Knowledge by Proxy

by braincleaned 141 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • braincleaned

    Whatever our convictions are, we all have ONE thing in common; we have learned them from other sources.
    We have knowledge by proxy… we didn't find things out all by ourselves. We let trusted sources talk for us.

    Belief is not something that you choose. If there is an elephant in my room and I see it, I don't "choose" to believe it's there. But if there is no elephant, I do not "choose" to believe it isn't there either. Belief is the most honest part of our psyche. Again — belief is NOT a choice.

    However, choosing the sources we trust IS a choice.

    Staying with the pachydermic illustration, lets say I'm outside of my room and the door closed. Two men are guarding the door and the first one says "There is an elephant in your room."
    The second one says "Not true, there is NO elephant in your room."

    This is where choice really kicks in.
    Who do I 'believe'?

    — The first guy says all you have to do is trust him. He is an elephant expert, and there is no need to question him.
    — The second guy says that he is a researcher, and that there in no evidence of an elephant in my room — proof is as simple as opening the door to check inside!

    Religion is the first guy. Faith. Trust. No need for hard evidence, the "guy" says he's an expert. No questioning allowed.
    Science is the second guy. Logic. Evidence. YOU are going to decide by questioning/opening the door.

    The JWs, more than most other religions, have perfected the cruel delusion by punishing the ones that dare question the first guy (WTS). But make no mistake, every religion has a form of bigotry against the second guy.

    What AMAZES me is how so many deny evolution based on a definition of evolution given by the very sources that deny it!!!
    Reading the Watchtower on Evolution is like reading about the flaws of Pepsi from a Coca~Cola magazine!

    Wake up people! The JW religion is not the root of all problems. The issue goes much deeper. It's about the belief of an all-loving and powerful god that created a universe that is obviously not loving at all.
    The stars and planets that collide and explode to oblivion; the cruel "cycle of life" in wildlife — life violently feeding from weaker life; sickness; the fact that 98% of known species are now extinct; natural catastrophes… all witness to a rough natural and relative order — not the smart and loving creation of the god of biblical folklore.

    My favorite quote from Bertrand Russell is this one:
    (after being asked "Do you think there’s a practical reason for having a religious belief?")

    "Well, there can’t be a practical reason for believing what isn’t true. That’s quite... at least, I rule it out as impossible. Either the thing is true, or it isn’t. If it is true, you should believe it, and if it isn’t, you shouldn’t. And if you can’t find out whether it’s true or whether it isn’t, you should suspend judgment. But you can’t... it seems to me a fundamental dishonesty and a fundamental treachery to intellectual integrity to hold a belief because you think it’s useful, and not because you think it’s true."

    What say you?

  • cantleave

    Can't argue with any of that.

  • KateWild

    cantleave-correct me if I am wrong. Back to Shrodinger, didn't he do a cat in the box experiment like this also? Point can't always open the door or box to check if the elepahant or cat is inside.

    Some people don't even care whats in the box or the room......

    Kate xx

  • braincleaned

    I don't know about the cat in the box thing — but I can tell you that in my illustration, the second guy would simply keep his stand if the door was open... and tell me that I just lack faith for not "seeing" the elephant.

    Illustrations have their limits — but this one is thought out and has worked for a while. It makes a simple point.
    I hope we can avoid the red herring of deconstructing the illustration to avoid the point I am making.
    We'll see... lol!

    As for those who don't care— this post is not for them.

  • KateWild

    Well said braincleaned-I do get your point. It was well thought out because a famous scientist used a similar illustration. Your point is we need knowledge to form opinions and make choices.

    Only the foolhardy make uninformed choices. Knowledge is power and control over our own lives-Kate xx

  • braincleaned

    Absolutely KateWild. Oh, could you refer me to the illustration, and what scientist gave it? Here I thought I was being original! LOL!

    Any group like the WTS that demonizes 'outside' knowledge to control information should be exposed as frauds.

  • tec

    For the most part, I agree with the premise of your post. I would just remove faith from religion... because despite what religion would have you believe, these two things are not the same. If you have only experienced religion, then you might have a hard time grasping that, because religion does such a thorough job in teaching its people that it IS faith.

    A person of faith in Christ, who is the Spirit... witnesses TO Christ... and does not seek to take His place by telling people to listen to them instead of Him. They don't (truthfully) say that you have to take their word for it, or even that you should. Because they know that you can 'open the door and hear Christ for yourself'.

    In this understanding, religion is the first guy; you are correct.

    But faith is the second guy. The evidence might not be physical (and so visual)... but the evidence is of the spirit, and so heard... and you can hear for yourself. So that you too can go to the Spirit (who is Christ), and ask Him for ears to hear, and then put your faith in Him and listen to what He says.

    Peace to you!


  • Finkelstein

    Personally I think anyone who thinks they hear or believe in any invisible being/object has delusional mental health issues. (psychosis)

    And if you take a close analytical look of people in mental health institutes, that is the prevailing problem with these unfortunate ones.

  • Ucantnome

    i have evidence in my life for the things i believe and i may not have a great education but i'm not stupid.

  • KateWild

    Braincleaned-his name is Shrodinger. I learnt about his theories in Chemistry. Physical chemistry to be exact. I have just googled him now. It is pretty much sound info and the cat experinment can be found. I warn you though, educational institute text books are far more reliable-Kate xx

Share this