns out in court.

    The "big guns" part is a cultural myth. They don't have any "big guns" anymore. Haydn Covington was the closest thing they ever had to one, but he's long dead.

    Their lawyers are CULTISTS, fer heaven's sake. Brilliant lawyers (like Vincent Bugliosi) are logical thinkers. Cultists are NOT logical thinkers. If they were, they wouldn't be Cultists.

    Recently, in case-after-case-after-case Watchtower Lawyers have been majorly bashed by Judges for their lies, deceptions and unethical behavior.

    Don't make the mistake of thinking the WTS has heavyweight lawyers on their side. When they need those types of lawyers, they pay for them. On the outside and in the REAL world. What great lawyer (even a Cult one) would only make his talents available for a Cult who pays him ninety bucks a month, gives him a little room, works him for long hours and then checks his bedsheets for for self-induced semen stains every day? Lawyers must attend SEVEN years of college and then pass a test which typically only approves about half of those who were tested.

    The Staff Watchtower lawyers are all toadies and lackeys. No big guns there. Just paper-pushers and liability experts.

    The Watchtower Publishing Corporation is just a paper Tiger that has bluffed its way through its entire existence. One stroke of the pen from ONE single Judge can bring their pathetic house of cards down.

    As JT so brilliantly put it, these people who seem so formidable are merely the "cheese cracker men" who hand out free samples at WallMart.

    Don't overestimate them. Times are changing and people are more sensitive to issues like the mental abuse of children than they were several decades ago when the WT won a bunch of cases that allowed them to shun anyone and everything they chose to shun at will.

    This is a brand new day. The Watchtower Corporation hasn't won a truly significant case since Covington. And that was decades ago.

    As I said, this is a brand new day, and the Watchtower Corporation only has as much power as their dupes and those who fear them give them. They really ARE a paper Tiger. Enron Corporation had more money and assets than the WTS ever DREAMED of having, and they were brought down to poverty in a matter of weeks.

    Farkel

  • rocketman
    rocketman

    Extremely interesting post Farkel, thanks. I look forward to perhaps more news on this in the near future.

  • Focus
    Focus

    What Farkels says about WTS "big gun" in-house attorneys is absolutely correct. There ain't any.

    It was only a family court, and it was specific circumstances being discussed (effect of shunning of mother on children). But it is a brilliant start.

    Enron Corporation had more money and assets than the WTS ever DREAMED of having,

    Well, the G.B. may have had dreams... who is to know?

    and they were brought down to poverty in a matter of weeks.

    Not unless you belong to the Arthur Andersen Cult (now disbanded). What happened in the "matter of weeks" was that an already nearly bankrupt corp (which the public saw as still being super-rich) was shown beyond doubt to be in dire straits. The problem itself (as distinct from the perception) had developed over a much longer period - years - thanks to shameful practices inside it and on the part of its cult advisers, allowing so many of its execs to cash in and become overnight multimillionaires. The "matter of weeks" refers to the time the bubble took to burst in the public eye.

    The analogy is even better, perhaps. Who knows what cases the Watchtower knows are coming - but we do not?

    --
    Focus
    (Pickax Class)

  • Voyager
    Voyager

    IT'S MILLER TIME, Finally a Judge with some guts, and heart.

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Uh, Focus,

    : What happened in the "matter of weeks" was that an already nearly bankrupt corp (which the public saw as still being super-rich) was shown beyond doubt to be in dire straits.

    The Society is moving its printing operations from Brooklyn elsewhere. It is not taking on any "new boys," and it is getting rid of approximately 1,000 current Bethel-Lites(tm) (let the reader use discernment). It's obvious it is making plans to leave Brooklyn sooner-or-later. Even a dummy like me can see that. Why? The Brooklyn real estate is on the cusp of the East River and the Brooklyn Bridge and is worth a bloody FORTUNE, that's why. Upstate New York property and Patterson, NJ properties are worth far less, or at least the dirt is. The dirt is everything. Any developer who bought Watchtower properties in Brooklyn would demolish their tacky and ugly structures straight away. I cannot think of any real estate in the Near-Manhattan area that would possibly be coming on the market as valuable as the WTS's properties which are just-a-Bridge-away from Manhattan and on the RIVER!

    : What happened in the "matter of weeks" was that an already nearly bankrupt corp (which the public saw as still being super-rich) was shown beyond doubt to be in dire straits.

    If my assertion is to be believed, then they MUST get some CASH to protect themselves, and SOON! What better way to do this than to dispose of some of the most valuable Real Estate in Brooklyn?

    But you could ALWAYS clean my TOILET! LOL! (I love that bit you did about that!)

    Farkel

    Edited by - Farkel on 22 December 2002 4:6:58

  • Focus
    Focus

    Farkel:

    An alternative interpretation is that the WTS wants to cash in before there is a drop in real estate values in these uncertain times. And their "brush with Armageddon" on 9/11 may have frightened the Baboon Class (Gibbering "kind").

    But you could ALWAYS clean my TOILET! LOL! (I love that bit you did about that!)

    Well, the URL will not work, but:

    Want to spend eternity with the jWs? Or even a thousand years? NO WAY!!!

    Take a peek into the Orwellian World of the Jehovah's Witlesses - God's
    ONLY People (they claim), the CHOSEN ONES (they claim) - and basically the
    ONLY ONES (hangers-on included here) who have a chance of surviving the
    terrible Armageddon their depraved monster of a "JehoooBAH Gawd" is going
    to imminently land on mankind - killing 6,000,000,000 people, including
    2,000,000,000 kids while so doing (errm, they claim). These "spiritual
    beings" sure get their jollies from this, don't they? ;-)

    I am told you can surf on down to:

    http://discussion.witnesses.net/Forum34/HTML/002073.html

    and read the thread "What [to] do if...". It is really rich, so don't miss
    it. First some poor innocent jDub indulges in a bit of innocent
    post-slaughter speculation:

    "In the way the New World is depicted in our magazines, it seemed that
    were somehow bound to be animal-loving farmers. I have never ever had any
    wish to be a farmer and honestly I am not a great lover of animals either,
    I mean I have no wish to have a dog or cat or whatever".

    Predictably braindead responses th this include comments on "how to train
    the lion not to tease your dog" (yes, exactly that - the kooky things they
    believe is unbelievable. Remember "higher education" is from Satan, the
    Watchtower maintained, so it is not surprising..)

    "I can't imagine we'll be just farming all day long" (heh - no, you'll be
    cleaning toilets - read on)

    "About the gardening bit, friends, you have a 1,000 years to learn & also
    to get used to it. Who will make the beautiful park or garden? That other
    guy? Look, the first 500 years are the worst; after that - a breeze." (well
    - almost half a wit).

    Then a smarter one with: "You know what? Mankind can imitate anything.
    We can swim, we can sail, we can climb, we can breathe under water, we can
    fly, we can exit the atmosphere, we can communicate audibly and visually
    thousands of miles apart, we can do anything that another species of
    creature can do. Do you really think it logical that we will go backwards
    and not utilise these gifts from Jehovah? Yep, we may have the land and the
    animals and the crops...but there will be a cellular phone and video
    somewhere too, and Ill be flying in your new machine from Hawaii in my
    environmentally friendly aircraft ". (At last some common-sense and
    hunor - after all, if God gave us brains, were they intended to be wasted?)

    Now the response - from a JEHOVAH'S WITNESS WITNET FORUM *MODERATOR* (in
    other forums) to this was the viciously cruel:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    No smiley, nothing. What an unspiritual, hateful thing to say. There had
    been no insult given to him, or mention made of him, anywhere in the thread
    (or anywhere else I could find).

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    A true advertisement for GOD'S CHOSEN PEOPLE - hahahahahaha!!!!!

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Fancy living for a thousand years with someone like that in authority..
    must make "Paradise Earth" a lot less desirable to most thinking JDubs.
    Sure he'll change - sure. Just look at the demon photo. No words needed.

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    I wonder if that is what JDubs really face on their precious "Paradise
    Earth" (after the forces of law and order and civilization - errrm us -
    have all been slaughtered by dear old Jehovah)

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Why does reading this make me think of Watchtower ex-President "Booze"
    Rutherford's infamous attempt to hitch the Jehovah's Witnesses to the
    Hitler's Nazi Party? Don't believe me? I'll quote from their own 1934
    yearbook - my comments in square brackets. By this time Hitler had been in
    power for a few years and the Jew-baiting and Jew-beating and ghettoization
    policies of the Nazis were well under way. Not to mention that Hitler had
    published his infamous "Mein Kampf", setting out his whole racist ideology
    and genocidal masterplan ten years earlier, and this book had huge
    worldwide circulation... But this is what the Jehovah's Witnesses planned:

    "'Declaration of Facts'.. The greatest and the most oppressive empire on
    earth is the Anglo-American empire. By that is meant the British Empire, of
    which the United States of America forms a part. It has been the commercial
    Jews of the British-American empire that have built up and carried on Big
    Business as a means of exploiting and oppressing the peoples of many
    nations. This fact particularly applies to the cities of London and New
    York, the stronghold of Big Business. This fact is so manifest in America
    that there is a proverb concerning the city of New York which says: The
    Jews own it, the Irish Catholics rule it, and the Americans pay the bills..
    The present [Nazi] government of Germany has declared emphatically against
    Big Business oppressors and in opposition to the wrongful religious
    influence in the political affairs of the nations. Such is exactly our
    position.. Instead of being against the principles advocated by the
    government of [Nazi] Germany, we stand squarely for such principles, and
    point out that Jehovah God through Christ Jesus will bring about the full
    realization of these principles .. [We] are fighting for the same high,
    ethical goals and ideals that the national [Nazi] German Reich proclaimed
    regarding the relationship of man to God .. there are no opposing views ..
    but that, to the contrary, respecting the purely religious and apolitical
    goals .. these are in complete harmony with .. the [Nazi] National
    Government of the German Reich.. A careful examination of our books and
    literature will disclose the fact that the very high ideals held and
    promulgated by the present national [Nazi] government are set forth in and
    endorsed and strongly emphasized in our publications and show that Jehovah
    God will see to it that these high ideals in due time will be attained by
    all persons who love righteousness.. Let us remind the government and the
    people of Germany, that it was the League of Nations compact that laid upon
    the shoulders of the German people the great unjust and unbearable burdens.
    That the League of Nations compact was not brought forth by the friends of
    Germany." {YEARBOOK OF THE JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES 1934 p134-8}

    Of course the "revisionists" have done their best to explain away this
    highly damaging fact about the chosen Faithful and Discreet Slave.. Thirty
    years the Watchtower dishonestly misrepresented their position with
    "Shortly after the United States was plunged into World War II [December
    1941], information on this Nazi plan was gleaned from seized Nazi
    documents.. This plan aimed at a Nazi world order that Hitler, if
    successful in World War II, would mercilessly enforce upon the world and
    mankind". What a farce. Of course the Watchtower are attempting to make out
    they had no clue as to what was happening in Germany in 1934 - especially
    to Jews, Gypsies, Mentally Ill people and intellectuals, notwithstanding
    'Mein Kampf' or all the press reports or the widespread immigration of
    German Jews into the US or the reports from local jWs... No... The rest of
    the world knew that Germany was not a place to be for freedom loving people
    or "undesirables" - but the Watchtower offered the Nazis the assistance of
    Jehovah in attaining their ideals.

    Now back to:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Good upbuilding material (what the author is forever calling for focus
    upon). I am not exactly sure why I was minded of the jW-Nazi linkup.
    Probably because authoritarianism and uncalled-for rudeness and arrogance
    and obvious utter contempt for another shows so clearly with:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Yadirf, mark well your spiritual brother!

    Shocking then that the perpetrator (on March 2, 2000) of this OUTRAGE never
    even apologized or came close to it. I waited for two whole weeks for him
    to do so before giving vent to this. No - far from apologize; while I
    waited, other outrages and demoniac transgressions followed - click on his
    profile (next to his 'toilet'), follow his posts and you will soon see what
    I mean. In his mind, his target may have been either an apostate
    infiltrator ("a vomit-eating dog", soon to become dogmeat at Armageddon
    according to the jW's idiotic, God-demeaning beliefs and therefore worthy
    of nothing but hate and contempt) or a weak "sheep" (good jW theocratic
    term) available to do slave work after Armageddon. Or something else. Who
    knows. I am sure glad I do not live inside that kind of a "mind" ;-)

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    The frightened jWs did not even protest at this outrageous insult. They
    just sort of side-stepped it. After all, God's People are United (LOL!!!)

    This was a MODERATOR person writing, note. Could he be the "mad padlocker"
    (clearly some term that has special hidden technical meaning, understood by
    at least two wise ones?)

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Ask yourself - what sort of a person could write that? 100 seconds in the
    company of such a truly uncaring a one sounds too long for me - so
    300,000,000 times longer than that must sound like Hell...

    Actually, God might be quite smart. We all get killed at Armageddon and go
    to Heaven. The jWs are left on earth with each other as punishment for
    their wickedness.... ;-) LOL!

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Check it out at

    http://discussion.witnesses.net/Forum34/HTML/002073.html

    Good Jehovah's Witnesses policy. What they don't like you to see and what
    really lies behind their Great Lie...

    Now in a post a couple of days ago I listed 260+ Classes into which the
    crazy Watchtower has subdivided people - looking just at the reign of their
    first President Russell. If I were to modernize it I can see I would have
    to add to the existing First Class of jWs (anointed) and Second Class of
    jWs (others, sorry, no heaven, no access to Christ) which anyway was going
    to have a hundred subdivisions, there is a

    Toilet-cleaning Class of jW

    Charming people, these Watchtowerites.....

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Hilariously, the story gets better. Unknown to virtually all on Witnet, I
    have been assisting them by providing fine spiritual food at at the
    appropriate time using non-angelic (but "angelic") non-inspired (but
    inspiring) and "prophetic" (but not prophetic) channelling... (all
    hilarious jW magic words). To my horror, this has caused dissension amongst
    God's united people. I think the slow realization that one's such as I
    exist deeply within the breast of mother is more than some of these
    confused people can take... ;-))

    Ah well... such is life. Even for the toilet cleaners (myself included!).

    Certain things were caused to happen in a certain way with Jah's help
    (that's my poodle's name) and the next we know is that we have:

    http://discussion.witnesses.net/Forum34/HTML/002201.html

    Which is UNMISSABLE.

    Topic: Are you mixing in company with these...

    Now, the same dork, who thinks it is fine to abuse his "Brother" with no
    cause whatsoever with filth like:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    has found that the power he was claiming (shutting all sorts of threads as
    soon as there was a whiff of anything he did not like .. which left little
    remaining - LOL) via the "New Direction" sub-version of "New Light", was -
    ahem - subject to "Sic transit gloria mundi"... ;-)

    I shall draw a veil over other occurrences, for the time is not yet ripe
    for it. So a quote must suffice (same dork):

    ".. 1Cor 5:11 'But now I am writing you to quit mixing in company with
    anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an
    idolater or a REVILER or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with
    such a man. Look up the Synonyms. {vituperate, scold}. A reviler openly
    criticizes or spreads negative information about. Publicly debating and
    name calling has been the nature of the day in the 'Main Forum'. [..]
    Brothers and Sisters this is not how we have been admonished to act. From
    this point forward I am not mixing in the company of these...are you?"

    Of course this said he could hardly add more (after all he was no longer
    mixing in the company.. ;-) ). Not to worry, another (who has since seen the light) said:

    "FYI, this is [..] about people who are reading our words and posting about
    it elsewhere. We have been getting lots of hate mail and apostate email
    lately."

    Presumably from the Toilet-Cleaners' Union's lawyers? Hardly surprising if
    the perp writes in such an arrogant, un-Christian way... LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!
    LOL! LOL! LOL! And fails to apologize humbly (or at all).

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    "Our friends have informed us that focus [has] been mentioned on other
    web sites."

    LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!

    "Does anybody want to remember to keep your senses? We are supposed to be
    brothers and sisters, not pot stirrers. We are supposed to show love."

    Typical BRAINDEAD jW IDIOCY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    The very statement comprises pot-stirring!!!!!!!!

    Also, lots of "show love" and "keep[ing] your senses" in what the perp had
    written two weeks earlier:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    And now we come to the crux. What is important to this creature "of God":
    Keeping the divisions private. Out of public view. So the public can get
    taken in at the door by all the "the happiest people in the world" crap?
    But .. Honesty and integrity? Oh sorry I forgot:

    "a lie [is] a false statement by one to another one who is entitled to hear
    and to know the truth, and which false statement tends to work injury to
    the other" {RICHES 1936 p177, a Watchtower publication} [Doctrine often
    repeated since, see my sig for quotes in proof - so it is NOT a lie even if
    it is false, unless the recipient was entitled to hear the truth AND not
    hearing it did him harm]

    And I somehow don't think "the likes of apostates" are included amongst
    those who have a right to hear the truth (whether or not we are done harm
    by this). Strange that when we look up the dictionary the dear perp uses THREE
    times in just one post (mainly to add insult, suggesting those who oppose
    him are less than literate - quite funny actually, given the nature of some
    of his earlier "efforts" ;-) ) for the word "lie" we get:

    http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=lie

    "lie n.
    A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.
    Something meant to deceive or give a wrong impression."

    Nothing about whether the recipient is entitled to hear it and other
    qualifications.... LOL!

    Do tell the perp to look it up... ;-)

    Ah but the next statement gives the whole game away ..

    "Then the likes of the apostates would not get their jollies over the
    goings on at Wit.net."

    ;-)

    Please look up "hypocrisy" somewhere, this is how the perp does it:

    http://www.dictionary.com/cgi-bin/dict.pl?term=hypocrisy

    and check out the Greek translation for:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    And before any of you classify me as an Apostate - even by the demented and
    God-insulting WTBTS definition - I'm not one. I am still amongst you ..
    philia, my brothers and sisters. Perhaps one day I may have the pleasure of
    disfellowshipping you .. ;-)

    Damage control then steps in to the thread.

    And as for Witnet, though they revile and hate us - you can almost see the
    foam there among the words I've quoted.. we should pray for these poor lost
    souls (or if you don't believe in God, just wish them freedom for the
    "self" (lol))... they need all the help they can get. Oh, and:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Do you think this couple is just a rare example of "bad association"?
    Hardly. Such demonstrated arrogance and contempt for others is found all
    over the place in "God's Organization" (LOL! LOL!). Not surprising where
    there is NO charity outside, there is precious little inside too...

    In the same thread, yet another so called "moderator" (God help us from the
    immoderates, then) pipes in with "Thanks [..] you make a wonderful point as
    always. [..] as of now, I'll have to agree with [the one who tells another
    he is but fit to be his toilet cleaner in the New Order, with no smiley]
    I'm not 'mixing in company' with these ones any longer either.".. Wow. You
    see how deep this mindset goes.. LOL! This one sides with the one who
    insults others with:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Even more absurd is if you surf to

    http://discussion.witnesses.net/Forum34/HTML/002187.html

    where you find the same "moderator" who 24 hours and 13 minutes earlier had
    written "thank you .. you have provided Jehovah's Witnesses from all over
    the world a place to go to and associate safely with other Witnesses --
    you've done a wonderful job .. I am fully confident that all changes made
    to this site are positive and for in everyone's best interests"

    In the confused Cultic world, with rapidly flashing and crazily flickering
    New Light overturning doctrines every now and again, and shunning
    everywhere (not for believeing the wrong thing, but for believing the right
    thing too early because Jehovah was too slow and you ran ahead of God -
    LOL!), such turnabouts are common. The successful theocrat has to be a
    gymnast. Check out "Animal Farm" for "doublethink" and "blackwhite" and it
    soons becomes clearer.... ;-)

    The Watchtower and the Creed of the Jehovah's Witnesses is a SHAM and a
    LIE and a FRAUD and a SCANDAL and a DAMNED OUTRAGE from start to finish.

    Which is not to forget:

    "You could always clean my toilet. I HATE doing that...LOL"

    Loyal 2nd class JDubs, see what awaits you in Paradise-Club-JehooBah!! A
    New Direction - right down the toilet.

    The most amusing thing is - a band of them on Witnut have started a "what
    color is my toilet bowl" thread in quiet protest at their fascist-like
    overlords...

    "Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the
    inspired expression to see whether they originate with God, because many
    false prophets have gone forth into the world." {1 John 4:1, NWT}

    Merry Christmas, Farkel and all!

    --
    Focus
    (Toilet-Cleaning Class)

  • LyinEyes
    LyinEyes

    Well, well, well,,,,,,,,,,,,,the WT is having it's ass drug to court more and more these days. I hope more Judges get sick of their "above the law of man" mentality and sock it to 'em.

    I hope this snowballs into a majoy victory for all who are being abused, and yes abused is the right word, by the shunning JW rule.

    It will not benefit me at all in my case, my dad shuns me for me not doing his will, he does have an almighty God complex and thinks I should obey him as if I am 10 yrs old.

    I also don't give a flying fig about any of the JW's who don't speak to me.

    But I do care about theex jw's who have family in JW who desperatly want to talk to their family but can't out of fear. This would be wonderful if it was agaisnt the law to emotional abuse your family by this practice. ................... especailly when children are involved. The judge was right on when he said they were too young to understand the religious reasons for shunning.

  • Dia
    Dia

    Please let her know that she has many, many friends out here who are interested in her case and in her.

    We're here to support and help.

    Can't wait till it moves to the next level, which is to order against the shunning of underage children themselves.

    It's about time this was legally and socially recognized as the emotional and psychological child abuse that it is.

  • Dia
    Dia

    Do they really check their sheets? Daily?

    Like to see where that info came from.

    Sheesh.

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