by justmom 62 Replies latest jw friends
We were allowed to remain inside for a reason. We were babes and needed to be under men in charge. We were not wise but inexperienced.
Lol. It continues to amaze me that some believers continue to push the idea that the invisible man in the sky has some sort of "master plan" for all of us. And part of that plan includes losing family members for the rest of our lives because of a publishing cult.
Justmom, whatever works for you is for you. It ain't for everyone.
Some of us cannot blindly accept that a loving God has done the things that were done to us or to others. And rather than comment/argue on that point, I will say that trying to tell us what we have not learned or realized is just rubbing salt in the wound.
Talk to molestation victims about how God allowed their terrible nightmares to strengthen them. Tell the parents of children victims of a tsunami that their loss was for some greater good.
For most who have left faith behind, the terrible things that have happened have done more than sour them to God. Those events caused them to be able to examine reality clearly without a preconceived notion that God is there with a purpose. It is just as easy for me to say that you have not come to realize things yet.
Jah and his Son - lol, sounds like I am back in a bloody Kingdom Hall.
Just Mom - Grow up and stop spouting on about fairies!
Shoot, i thought this thread was going to be about how to throw a cocktail party.
bohm said:
There are some here that have allowed themselves to become so negative about faith and spirituality with regards to Jah and His son that they have turned this forum into more darkness than light therefore not allowing so many to join- in outta fear not being strong enough to have a voice.
Exactly, Bohm. Who's to blame if someone doesn't have the strength to post ANONYMOUSLY on an internet forum??? They're only pixels, peepol, only pixels. As Eleanor Roosevelt said, "no one can make you feel inferior without your letting them do so". Take responsibility and ownership of your own emotions: they're YOURS.
In fact, I can think of NO BETTER WAY to build one's self-esteem THAN to engage in anonymous conversations on exactly such a forum! Maintain your anonymity, and if it all goes horribly wrong, then you simply delete the account. OR don't log in. OR create a new ID. Or unplug the computer.
You live and learn, and you don't get anymore of a free training-wheel environment than forums like this.
Soft+gentile said:
KS - is this an inquisition
loss in the sense of being the lowest common denominator
Nope, just clarifying: I didn't want to write an essay on experiencing loss as an atheist, and then have you say you really meant something else...
But in thinking about it, everyone deals with loss in the same general way, although everyone goes thru steps at a different rate, or experiences relapse in steps.
Generally, psychologists refer to the stages of grief following loss by the acronym DABDA:
1) denial, i.e. "this is not happening to me"
2) anger, i.e. "why me? This is unfair!"
3) bargaining, i.e. appeals to God(s). (atheists skip this step: it's sort of the Shibboleth Test for atheists who are actually theists, if they DO bargain; OR theists bargain, and then realize there is no God, experiencing an epiphany in the process that external reality doesn't care about one's opinions or wishes)
4) depression,
5) acceptance (or resignation). i.e. "it happened, and there's nothing I could do to change the past".
Depending on the belief system, people go thru the grief process at different rates; some abuse substances to stay in steps, etc. But the process is rather universal to most.
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You asked how I deal with loss. I'll relate my tale.
My Mom died when I was late teens. When I got the news, I cried for awhile, but then asked myself if I was crying/grieving for HER sake, or for my loss? She was dying of terminal cancer, in constant pain, withering away, and the prognosis was grim. From her perspective, her continued existence had become nothing but misery, a struggle, every breath a fight. She was now peaceful. It was over. It wasn't a question of IF, but WHEN.
Now sure, it's OK for me to have grieved MY loss of a Mother, the fact she wouldn't see what I became, etc, but she got me to a point in life where I could make it on my own! In fact, her terminal caregiver nurse told me after she died that my Mom WAS holding on just to know that I (her youngest) would make it on my own, and once she knew that, she was free to let go... That's all any parent can hope for their children, to give them the life-skills needed to survive, to thrive in their absense.
That moment reminds me of the words of Jesus when he said, "it is done" and expired. That's a Biblical example, but it's also the frame of reference I grew up with, even if it's a truth that transcends any particular interpretation of any given "holy" text. It's not the exclusive domain of Xianity only, but the domain of LIFE on Earth.
Welcome Tech-No-Buzz! Please tell us more about yourself in a new thread.
@ justmom,
"Why have you not learned from these things and realized it was our choice at some point in our life to remain inside the org... Who's fault is it really if you consider yourself with some sort of intelligence at all? Shouldn't we all have seen through it a long long time ago and not wasted our so-called lives.??"
Now that sounds completely like blaming the victim. WT makes JW kids leaving the cult as much an option as a victim can tell the murderer, "This isn't working for me today. I'm leaving now. Good-bye." You know who SHOULD have the intelligence to NOT allow people to waste their lives in the WT cult? God. If you're going to point the finger at somebody, point it at 'Jah' for allowing a bunch of liars and crooks to go door-to-door misrepresenting him, and allowing parents to brainwash their children into obedience to a destructive cult.
"There is a message that is to be spoken here by means of holy spirit and it is only directed to the ones that know who they are in the deepest of their hearts."
Funny how humans presume to know and presume the right to judge what is in the deepest of other peoples' hearts. And then they presume to speak for a god that obviously doesn't have the ability or interest to speak for him/herself.
"We ALL have our woes!!"
Really? Are you going to yell this false equivalence to try to silence the tears of a little girl that was just raped? "Shut up little girl, we all have our problems!! Don't you realize how much I'm suffering because my soap opera has been preempted by Olympic coverage!! Woe is me!!"
Sorry justmom, but you've really made it sound like you are the one that has still not learned anything since leaving WT.
soft +gental You asked how do you cope with LOSS????
I lost my baby Faith in the 2nd world war ( bomb) I lost my Daughter Melanie ( cancer 42 yrs old) I lost my son Alan 46 heart attack. Ive lost my daughter Annmarie to the WT( shuns me...) lost my granddaughter Heather to the WT ( shuns me) Cant see my great grand son ( wt orders )Lost my hubby Cancer in 1985..The only thing I had left after 1985 was my religion Jehovahs Witnesses .... I thought I was a regular JOB!!!!! Know what ???? They kicked me out two years after my hubby died 1987 WHY?????? because the only thing I didnt believe was that Jesus came invisably in 1914.... So how did I cope????? I came to the conclussion that I am on my own!!!!!Nothing left to live for... Then I met a couple who asked me to go with them to an EX JW convention...So I went & I found so many folks who had lost so much because we had given out minds over to a false Prophet...The old men at Brooklyn. I now have so many wonderful "family" on here & all over the world... I have to add,,, Not all feel as I do but I believe there is a Creator( only because of the wonderful things my eyes see,)I also believe there is an evil force I call Satan ruling the earth, I believe MY GOD allows it but will eventually put His foot down.& stop it all. He told the angel of death> Satan he could try do what he bragged he could do, Get every one on earth to follow HIM> Satan. Yes he seems to be doing a pretty good recruitment ..But there are still some of us who trust in the LORD with all out hearts"And pray for HIS guidence,direction,teaching..
I hope your loss,lessens (((HUG))
I recognize that I had a part of responsibility in becoming and staying a witness for so many years, but STILL, my faith in God and the Bible was taken advantage of by this organization, and I blame THEM for that, because unlike my previous religion (Catholicism), they have interfered in my life, affecting my personal decisions, invading my privacy, manipulating me to follow them while hiding what they really are.
SO, the main thing I learned from the whole experience is to never be so naïve again as to follow anyone so blindly in the name of anything.
SO, the main thing I learned from the whole experience is to never be so naïve again as to follow anyone so blindly in the name of anything.
Right on, homey. Right on. I personally don't believe in God anymore, BUT.... i will go on record as saying that if there IS some sort of Diety, there ain't no man-made organization on this blue marble who's got his/her/its "direct line", that's fo sho.
Right on Mr. Falcon/apostatethunder --
mouthy --- you're an inspiration and appreciate your faith/strength. I will reflect on your loss next time I have a pity party over my family of origin (non-witnesses). Love to you.
