How Do You Answer Someone Who Says JWs Are Not False Prophets?

by minimus 60 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  AndDontCallMeShirley

  Awake 6/8/2013 pg 7-9 last par:

  "You will be interested to learn that God has on earth a people, all of whom are prophets, or witnesses, for God. In fact, they are known throughout the world as Jehovah’s Witnesses."

  "The prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that I have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die. And in case you should say in your heart: ‘How shall we know the word that Jehovah has not spoken?’ when the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak."

  WT 09/15/2010

  " Similarly today, a Governing Body composed of spirit-anointed Christians contributes to the unity of the worldwide congregation. The Governing Bodypublishes spiritually encouraging literature in many languages. This spiritual food is based on God's Word. Thus, what is taught is not from men but from Jehovah.-Isa. 54:13

  But, in true WT form, they then dismiss Deut. 18 and their own claims of teaching divinely originated predictions as not applying to WT's false prophecies:

  There are some who make spectacular predictions of the world’s end to grab attention and a following, but others are sincerely convinced that their proclamations are true. They are voicing expectations based on their own interpretation of some scripture text or physical event. They do not claim that their predictions are direct revelations from Jehovah and that in this sense they are prophesying in Jehovah’s name. Hence, in such cases, when their words do not come true, they should not be viewed as false prophets such as those warned against at Deuteronomy 18:20-22. In their human fallibility, they misinterpreted matters. --March 22, 1993 Awake

  --

  "It is a serious matter to represent God and Christ in one way, then find that our understanding of the major teachings and fundamental doctrines of the Scriptures was in error, and then after that, to go back to the very doctrines that, by years of study, we had thoroughly determined to be in error. Christians cannot be vacillating - 'wishy washy' - about such fundamental teachings. What confidence can one put in the sincerity or judgment of such persons?"

  the Watchtower, May 15 1976, p. 298
• 

  DesirousOfChange

  PREDICTIONS THAT THEY CLAIM WERE PROVIDED EXCLUSIVELY TO THEM BY GOD'S HOLY SPIRIT -- ALL OF WHICH HAVE FAILED.

  Does that mean God's Holy Spirit failed?

  Or, is that simply evidence that God's Holy Spirit is NOT directing them (since God's Holy Spirit CANNOT FAIL)?

  Let them decide.

  Doc
• 

  tim hooper

  The March 1970 KM reported on how well publishers were doing in dropping unproductive bible students so that others could "benefit" from receiving a Bible study in the short time remaining. The article "Become 'Intensely Occupied with the Word'" in the "Presenting the Good News" section said on page 4:

  A little over a year ago we were introduced to the six-month home Bible-study program. We immediately grasped that this would be an additional effective method to help get the work done in the short time remaining.

  Now reports from the field show that Bible studies are being discontinued as publishers realize that the student is not making progress. This is entirely proper. There is no reason to spend our time with those who obviously are not really interested in doing something about the truths they are learning. Some publishers still ask, "How can I know whether to discontinue the study when they appear to be interested and still are glad to have me come?" The answer is that we discontinue studies when it is apparent that there is not the appreciation for the truth that there should be. There might be interest in continuing to take in knowledge. But is there appreciation for the knowledge already taken in? Appreciation for Jehovah and the truth is demonstrated by deeds...

  Apparently the matter is being taken seriously by the brothers, because circuit servant reports show that many publishers unhesitatingly discontinue studies when the time comes to do so.
• 

  Dagney

  I've asked them "name one thing, anything, that JW's have uniquely predicted that came true. And none of this "invisible" business either." They come up with nothing.
• 

  Vanderhoven7

  It's hard to make the "false prophet" label stick to JWs since they smugly claim they never claimed inspiration...only spirit direction, which apparently may involve tacking in the wind from time to time. I'm content to say that as far as prophecy is concerned, with their 100% concrete failure rate, they are not even spirit-directed, nor were they ever given the ability or the mandate to interpret scripture for mankind.

  However, they are clearly "false teachers/prophets" because they are preaching another gospel...which is a perversion of the gospel of Christ which writes an organization into the salvation formula.
• 

  Island Man

  This is a subject that has come up often on Yahoo Answers.

  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140524052943AAYDs9v

  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140709120223AATSwt0

  http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20140831000159AACV2LO

  JWs typically respond to the charge by using ridiculous technicalities to fudge the definition of what it means to be a false prophet. Their responses are typically as follows:

  ~ They would say that they never came up with any original predictions but were only explaining existing prophecies in the bible. In other words for them to be accused of being false prophets they have to come up with a completely original prediction that's not based on anything in the bible. Of course this argument is ridiculous. The bible does not give such technicalities as a basis for excusing some from being guilty of false prophesy. Also at Luke 21:8 Jesus indicated that persons would come in his name and make false predictions about the timing of the end. Such persons are obviously not making original predictions because the bible speaks about the end. And given that they come in Jesus name it stands to reason that they profess to be christian and would likely base their bogus predictions on existing bible prophecies by twisting scriptures. Thus Luke 21:8 implicitly invalidates this particular technicality.

  ~ They would say that they never made their predictions in the name of Jehovah, that they never said 'these are the words of Jehovah...' or something to that effect. But does a prophet have to explicitly spell this out? If a prophet deliberately gives his audience the impression that his message is coming from God, while not explicitly saying so, is he any less guilty of speaking in God's name? The Watchtower has repeatedly and indisputably given the impression to readers that what they print is not coming from men but from God. There are statements in the literature about "God's direction through his Word and Organization" which convey the idea that the Organization's teachings and direction is coming from God and not from men. There have been bogus claims that Jehovah is the writer/editor of the Watchtower and no man's opinions are found in the literature. There is the claim that the organization is spirit directed, thus ascribing the organization's actions and teachings as being the work of God through holy spirit. To this day, elders and other representatives of the organization can be heard speaking of the direction coming from the organization as coming from Jehovah. At the recent annual meeting one Governing Member, while speaking about all the changes taking place in the organization, was heard saying that even the Governing Body has trouble keeping up with Jehovah's Chariot. What was he implying? He was implying that the changes are not coming from men - not from the Governing Body - but from Jehovah himself. All of the foregoing examples show that Watchtower implicitly claims to act in Jehovah's name. They implicitly ascribe all their doings as the doings of Jehovah. It is therefore disingenous for JWs to claim that their false predictions were'nt made in Jehovah's name. Hypocritically, Watchtower understands that baptizing someone in Jesus' name does not involve having to explicitly say 'I baptize you in Jesus' name' when immersing the person. So how is it they don't apply similar logic to making predictions in Jehovah's name? Shouldn't they see that it's also possible to implicitly make false predictions in God's name without explicitly spelling it out?

  One of the most damning indicators of Watchtower's guilt as a false prophet is their own Reasoning Book. Just read through their section on false prophets and see how they conveniently invent their own rules of what it means to be a false prophet - rules that conveniently omit focusing on the aspect of making false predictions. It is very telling that throughout that entire section, not once is the very pertinent Deuteronomy 18:21,22 discussed! Why did they avoid those verses? Because they know they fit the bible's description of false prophets and so they didn't dare discuss those verses. In desperation they had to concoct their own definition and rules so as to hide their own guilt.
• 

  keyser soze

  I would tell them that the new world wasn't at all like I was expecting.
• 

  LP97

  One of the ones I can't stand is that they aren't inspired, they're "spirit-directed" so therefore they're fallible.

  OK, let's take that word to it's logical end. Spirit-directed = directed by holy spirit. Therefore, their actions are directed by holy spirit. Therefore, if the actions are wrong (failed predictions), does this mean the holy spirit was wrong since they directed this? Why should we trust the holy spirit since it is fallible? This shouldn't even be possible since the holy spirit is from Jehovah and Jehovah is perfect and infallible, therefore his holy spirit should be the same.

  And, if the words of the organisation are fallible, why do I have to unquestioningly obey them? After all, their predictions have a 100% FAILURE RATE. If a fallible person made predictions that had a 100% failure rate, then I wouldn't trust them. Why should "God's organisation" be any different?
• 

  Marvin Shilmer

  I say,

  "Label it however you want, the fact is the Watchtower organization has repeatedly predicted specific world shaking events and those predictions turned out false."

  Oh, and when SOMEONE ELSE does this the Watchtower organizations calls it "hollow prophecy"

  Hollow Prophecy

  http://marvinshilmer.blogspot.com/2011/12/watchtower-hollow-prophecy.html
• 

  OneEyedJoe

  One of the most damning indicators of Watchtower's guilt as a false prophet is their own Reasoning Book

  Out of curiosity I looked it up. I found this sentence particularly hilarious -

  If any individuals or organizations claim to represent God but decline to use God’s personal name, and make it a practice to express their own opinions on matters, are they measuring up to this important qualification of a true prophet?

  By this line of reasoning Jesus was a false prophet! If I remember correctly, there's no recording of him using God's personal name.

  And the second half is pretty good too, if an individual makes it a practice to express their own opinions on matters they're a false prophet - Sorta like AMIII at two zone visits, and he even went so far to tell any objectors "take it up with god" and to claim in his concluding prayer that the cousel was not from the branch, but from jesus.

  False prophets even by their own convoluted definition