What do you replace it with?

by konceptual99 64 Replies latest jw friends

  • James Brown
    James Brown

    It's just I can't quite get my head round all the implications of there being no God at all yet it actually feels like the most logical conclusion.

    This is what I think about your statement above.

    I can see your point, but if I embrace that point then I become spiritually dead.

    Man is a triune being; spirit, soul and body.

    I agree with many of the above posters as Joe Grundy said, I question everything.

    And as leavingwt said "God has a sense of humor and is in no hurry" to that I will add, Life

    is a journey enjoy the ride.

    I have read most of Dawkins, and Sam Harris, some of Hitchens. Just to cover all the basses.

    I have also read the bible cover to cover numerous times.

    I question everything, and try to be aware of as much as I can.

    What I take from the bible, is that the only thing that the God of this universe, the God of life wants

    from us is to have faith in him. And I also take from the bible that the God of this life is Jesus and if

    I believe in him I will have eternal life.

    I try to keep it that simple and not worry about the details, the scripture says we are saved by faith.

    The scriptures also say each person must work out his own salvation,

    In my life the working out my salvation is maintaining the simple faith that there is a God and if I believe in

    him everyting will work out.

    For me the simple saying "know God know peace, No God no peace" is true.

    If I believe there is a God and he wants me to have faith that everything will be alright, I have peace.

    If I keep trying to put God under the microscope and prove him by my and mans understanding, if I keep trying to

    peel away the layers of God as if he is an onion, then God will be an onion and when I peel away all the layers

    I will have tears in my eyes.

  • perfect1

    I disagree with the conclusion of Guest that if there is no god there is no morality, no purpose, no explanation.

    If you open it up that the WTS may be incorrect, you have every shade of ethics, morality, and religious and spiritual truth available for examination by your own critical intelligence.

    JWS operate under some serious fear that without "the truth" everything is meaningless and everyone is violent, chaotic, immoral. I have observed that people internalize this and end up fearing themselves, what they would do and who they will become without the authority of WTS.

    Yet, most of "the world" operates and functions because of sheer common sense and human decency, not because of a unified religious mission.

    It is healthy to "fathom that there is no god" - give it a try.

    At a young age in my JW upbringing- I made the decision to fathom anything I wanted.

    I thinik the first step to freedom is allowing oneself to the freedom to think, and especially to think without fear of some peeping tom god listening in all the time and disapproving.

  • breakfast of champions
    breakfast of champions

    My wife - an active but questioning JW - says (despite my not believing in god or the supernatural) that I am still the most spiritual person she knows!

    I asked why, and she said because I don't put my own personal interests before everyone else, and I'm able to 'see beyond the surface', not into some spiritual world, but into the real reasons behind why things happen and why people are the way they are.

  • snare&racket

    Oh man,

    YOU HAVE NO IDEA how cool, how 'spiritual', how awe-inspiring, how inspirational the real answers are ! The best part is you can get as involved as you want, you can even become one of the people findng the answers...

    Start reading Hawkings, Dawkins, Hitchens and Harris.

    Go back to school, however old you are, and get your teeth into what we actually know in 2012. It makes the junk we lived off in the JW world look like chewing on bubble wrap, all noise and no substance.

    Trust me, before long, it will feel like asking "How do I replace something that keeps me busy chasing my tail, whilst it itself chased my wallet, time and effort to improve itself.."

    As for the people you leave behind, that is hard! But everytime I refer to my old friends in the JWs as friends, my new friends say "they were'nt friends, friends dont care what you believe or who you worship." This is true ! Friends dont care. These people are just people we share a religious building with. If you dont believe me, watch how quickly they drop you. Some will cling on, but with time, most if not all eventually let go... especially when you indulge in things the WT consider evil.... like giving your child a birthday etc, despite WT's weak as crap reasoning for denying such normal activity.

    Right now, it feels like your world is ending. There are 7 million JW's (i dont believe thats even true), there are 77 million members in just the Anglican church alone. JW's really are insignificant... IN THE REAL WORLD.... once you enter the real world, you will see that your world hasnt ended or crashed, merely the bubble has popped and now you can see that a real life exists.

    Mamba x

    Ps. well done and stay strong, most people dont figure out what you figured out... the few that do ignore it through fear. Dont play their game, fear should never be the motivation for worship or loyalty.

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Man is a triune being; spirit, soul and body.

    Prove it.

    You cannot. Congrats, as you're now in the territory of non-reality, AKA Fantasyland, "believing in things you don't understand" AKA Stevie Wonder's musical definition as used in his song, "Superstition".

    (I hate to quibble with Stevie, but superstition doesn't have to do with "not understanding", but "believing in things in which there is no rational basis in which to base a belief". Granted, that doesn't fit into the musical phrase, and hence why I'm not a lyricist, LOL!)

    That approach doesn't work for everyone, esp those who need an intellectual basis on which to build faith in things, not putting faith in something and then looking for reasons it was a good move. Do that with investing, and you will quickly discover how foolish that approach is in life....

    Contrary to what some seem to think, rationalists are not faithless animals who don't believe in things. Humans HAVE to put their faith on many things, whether they admit it or not. You have to put faith in the auto mechanic that he didn't take a money-saving short-cut, put faith in your spouse that they won't cheat, etc. However, most people prefer to increase faith based on EVIDENCE, increasing trust when it's proven to indicate more trust is warranted.

    Otherwise sane and rational people wouldn't dream of doing it with anything else in their lives: why should anyone make an exception for religion, doing it with their lives?

    To answer OP's question, who said religion needs replacing with anything? That's like saying a drug addict needs to replace their substance abuse problem with another drug, because they cannot conceive of abusing SOME substance....

    Granted, it's more work to ask yourself WHY you're the person you are, and why you do things/anything, but no one should side-step that question, certainly not those who'd use religion (bottled morality) as their excuse.

  • notjustyet

    IF you are in a cage in a Zoo, and you learn how to pick the lock and actually make it out of the cage, DO NOT run and lock yourself into the next cage you see, slowly work your way out of the Zoo and then look back from a distance before deciding what is right in thine own eyes.


    Out the cage, slowly walking toward the exit whilst trying not to be noticed by the Zoo attendents.

  • cantleave

    Q. What do you replace it with?

    Q. Living your life!

  • Guest with Questions
    Guest with Questions

    perfect1: I said morality without God in my life would be subjective. I believe all people, atheists included, have a moral compass because God has placed it in everyone.

    Yes it is too difficult for me to wrap my head around the concept of there not being a God. I have tried but intellectually, spiritually it's impossible for me. It's not fear that forces me to believe in Him.

    For me it's like asking what would life be without oxygen. I believe that God creates and sustains. Without Him there is nothing.

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Perfect 1 said:

    Yet, most of "the world" operates and functions because of sheer common sense and human decency, not because of a unified religious mission.

    And lets not forget about those same pesky secular laws: you know, the ones that human beings will put you in handcuffs and cart you off to prison if if you don't follow? You don't need the Bible to tell you not steal: JWs cannot put you in prison if you do...

    Incidentally, these are the same secular laws that JWs often forget all about, since they are indoctrinated to believe these laws don't apply to them, if they believe they conflict with God's law.... No wonder they think they'll fall off a moral cliff if they leave the JWs: they're encouraged to conveniently forget about secular law when it behooves them to do so.....

  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Questions states:

    For me it's like asking what would life be without oxygen.

    We don't have to speculate, because there's plenty of organisms on this planet who survive without oxygen: in the world of microbiology, they're called anaerobic bacteria.

    I believe that God creates and sustains. Without Him there is nothing.

    Hmmm, perhaps you ought to change your handle to "Guests who has Answers", since you strike me as someone who's not even willing to search for answers, since you already have the answers you want/need.

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