I called Patterson today.

by Mulan 47 Replies latest jw friends

  • Yerusalyim

    Thanks Fred, I knew You'd have the right answer.

    "Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
    [Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]

  • Mulan

    I called and talked to the man at the Washington State Service Desk. He didn't give his name.........said they aren't supposed to. He was really nice, actually. Mom talked to him too..........she came upstairs after I asked for the phone number here, to see if I had called, so I did it with her right there.

    I identified myself as an inactive witness, and that my mother is 90 years old, the widow of a Gilead graduate, missionary in The Netherlands, circuit overseer, and elder for a gazillion years, and that she is very devout and in full control of all her faculties........in fact she is extremely intelligent. Then I explained the living arrangement, and that she is getting some flack from people in the congregation, (not the elders) who don't think she should be living here, because my Dad is here too, and they aren't married, and haven't been for 33 years. I also said my father has Alzheimer's disease, and there is no chance anything immoral will happen.........Dad has major plumbing problems, to be blunt.......I didn't say that though. I think the guy understood, because he said "of course".

    So, I asked if there was anything wrong with them living here, in the home of inactive witnesses, who are gossiped about as apostates. He said I should understand their feelings, and their reluctance to come here, and that the gossip will happen, "don't you know?" He said I have to understand their position.........and I said I did NOT, and that my mother was being hurt here, because NO ONE comes to visit her anymore.

    Then he turned it on me, and wanted to know why I don't go to meetings, and I said I don't go because I don't want to, and he asked if I didn't believe it anymore.............at this point, I paused because I thought this possibly could go bad for me, and I told him I had issues, but didn't want this conversation to become about me. He said "okay, let's talk about your mother".

    After a long time, he finally said that there is NOTHING wrong with her living here, and that our taking care of our elderly parents is a Biblical obligation, and that we are doing the RIGHT thing. No one should be critical of that, and that if we were disfellowshipped, it would be the same. He really didn't want to be pinned down to that statement, but I pressed, and he finally said it. Then he talked to Mom, and told her the same thing...........being very very kind to her. She told him that Max and Helen Larson are personal friends of hers, and they wrote to her this week........true.......the letter came here. That got his attention too. Name dropping seems to work.

    He got back to me and asked me to talk to the elders today, and tell them what has been said, and that Mom needs visitors, and that there is a private entrance, so no one has to see or deal with us, and I am to call him back tomorrow for an update. He is writing a letter to the elders to the effect that there is nothing wrong with this situation, and to talk to the woman who called Mom yesterday, and tell her she was out of line.

    Mom had given him her name (and I'm sure he looked her up), so he asked for mine, and I told him.........he paused and said "okay", so he found out I'm not df'd I guess. I had told him I had been raised as a witness and was a regular pioneer, and told him names of people at Bethel that are old friends, that he knew too, and he was impressed that we had been to International conventions, etc. He was really upset that we don't go anymore, and that no one has tried to get us back.

    He really tried to encourage me, after we finished with that business, and he was awfully nice. I told him I had seen things that offended me, in the congregations, and that I didn't see how I could ever go back. I was specific, about Sharon's disfellowshipping, and he looked that up, and commented that it DID appear unusual, and he would look into it. I said "don't bother, she died last September". So I said that the organization wasn't what it once was, and that the people are not like they used to be. He said "if you had been raised a Catholic, don't you think you might have those feelings now about that church?" Great opening, right? So I said, "and you think those things AREN'T happening to Jehovah's witnesses?" He said "no, I wouldn't say that." Too funny. Anyway, we had a nice conversation, and he referred me to King David and all the sins he committed, and Jehovah still used him........(comparing mistakes in the WTS, but Jehovah still uses it), and I said "I know and David was never disfellowshipped or cut off from his loved ones".........he laughed and agreed with me. And he stopped trying to encourage me, by saying "you've heard all of this before" and I said that no one had EVER said those things to me. He was shocked. I told him again that no elder ever called on us, and he got defensive, but left me with a better feeling than I had when I first called.

    Because I did get specific with him, about some issues, I asked him to please not use anything I had said against me. He said he wouldn't, and why did I say that. I said I thought they would do just about anything to disfellowship us, and he said he wouldn't report anything that would do that to us. Should I believe him? He was really sweet.

    Marilyn (aka Mulan)
    "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers

  • Mulan

    One more thing..........he asked me what my relationship was to 'the congregation'. I almost choked. I actually thought he was going to ask me what my relationship with God was. So I asked him why he didn't ask me that.............why the congregation? He paused and said "okay, what is your relationship with God." When I told him it was good, he dropped it all.

    This is making Mom question some stuff, but she will never turn her back on the organization. I told her about the change in the baptismal questions, and she didn't know about it.........thought that is wrong.

    Marilyn (aka Mulan)
    "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers

  • Elsewhere

    Thats it Mulan!!! You're going DOWN!!!

    "As every one knows, there are mistakes in the Bible" - The Watchtower, April 15, 1928, p. 126
    Believe in yourself, not mythology.
    <x ><

  • dungbeetle

    ((((((( Mulan ))))))))) you go girl!!!!!

  • orangefatcat

    Mulan you have great courage. I am glad you stood your ground with them.
    I love how you turned the King David thing around and made that brother sweat a few beads. How true though, David committed the worst sin of all murder and premeditated at that and yet he was not difellowshipped. So it goes to show you that this disfellowshipping thing is a man made rule in the organization just to keep people in line. How sad and cruel they use this weapon.
    I wish your mom well and you deserve a gold star!
    Love ya

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    Hi Mulan,

    I'm sorry to hear about the trouble you're experiencing at the hands of the local congregation. Certainly you -- and especially your Mom -- don't deserve to be treated so harshly.

    I hope that the fellow you spoke with was sincere and was being honest with you. I suppose we'll see, won't we?

    On the other hand, if the treatment your Mom has received has caused her to want to examine some issues afresh, that can't be bad, can it?

    Best wishes to all of you!

  • Mulan

    Knowing what this did to me, to see the WTS as it really is, I don't wish that on my mother, at age 90. I think it would kill her. I was in a deep depression for months.......if not years.

    Marilyn (aka Mulan)
    "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers

  • ThiChi

    I am by no means an apologist for the WT, but the fellow on the other end seems to be good hearted and the bottom line is they will help...How will you call him back if you don’t know his name?

  • Mulan

    He is the one who answers the phone at the Washington State Service Desk.

    Marilyn (aka Mulan)
    "No one can take advantage of you, without your permission." Ann Landers

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