by startingover13 66 Replies latest jw friends
How can Holy Spirit move one body of elders to recommend your reinstatement and another to reject it? There is only one answer and it does not bode well for WT "theology."
Oubliette, as usual, bypasses the opinions and gets to the Reality/Facts. THIS is what you should be concerned about.
They told me to continue to do what I'm doing and that they would get in contact with me for further instructions/direction. What does this mean? Is it a rejection?
Basically, yes, it is a rejection. This is the standard line of B.S. that any eldurr will give to anyone they want to keep on the hook. "keep doing what you're doing, we'll let you know," is their petty way of saying you aren't doing good enough, doing enough, or kissiing a-- enough to please them, and they want to pull your strings and make you dance like a puppet for them!
To: StartingOver --
Many here have been very hurt by the WTS or by their local Elders. Hope that explains many of the replies that you have received. I can certainly understand the need you may feel to be reinstated, even if everything that has happened cause you to have doubts about things. Perhaps you have family & friends who are still very active in the Cong and it's important for you to resume contact with them. You are on the right course, just give it time. The elders have been admonisted not to reinstate too quickly. (Re-read my earlier post.)
I'm sure they are just going through the effort to contact your old congregation. Hopefully they will be given the permission to reinstate. What you do from there is your decision.
Good luck,
Doc
They told me to continue to do what I'm doing and that they would get in contact with me for further instructions/direction. What does this mean? Is it a rejection?
This is known in common parlance as "stringing you along."
If you compare the way JWs handle the reinstatement process to the biblical account of the Prodigal Son, you will see that there is absolutely no resemblance of the one to the other, all this in spite of a lot of rhetoric and hand waving to the contrary.
In the bible account, the Prodigal decides to return home. As the account reads, " While he was still a long way off, his father caught sight of him and was moved with pity, and he ran and embraced him and tenderly kissed him." - Luke 15:20
In the Kingdom Hall, you will almost certainly have to approach the elders, they will rarely approach a disfellowshipped person first. But even if they do, they will instruct you to put your request for reinstatement in writing. Don't ask which scripture this is based on; it isn't and asking will only annoy the elders. They will interpret such questions a you having an "unrepentant attitude."
There will be no one running up to you with hugs and kisses.
You will need to attend the meetings for an indeterminate amount of time before they will even consider a request for reinstatement. All the time you attend, no one will talk to you. Most will avert their gaze. If you sit somewhere first, latecomers will rarely, if ever, sit near you. In spite of explicit directions from the "Faithful Slave" to the contrary, some "bodies of elders" will insist you sit in the rear of the hall. Whatever they say, you must do. If you do not, they will take this as evidence that you have an "unrepentant attitude."
Again, if you compare any of this to the account of the Progidal Son in Luke chapter 15 you will discover that, not only are none of these practices there, but they are completely contrary to both the words and the spirit of Jesus' parable.
The fact that there are absolutely no guidelines regarding how long a disfellowshipped person that has requested reinstatement must wait is a major source of frustration for everyone involved. Nevertheless, the elders will do what they understand to be the WTBTS's instructions on the matter. This is what it says in the secret elder's manual, Shepherd the Flock of God, in reference to this matter:
You might ask, "How long is a 'sufficient time'?" or "What can I do to prove my repentance?" or "Why do they insist on calling me a 'wrongdoer' when I am no longer doing anything wrong?"
These are all really good and legitimate questions, but--if you really want to get reinstated--DO NOT ASK THEM! If you do, the elders will interpret this as an "unrepentant attitude" which will indefinitely delay your reinstatement. Are you noticing a pattern here?
While a few sincere genuine elders probably do want to be compassionate, they are hamstrung by the WTBTS's written direction to "be especially cautious" in reinstating people. Also, you have to remember that the elders are more interested in appearing "spiritual" (whatever the heck that means) to the other elders than they are in helping you. Finally, there are always those few pompous pricks among elders that get off on the little teeny-weeny, itsy-bitsy bit of power that they are able to exert on your life. It intoxicates them. They are addicted to it. Probably the rest of their pathetic little life is miserable and unimportant. They probably haven't gotten laid in years. Many of them probably can't even get it up any longer. And, to make it worse, there are a few among these really twisted elders that are "secretly sinning" themselves and the best cover they can devise is to appear hard on crime. That means you, the penititent, are pretty much screwed until you have been sufficiently humiliated to satisfy their perverted sense of justice and bolster the image they are trying to maintain.
I feel for you. I went through this for years. I know of what I speak.
The hoops the elders will put you through will not only include attending all the meetings (this is a given), but will include at least one meeting with a "Judicial Committee" of at least three elders. This will preferably be the original three elders on the committee which spent on average 30 - 90 minutes destroying your life by expelling you from the local congregation. When I say, "preferably" I mean from their point of view, not yours. Your opinion is, to put it bluntly, irrelevant. But, since you've moved, you have to go through this twice, once with each congregation, unless you live really, really far from the original congregation. When I was an elder, we once made a person drive well over 100 miles to come to a "Judicial Hearing" regarding their request for reinstatement.
As you know, in these "Judicial Hearings" you will be outnumbered at least 3:1, you will not be allowed a witness or even someone just for moral support. You cannot even make a recording of the hearing (unless you do so surreptitiously).
Some people mistakenly believe that the procedures JWs follow for their "Judicial Hearings" are not bible-based. This is not so. Their is a clear and definite format in the bible upon which their format is based. You can read about it here in this short little squib by 00DAD:
Finally, you will have your "Judicial Hearing." There is a good chance that the elders will purposely do things to humiliate you.
Again, since you are attending a different congregation than the one from which you were disfellowshipped, the situation is more complicated. This is the problem which I addressed in my initial post:
How can Holy Spirit move one body of elders to recommend your reinstatement and another to reject it? There is only one answer and it does not bode well for WT "theology."
For the record, I went through the humiliating process of being reinstated in order to try and rebuild family relationships torn apart by the practice of instititionalized shunning. I had concluded years earlier that this religion is a fraud. (This epiphany was what led to my disfellowshipping in the first place, but I mistakenly believed that I could leave the religion and that the natural love my family members had for me would prevent them from shunning me. I was mistaken).
That being said, I honestly cannot understand how anyone logically consider the dilemma which I have proposed above and still think that Holy Spirit has anything to do with this religion. It doesn't.
It's just a religion like many others. Worse than most, not as bad as a few.
It's all about control. It is most certainly NOT about inculcating any allegedly "Christian" qualities into a person. They just want two things:
In this particular cult, I think they actually want your obedience MORE than your money. Realistically, if that have the first it's easy to get the other. But the WTBTS leaders are more about POWER than GREED. That being said, those 7 Bozos in Brooklyn have more money than they know what to do with, ... but I digress.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, startingover13, but you need to know--you DESERVE to know--the truth:
If, and when, you are finally reinstated you will almost certainly be in for a let down. Sure, a few of "the friends" will hug you or pat you on the back and tell you, "We're so glad you're back!" conveniently ignoring the actual fact that you've "been back" and sitting next to them for months.
But, unlike the account of the Prodigal Son, it is doubtful anyone will throw you a party. In reality, people will probably be suspicious of you and keep their distance. And the family members that you did this for, the ones that you kept in mind all the times you were humiliated and bit your tongue by not asking questions that would get you in trouble with the elders, well, it will probably never be the same with them.
I'm not advocating giving up hope. Who knows, maybe someday your loved ones will wake up to TTATT themselves and seek you out. It does happen, just not very often.
The best thing you can do is to live your life and live it well. Be an example to your loved ones by living a life of fulfillment and meaning. Live life on your terms.
I'm sorry my response was so long. If I had more time I would have made it shorter and more concise.
I wish you well.
Oubliette
I feel like some of the others on this post, you're out now for Pete's sake, stay out! This is a mind-controlling cult. The Bible is not what it's been purported to be. Jehovah is not the creator of the earth and creation, nor you. He can't hear prayers because he's not the true god. As for true friends, they're not at the Kingdom Hall-heck, I'll bet none of them speak to you now, do they? Make some new one, some ones that stick by you thick or thin. And for gawds sake, don't put yourself through that mental stress.
The proces is quite stressful.
Starting over. Yes it is stressful. I respect whatever reason you may have for enduring it. Do you have family still in? You probably remember some good times at get-togetherness and even out in service. Do you remember how stressful everyday life can be just keeping up appearances in the congregation? Or how one person can upset you by spreading a rumor or saying something insensitive to you? Or how a study conductor can deliberately pass over your raised hand, even though you haven't commented yet? A thousand pinpricks with these people because they need to feel empowered in some way, because the organization has dumbed them down to just parroting answers and presentations and labels.
it's one thing out in the "world" to have all of this, but triple the stress among what is supposed to be God's People.
but maybe you have the stomach for it. I do, but I keep it all at arm's length. I am friendly and they generally treat me well. I would likely wander far afield if my spouse weren't such a solid believer.
Startingover13,
I went back to read some of your earlier 'topics started/posted on', and deducted from it all that returning to the JW fold is not right for you. Unless by some miracle you've changed your outlook/attitude completely, it's best to forget about it.
Get psychological help and keep searching for a group you can best identify with. You'll just continue to be miserable among us JWs. This really isn't for everybody, hence the reason why in this vast sea of humanity we're only a silly 7 million or so bunch, and much less for those that expect perfection among a bunch of highly imperfect people.
Actually, keeping expectations low, like George W. Bush said one time, it's the best when co-existing with anyone group of people.
Find happiness.
GC
Gc, as an current elder I see the realities of DF'ing people. Its not always fair. Its often based on perceptions of past actions and attitudes, not whatever 'sin' brought you in the back room to begin with. Consider, my good man..... The process is so infair and so flawed, the term "disfellowshipped" isnt even allowed to used from the platform anymore. How "fair" and righeous can it be if we wont even use the word anymore?
