Yes i agree tec " people can think for themselfs" ...so as i said in an earlier post the best way to start a religion os to recruit the uneducated.
Jesus' Teachings - Helpful or Harmful?
by jgnat 153 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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cofty
Yes, people can indeed see for themselves Tammy.
As Jesus was walking beside the Sea of Galilee, he saw two brothers, Simon called Peter and his brother Andrew. They were casting a net into the lake, for they were fishermen. “Come, follow me,” Jesus said, “and I will send you out to fish for people.” At once they left their nets and followed him.
Going on from there, he saw two other brothers, James son of Zebedee and his brother John. They were in a boat with their father Zebedee, preparing their nets. Jesus called them, and immediately they left the boat and their father and followed him. Matt 4:18-22
Another disciple said to him, “Lord, first let me go and bury my father.”
But Jesus told him, “Follow me, and let the dead bury their own dead.” Matt 8:21,22
As Jesus went on from there, he saw a man named Matthew sitting at the tax collector’s booth. “Follow me,” he told him, and Matthew got up and followed him. Matt 9:9
Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to turn “‘a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law— a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’
“Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it. Matt 10:34-39
When the disciples heard this, they were greatly astonished and asked, “Who then can be saved?”
Jesus looked at them and said, “With man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
Peter answered him, “We have left everything to follow you! What then will there be for us?”
Jesus said to them, “Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life. - Matt 19:25-29
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new hope and happiness
Cofty, Jesus was either very charasmatic or he new his desiples well before recruiting them....
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Laika
I thought I was leaving my family and friends behind for Jesus when I left the Watchtower. I read that verse "And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life." about 6 times the day I told my parents about my conversion. It gave me a lot of comfort/encouragement at the time I left.
I even weaved it into my testimony at church. Boy was I a hit that day.
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cofty
New Hope and Hapiness - Its a good point. The obvious answer is that it never happened but the writers of the gospels wanted to impress on their readers the need for unquestioning obedience that surpasses the closest family relationships.
Its a cult.
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cofty
When you tell potential converts that their families will oppose them and that this proves their family are the enemy, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
We condemn this dangerous trickery in cults so why do we not oppose it when it is attributed to Jesus?
Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. You will be hated by everyone because of me ...
I have come to turn
“‘a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’“Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
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cofty
While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. Someone told him, “Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you.”
He replied to him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?” Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers. For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.” Matt 12:46-50
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new hope and happiness
So back to the post Cofty " Jesus words - Helpful or Harmful" and your above examples clearly show they are helpful from an organisational point of view in terms of recruitment...
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humbled
Jgnat-Is it advantageous to take the best of what we imagine the man to be (perfect in love, perfect in truth) no matter what the reality was? Basically, living with an ideal?
Cofty- Yes I can see that. It reduces the gospels to a sanctified Aesop's fable. As long as believers can be honest about that I can see the value.
At last! we have common ground.
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cofty
If you were to ask if the things anybody said were "helpful or harmful" you would respond that they said some interesting things, a lot of boring things and some reprehensible things.
Why is Jesus any different?
He repeated some useful aphorisms but he was a self-obsessed cult leader and a false prophet, so use discretion when evaluating his words.