by Quincy 123 Replies latest social relationships
Actually, the name I used was not chosen arbitrarily. I asked if you were a "Femi-Nazi" because the term seemed to fit your initial post which was a hostile, heavily weighted left wing viewpoint.
"Hostile, heavily weighted left wing viewpoint?" Pro-choice is mainstream and is a view held by liberals and conservatives alike. The extremist views you've expressed are more consistent with those espoused by Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, and Jimmy Swaggart. Get back to your poodle, acrackhead!
Pro-choice is mainstream and is a view held by liberals and conservatives alike.
I wasn't referring to any Pro-choice statement you may have made, but rather to the fact that you were quick to blame the entire incident on the male and try and make him feel guilty for causing it. People shouldn't be made to feel guilty about their mistakes, but instead recognize them and take responsibility.
The extremist views you've expressed are more consistent with those espoused by Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, and Jimmy Swaggart.
Aren't they for the illegalization of abortion? I am not. I think it should be kept legal. I simply think abortion is wrong and that there is nothing wrong with the male being concerned about the life of his child. I am no more extreme than a person who thinks abortion is OK and the male should stay out of the decision...which would be...ummmm...you (well you haven't exactly stated your views on the act of abortion itself and the morality of it, so I could very well be off on that point.)
I wasn't referring to any Pro-choice statement you may have made, but rather to the fact that you were quick to blame the entire incident on the male and try and make him feel guilty for causing it. People shouldn't be made to feel guilty about their mistakes, but instead recognize them and take responsibility. -- amac
As a man, I know that I have control over my actions, including decisions regarding the use of prophylactics and physical control over the flow of my bodily fluids. Therefore, although both parties are certainly responsible for the pregnancy, the man is in a unique position to control the physical circumstances of sexual relations and, accordingly, it is my opinion that he ought to bear total responsibility for mistakes that result in pregnancy.
I agree that people "shouldn't be made to feel guilty about their mistakes," and following that reasoning, Quincy ought to lay off his efforts to make his girlfriend feel "guilty" about resolving her mistake with an abortion. Her desire to have an abortion may indeed be the "responsible" action you speak of.
I think [abortion] should be kept legal. I simply think abortion is wrong and that there is nothing wrong with the male being concerned about the life of his child. I am no more extreme than a person who thinks abortion is OK and the male should stay out of the decision...which would be...ummmm...you (well you haven't exactly stated your views on the act of abortion itself and the morality of it, so I could very well be off on that point.)
While there is nothing wrong with a "male being concerned about the life of his child," there is something wrong with a male who uses emotional leverage to coerce his girlfriend to go through with a pregnancy that she really wants to abort. A pregnant woman is typically an emotional woman and one who is vulnerable to emotional manipulation. The man should be supportive of his girlfriend's decision in this regard, notwithstanding his own personal views on abortion. As you will admit, the man is at least equally to blame for the pregnancy, so he should not claim a higher moral status in this decision. To clarify, a man is and should be entitled to express his opinion to his girlfriend regarding a proposed abortion, but a line should be drawn where that man uses emotional leverage to coerce his girlfriend to decide the abortion issue in a manner consistent with his own beliefs.
I've never been faced with this issue personally, so I'm not sure how I'd react if was in the position. However, I am very grateful that a woman still has the right to choose, unfettered by the interests of the man who purportedly fathered the baby. If my ol lady told me she was pregnant today, I certainly wouldn't be interested in an abortion. But if she wanted one, so be it. I wouldn't want to father a baby that wasn't wanted by its mother.
Therefore, although both parties are certainly responsible for the pregnancy, the man is in a unique position to control the physical circumstances of sexual relations and, accordingly, it is my opinion that he ought to bear total responsibility for mistakes that result in pregnancy.
I'm not sure I understand this as it seems to be contradictory. You state that "both parties are responsible for the pregnancy" but then end with "he ought to bear total responsibility for mistakes that result in pregnancy." If I understand this the way that I hope it means, then we are in agreement. My opinion is that the male ought to bear total responsibility as well as the female. They are both responsible for the child and each party should be willing to bear their full responsibility. I don't see how one is "more" responsible for the mistake than the other, unless the male lies to the woman, or vice versa, about using contraceptives.
and following that reasoning, Quincy ought to lay off his efforts to make his girlfriend feel "guilty" about resolving her mistake with an abortion.
There is a difference in making someone feel guilty about a mistake they recognize and trying to make someone see that something they want to do is a mistake. I see nothing wrong with arguing your case with someone that a decision they are about to make will result in the death/abortion/termination/whatever you want to call it of your growing child.
Her desire to have an abortion may indeed be the "responsible" action you speak of.
Not according to Quincy and his morals and that is what he felt compelled to explain to the mother.
While there is nothing wrong with a "male being concerned about the life of his child," there is something wrong with a male who uses emotional leverage to coerce his girlfriend to go through with a pregnancy that she really wants to abort. A pregnant woman is typically an emotional woman and one who is vulnerable to emotional manipulation.
To me, this kind of thinking gets into chauvinist thinking (not that I think you are one.) I feel the woman is equally capable to handle this decision. I don't feel males have any special abilities to emotionally manipulate women anymore than women do men. Any emotions that are stirred up would be natural emotions and there is a reason those emotions are there, a natural bond. I see nothing wrong with bringing this bond to the attention of the mother. I think the reverse, suppressing these emotions so you can carry out an act is immoral. Just my view point.
As you will admit, the man is at least equally to blame for the pregnancy, so he should not claim a higher moral status in this decision.
Why not? What if they had the child and one of the "responsible" parents decided that abuse was the best means of discipline? Should the other parent not claim a higher moral status since they are both to blame for the child being there? I see absolutely nothing wrong with having high morals and fighting for them.
However, I am very grateful that a woman still has the right to choose, unfettered by the interests of the man who purportedly fathered the baby.
I am saddened that so many pregnant women without extenuating circumstances even see this as an option. However I am glad to live in a country that allows for freedom of beliefs.
I am not sure why you used the word purportedly in there as I don't know of many men going around trying to stake claim on children that aren't theirs. It is usually the other way around.
I wouldn't want to father a baby that wasn't wanted by its mother.You may be surprised on how the bonds of parenthood change your feelings once one is on the way. Some men change, some don't. I hope you never have to face the chance of your wife wanting an abortion. I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
