TEC Documentary hypothesis (page 6)

tec

But they don't hear exactly what you hear.

Hearing the same things is why I get accused of being someone else's follower. It is a double edged sword. If people are united, they are just following one another. If they are not united, then they are fake.

You have also stated that some things described from the bible are not from Christ (generally anything that might make him look bad)

Anything that is in conflict with Him and His teachings. Him being the Truth and all... no one else is given that name, or is the Image and Word of God. So why would anyone believe something else over Christ?

and you have attributed good things to Him. So you are the representative standing in front of

the curtain, claiming some things Christ-like and others not.

I am just looking at Him. Not at the bible as one book. Not at doctrines or theology or scholars or religions. Just at Christ. What He is... God is. So to see God (the man behind the curtain), one must look at Christ (the Image of the man behind the curtain), as well as go through Christ (the curtain) to get to the Father (the man behind the curtain)

It is not look at Tammy to see Christ. It is look at Christ to see God. Because He is the Image and Word and Truth... of God.

Peace,

tammy

jgnat

Even if you agree with another's vision, can you at least admit that the visions are not exactly the same?

tec

Even if you agree with another's vision, can you at least admit that the visions are not exactly the same?

Jgnat, I cannot say that I have ever had a vision. So i don't have a point of reference to compare.

I might hear different details on something another hears. (this is more like adding to, rather than taking away from or putting something into conflict) I might also hear something that someone else has not yet heard... and vice versa. Sometimes I might simply hear the truth in something that someone else has heard and shared. Some lessons/teachings we have all heard and all share. I think perhaps sometimes this is how we might recognize one another. That AND the spirit of love and peace and faith among one another... even with differences.

So you are correct, that everything does not have to be exactly the same for us to be brothers/sisters in Christ. Christ does not give conflicting messages though... the conflict would come from a lack of understanding (or lack of hearing... or simply lying) But as Christ said when one of the apostles pointed out that some others were preaching Christ but were not with them... "He who is not against you... is for you." We are obliged to give love to others... and mercy and forgiveness. We are not required to make or even ask anyone to believe US... but rather to point to Christ for Truth and for Life. (Then HE can show and teach what is true.)

On the matter of hearing (as Phizzy brought up), the Spirit of Christ does speak to everyone. I heard Him long before I recognized him, or even knew that the Spirit could speak. Sometimes I hear very clearly... with words, or a reminder of a scripture or event in the bible or elsewhere. Sometimes it is a matter of hearing/feeling/sensing the truth of something heard, or receiving an understanding on something. Like how for instance, Peter did not hesitate when it was revealed to him by God, that 'Jesus' was the Christ. Did he hear a voice (that we would now consider to be our own inner voice) or was it a feeling or a knowing? Whatever the case, Peter also recognized the voice of Christ (my sheep hear my voice) and followed Him. As did the other eleven apostles who heard the call... and followed.(enabled by the Father) As do those who hear Him calling even now. Many people also heard Him calling them out of the wts, and followed Him out.

There are so many false teachers out there, fooling people, who have also fooled us... that we may have a hard time with faith and with trust. So while the written word is not perfect... it can be helpful for people who need to see first (and most of us do), before we learn to walk by faith. If we are at least looking at Christ first and foremost. And if we ask for ears to hear, for the door to be opened, for faith and the Spirit... then the promise is that we will receive such. We need only put faith in Him who is true.

Peace,

tammy

cofty

Even just looking at "writing styles" you can see that there had to have been more than one writer.

When I first read about the various sources in Genesis and in the synoptic gospels it made so much sense.

jgnat

Even the comparison of J and E texts, surely, makes sense.

Tec, I've lost you again. Have you heard from dragons?

PSacramento

When I first read about the various sources in Genesis and in the synoptic gospels it made so much sense.

Indeed. I recall on one class we had the debate about the synoptic gospels and not so much who used whom as source or even the validity of the "Q" hypothesis, but WHY the writers would have needed a source other than their own expereince.

I pointed out that, there is no reason to believe that ALL apostles were with Jesus ALL the time for ALL 3 years.

Mark wrote, according to some, what Peter would tell him whenever Peter felt liek telling him or maybe when Peter re-told something to others.

Matthew ( or thw writer of GOM) wrote basedon what He expereinced and, according to some, used Mark for thinsg that he may not have been witness to.

Luke wasn't eyewitness to anything, so of course he used all sources he could.

John ( whoever He was) wrote more of a theological narrative than a "choronological account" of all the events.

cofty

Matthew ( or thw writer of GOM) wrote basedon what He expereinced and, according to some, used Mark for thinsg that he may not have been witness to.

It makes you wonder why Matthew uses Mark's account about the conversion of Matthew.

PSacramento

It makes you wonder why Matthew uses Mark's account about the conversion of Matthew.

Probably because the GOM was not written directly by Matthew ( the Tax collector) but probably by one of his aides/followers.

It is the Gospel according to Matthew, not the Gospel written by Matthew.

One theory goes that while Matt wrote the orginal in Aramaic (or hebrew), when it was written in greek the copiest/editor added things that were not there before to make it more complete and used Mark (possibly as a source).

Truth is we don't know.

tec

Tec, I've lost you again. Have you heard from dragons?

I have had no vision of a dragon(serpent/seraph) if that is what you are asking me about.

But I do SEE the the evidence of the truth of that from what is written. I have not heard anything to contradict it. I do get hear the truth in it... (except perhaps when it comes to the 'unattractiveness' because that is more subjective. But I mean, what are the chances that a spiritual creature is going to reflect our idea of beauty? Our idea of beauty changes from generation to generation, and from person to person. For Christ and God... what is outside doesn't matter at ALL... it is what is within that counts. Being made in someone's image does not have to do with appearance on the outside so much... as it has to do with what is within)

W hat gets in the way for most people in hearing this, imo, is that they are looking at the modern depiction of dragon... rather than the original depiction, which is also man's best attempt to describe a spirit creature - seraph/fiery winged creature/burning ones - think the burning bush - because that was a spirit being/angel/seraph.

Peace,

tammy

jgnat

So you don't hear exactly the same things, and not to the detail, but you share the same spirit and are in unity one with another.

I also have an inner voice and I am not in agreement in detail or in broad strokes with others who have an inner voice. Would you conclude, if I were not in agreement, that I am receiving direction from the Other Place? What if my inner voice leads me to love and to good?

TEC Documentary hypothesis

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