Whitney Heichel killed by multiple gunshots (page 5)

james_woods

The multiple shooting aspect of this indicates to me that this perp was a very disturbed individual with a lot of hate and aggression for the victim.

Very much a classic case of rape plus "overkill", as a matter of fact.

My speculation is that very likely this guy had shown indications of disturbed behavior or thoughts before, and that likely he just got told to study the Watchtower more or pray about it - if it were even noticed.

We will probably never know about that last aspect as the JW elders who knew him close ranks to protect themselves.

undercover

Since I learned it was a fellow JW and neighbor, I figured he obsessed over her. He wanted her, couldn't get her, and even if there was a slight hold out of hope, he eventually realized he wouldn't get her as evidenced by her obviously happy marriage (check her Facebook page), but he couldn't let the obsession go. Something snapped and said 'if I can't make her love me, no one can have her', is all I can figure. That's where I get stumped. You lost the girl... it's happened to many of us. I still have fond memories of one I lost, and hated that she married that other guy. But I never lost focus on that she's happy and I have to move on. I guess that's where the pyschotic break happens, which unfortunately could give his legal team an opening for the insanity plea (not sure how it works in Oregon - not guilty by reason of insanity or guilty but insane?)

My question about his being a JW is, how long was he one? Is his family JWs? or was he a convert? And was he a convert because of his desire for Whitney? Or was he raised a JW and knew his fellow JWs for years and years?

A million questions, no answers. If he pleads guilty, not much info will be released. If he goes for the insane bit, it could be enlightening at trial, but for the sake of the family, I kinda hope that doesn't happen. And you're right James, the local elders will close ranks and very little about Holt will ever be divulged from that aspect of his life.

james_woods

All true and to the point, Undercover.

And, as has been said before - another forgotten victim of this is Holt's wife. It is entirely possible that she did not have a clue.

My observation here, however - is that people do not usually just suddenly go completely off and abduct a woman, with a gun, and shoot her four times without some kind of prior indication that not all is well in Dubsville.

Very likely, an insanity defense will be presented - and that may indeed provide some answers, even if the elders will not.

breakfast of champions

Just perusing the jwtalk board. . .

One poster is questioning whether its appropriate for 'True Christians' to use the term RIP or "Rest in peace" as they seem to be doing on FB. . .

and another surmises that pornography, specifically "abhorrent pornography" had something to do with this thing.

What an absolutely bizzare worldview we all came from!

undercover

One poster is questioning whether its appropriate for 'True Christians' to use the term RIP or "Rest in peace"

Well.... lesseee... Hell is the common grave. There is no fiery hell. The dead are consious of nothing. Why is it inappropriate to say "rest in peace"? How about "sleep well"? Or, "Sleep tight, don't let the maggots bite"...

...another surmises that pornography, specifically "abhorrent pornography" had something to do with this thing.

I've actually been waiting for that one to pop up. Anything sex driven in the JW world is tied back to pornography somehow. It was only a matter of time before someone made that connection, whether it's true or not.

I think James has a point about there being prior indications of his being unstable. Watching porn isn't the catalyst to cause one to do what he did.

And thinking about what James said, I wonder how many people in the congregation gave this guy a pass on any possible issues just because he was a fellow JW? Had he been just a neighbor, and they weren't too sure about his behavior, I'd be willing to bet she wouldn't have given him a ride. She might would've called her husband for assistance. But being a JW, even if he was an odd bird, it didn't raise an alarm as it would have an non-JW. That's why it's so earth shattering to the congregation...to any congregation, but in reality, just because you share a faith, a church/Kingdom Hall/an apartment building, you shouldn't have blind faith that everyone associated with that common ground are good people.

Kudra

Just thinking about all the bizarre freaks that, just because they were someone's "study", or were seen at the kingdom hall from time to time, that I would totally have given a ride to... *shudder*.

Theocratic Sedition

When Jesus' raised Jairus' daughter from the dead he stated that she was sleeping. Between that and Ecclesiastes verse on the dead being conscious of nothing, I don't see anything wrong with saying rest in peace. Matter fact it would be fitting for more JWs to say RIP as it fits in harmony with their beliefs on the temporary condition of the dead. Their own literature likens death to sleep.

perfect1

and another surmises that pornography, specifically "abhorrent pornography" had something to do with this thing

Im generally neutral or just over the fence positive when it comes to pornography. However, there is porn which is sadistic, violent, and REAL.

Snuff films, or more recently, what the NYtimes calls torture porn are mainstream enough to show in a movie theater.

Here is a recent article in the NYtimes about this genre and the actress who starred:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/16/movies/rodleen-getsic-in-the-horror-film-the-bunny-game.html?_r=0

I find this genre to be very disturbing.

I find Whitneys murder has gotten under my skin though I never knew her.

breakfast of champions

PERFECT1 - I believe there was a study as to whether there's a correlation between porn and aggression against women.

I think the researchers found that regular porn had no effect on aggressiveness; violent porn had a positive correlation with aggression as did any video/pictures featuring aggression against women, sexual or not.

trujw

Fiddler I notice one thing from your article. Several businesses and I am assuming most must be worldly are coming together to raise funds for a proper burial and notice one was completely absent that of the corporation of Jehovah’s witnesses. It is funny how no matter what, the church just turns the other way and says "nothing to see here" more service, more donations to us and nothing for this poor woman. I thinks I see a lot of new lurkers from Oregon.

Whitney Heichel killed by multiple gunshots

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