Hearing the Voice of God or His Messenger

by OnTheWayOut 40 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  AGuest

  This view has become the focus of efforts to understand and help patients with mental illness quiet their minds.

  Interesting article, truly, dear OTWO (peace to you!).

  But it is not their minds that I would be concerned about. Rather, I would tell them to quiet... their hearts... by removing (i.e.. "conquering")... the fear, anger, hatred, doubt... guilt... hypocrisy... deceit... you know, all that "stuff" just that gets in the way... that makes all the "noise."

  How do they do that? It starts... with understanding that, contrary to what earthling man (and "the Bible", etc.) has told them (and tells them, yet)... the Most Holy One of Israel not only does NOT require such... doesn't WANT it... indeed, actually despises it. It is of absolutely NO benefit to HIM... and certainly not to the one "suffering" as a result of such... ummmm... "thoughts" and "feelings."

  But then what? I would tell them to replace them... with love, mercy, forgiveness, faith, kindness, long-suffering, tolerance, compassion, pity, humility... JOY... and things like THESE... things that ARE beneficial... to the one who manifests them... to those upon whom such one bestows them... as WELL as to the Most Holy One of Israel.... because THEN... others will see GOD... in YOU.

  I would tell them, let yourself be wronged. So, what? Big deal. And... stop judging... anyone... and everyone. For believing in God and following God... or for not believing in God or following God. For whatever. And get over it... whatever it is. Move on. You HAVE to... to survive. So, don't wallow in misery. Don't hold onto the "stuff"... but let it go. Live... and let live. But live in a way so that you can STAND before any man... indeed, before the throne of God... NOT because you are "without sin"... but because you LOVE... which love will COVER [the] "multitude of" [your] "trangressions. I would tell them show kindness to your fellow man... regardless of who he is, where he comes from, what he looks like, who he loves, who he hates, who he sleeps with. Indeed, even if he is your enemy. Open your heart... and your hand... indeed, if called upon... your home. Let your "LIGHT" shine... and not your "darkness."

  I would tell them... and don't worry about what earthling man says about you... ever... for doing such. Because what HE thinks... what HE sees... is of NO consequence: he can't save himself, let alone YOU. YOU... have to be who... and what... you are... and PROVE that, even if it means your life. Otherwise, you are right: your entire life has been a waste and entirely in vain. Because it hasn't been YOUR life... but the life imposed upon you by others... who really couldn't care less... now... or in the end of it all. And otherwise, you WILL die... if not now, later.

  I would empower them to be who they know they are... children of God... dear OTWO... not medicate and further numb them.

  I bid you peace, dear OTWO... you and your entire household, truly... to time indefinite.

  YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

  SA
• 

  wobble

  A very interesting and informative thread OTWO ! Thanks.

  I wonder about the Apostle Paul's experience on the road to Damascus.

  I do believe that he "Heard" the voice , but no one else did, other phenomena were making too much noise for them !

  As modern meds, caffeine and most other things can be ruled out in Paul's case I guess the "heightened emotional state" brought on by persecuting Christians must have caused it.

  He certainly believed that experience was real, and he also believed that later, he had been taken up to the "Third Heaven", he seemed to be a bit prone to these things.
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  I won't go so far as to say that Paul definitely had schizophrenia, but Occum's Razor demands the simplest explanation, and it explains the "revelations" of the Apostle Paul. Michael Abram, the man who stabbed ex-Beatle George Harrison, also thought he was on a mission from God when he did so. It turns out that this man was a paranoid schizophrenic. A woman in Texas, Andrea Yates, drowned her five kids "because God told me to."

  I could picture Paul going around like the Blues Brothers:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKZSqd5Y8nA

  If the voice is telling you to do something, anything at all, please seek medical help before you are so sure you should heed advice from your "voice."

  Newsweek ran a cover story on schizophrenia (Newsweek, March 11, 2002, p. 46+). Read some excerpts from this news story, and see if it is possible to apply it to the Apostle Paul and someone with rampant untreated schizophrenia:

  Whether it brings the voices of heaven or of hell, it causes what must surely be the worst affliction a sentient, conscious being can suffer: the inability to tell what is real from what is imaginary. To the person with schizophrenia the voices and visions sound and look as authentic as the announcer on the radio and the furniture in the room.

  In paranoid schizophrenia, the patient becomes convinced of beliefs at odds with reality, hears voices that aren't there or see images that exist nowhere but in his mind. ...The voices the patients heard were therefore as real to them as the conversations in the hallways they passed through en route to the lab. ...(Andrea)Yates, who has a deeply religious background had satanic hallucinations. ...The seeming authenticity of the voices means that people with schizophrenia can be barraged by commands that, they are convinced, come from God or Satan. That inference is not illogical; who else can speak to you, unseen, from inside your mind?
• 

  cantleave

  Does it say anything about Merlot or Zinfandel?

  Shelby - forget the wines, you need some good English Real Ales!
• 

  PSacramento

  It is an interesting situation one is put ine when one hears the VOICE ( there are no voices when one hears God or Jesus, just one voice):

  Am I going mad?

  WTF was that ???

  Can't be God, he never answered before...why know??? why me??

  I must be exhausted...I just need some sleep..maybe I am sick...coming down with something...

  To think that people that hear The Voice don't think these things is a misconception.

  Sure many people think that God is talking to them, when it may just be all sated above, or worse.

  How does one know?

  Well...while most would advocate professional help, I think all here know that doesn't always work, on either side of the issue.

  Of course, a simple way to view it is what is the Voice telling you?

  To do good or bad? to love or hate? to judge or accept? to forgive or condem?

  Is this voice telling you ANYTHING or just making you feel loved, accepted, surrounding you in warmth and making you feel "at home"?

  I mean...well...I think I am getting to personal here to be honest and that is as far as I wish to go.

  In closing:

  If the Voice you hear is telling you to love, accept, forgive and not judge, how bad can it be?

  If it is telling you to do otherwise, well....perhaps it is not the voice you wanna hear.
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  Just imagine if we could get into our "Way Back" Machine (time machine) and see what happened.
  The book of Acts says that Saul (Paul) saw a flash of light and fell to the ground, then heard the voice of the lord.
  Some people assert (without evidence, granted) that Saul could have been on a donkey (or horse) when this happened.
  Whether that is true or not, could all of his missionary journeys be the result of a "fall" that caused him to hear a voice?

  Hey, I don't want to get into debate about Bible history. The main point is to get legitimate medical help if you hear voices.
• 

  thenoblelodge

  OTWO - Are you saying/suggesting AGuest has a mental problem... seriously.

  I have a brother who has schizophrenia. He hears voices but they bring him no peace, offer him no help and therefore he cannot help others.To be honest ... he scares the very life out of me because he can be violent and very aggressive. Schizophrenics are never (to my knowledge) loving, kind, peaceful or capable of showing love. Trust me I do have experience of this.

  They are nothing like the ones who hear voices and post what they hear on this board. What has been posted by Shelby has bought comfort to many including me and other members of my family. People with mental health issues (namely schizophrenia) are usually not capable of doing that.

  Sorry if I speak out of turn but I do follow Shelby's posts and I am aware of the stalkers who stalk just to have a go at her.

  Your post rattled me.
• 

  Crisis of Conscience

  OTWO, in my opinion, this is an excellent post and video as well.

  It's actually something that I think about when I read some experiences here as well as hear things about the GB.

  I am not directing this to anyone specific here nor is it my intent to offend. If I do, my deepest apologies; I really mean that. You are entitled to your beliefs, as am I. But what makes me so different in that God (or whoever) doesn't talk to me? I'm not willing to believe that I haven't given him the chance. I have tried with pure sincerity to express myself in prayer and never heard a voice. And no joke intended, I'm not deaf.

  Sure one can reason, "Oh, he's answered you but you don't realize or haven't perceived it." Alright, when I ask someone if they want to be my friend or simply ask if I could borrow money, I generally get a clear and audible response. No guessing game there. Not hard to realize or perceive, but admittedly may be hard to accept.

  WHY the hillbilly does it have to be so gollygeegoshdarn hard with God? WHY do I have to guess at his answer? Better yet, WHY does he only seem to talk to 'some' on this board or even the GB? Am I that imperfect? He supposedly made his voice heard before many when Jesus was on earth and now it's a guessing game? COME ON!!

  So much for a best friend, who never responds. Or in my possible, complete ignorance, I never hear it.

  CoC
• 

  PSacramento

  Hey, I don't want to get into debate about Bible history. The main point is to get legitimate medical help if you hear voices.

  I agree, with one cavet ( is that the word?), try to understand that the medical community is not always the most loving and accepting of communities.

  That said, if one hears voice(s) the motivate one to do bad things either directly or by NOT doing something, medical attention wouldn't hurt.

  I think that there needs to be a trust element with our personal doctor, there are many conditions that can cause this, as you mentioned, but if you don't have any of them, what then?

  Are you crazy because you hear a voice ( your conscience) telling you to love your fellow man, to be good, to give to those that need, to not judge others and accept people, to remind yourself that you are imperfect as they are?
• 

  OnTheWayOut

  Thenoblelodge, I will admit that reading of AGuest made me think of this, but I didn't apply it to her. She judges me "ignorant" and I admit that I am. I post this as I said, "The main point is to get legitimate medical help if you hear voices." I don't wish to remain in ignorance, so I looked things up and share them.

  Thanks, PSac for reminding any who hear a voice that they don't have to accept a label of "insane" or "mentally ill" and that they can be good people. Certainly, medical science doesn't have all the answers and nobody needs to automatically be medicated, especially if the voice is not giving specific directions to the person hearing it.