Jehovah and the Munchausen Syndrome

by Terry 67 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Mary

  Had Jehovah actually LOVED man He would not have condemned him to death in the first place. He would have diciplined man as a learning and growth experience.

  That's long been my feeling on the matter-----even when I was a fairly dedicated Witness, I simply could not comprehend how eating a freaking apple was enough to justify the punishment. Remember that one stupid illustration in the Live Forever book that showed a child being wheeled into an operating room with her parents close by and the caption read: 'would you let your child go through a painful operation if the end result saved them?' or something like that. I remember thinking "um, if I had the power to heal my child without them having to go through a painful operation, then why wouldn't I just do that?"

  Punishing Adam and Eve with death because they ate some fruit that they were told not to, would be equivalent to a parent murdering their child because they ate a cookie before supper when you told them not to. And then murdering your grandchildren and your great-grandchildren, etc. because of what their parents and grandparents had done.

  Makes no damn sense to me.
• 

  nugget

  Although I see the point I don't entirely commit to it. In Munchausen Syndrome the child is passive they neither create the symptoms nor are they complicit in the act. If you believe the Bible account the creator outlined what was needed for the spiritual children to remain in good health and good standing.

  The account states that although Eve was misled Adam was fully aware of the consequences of the act and was active in making the choice for sickness and death. The account shows Adam betraying the trust God places in him and making a selfish decision resulting in sickness and death for all. We do not know what mercy may have existed for Eve had Adam remained true to his principles. Did God set them up to fail? I don't know, he did give them the knowledge to succeed as well and that should not be ignored. It could be argued that we are viewing events from the perspective of imperfection so it is impossible to really know the thought processes of a perfect man who may never have existed.

  God sending his son and performing the rescue does appear extreme and may well be symptomatic of another syndrome but the parallel with Munchausen syndrome is not clear.
• 

  BabaYaga

  Mary said:

  Punishing Adam and Eve with death because they ate some fruit that they were told not to, would be equivalent to a parent murdering their child because they ate a cookie before supper when you told them not to. And then murdering your grandchildren and your great-grandchildren, etc. because of what their parents and grandparents had done.
  
  Makes no damn sense to me.

  Exactly.
• 

  snowbird

  Nugget.

  I'd actually formulated a reply using that very logic, but canceled it!

  Wow!

  Sylvia
• 

  cult classic

  "Did God set them up to fail? I don't know, he did give them the knowledge to succeed as well and that should not be ignored."

  Actually he didn't give them the knowledge to succeed. The sentence for getting this knowledge (which they got when they ate from the tree) was death. So by the time they got the "knowledge" by eating from that tree, it was too late. (Gen 2:17)

  I have to echo Mary's comment too. I used to think the same thing when I would study with people. One of those questions in the Live Forever book was "if you had the power to end all of the suffering in the world, wouldn't you do it?" Well DUH! obviously that's a yes. So why hasn't Jehovah ended the suffering in the world?........... because his ways are higher than ours

  And here we are millenniums later...........
• 

  Terry

  Neither Adam nor Eve had any life experience at making important (life or death) decisions.)

  The very first one they made they were condemned to death for.
• 

  tec

  The result of sin is death. Adam sinned, and then he hid from God. There was a wedge between them that hadn't been there before, and that wedge is spiritual death.

  Putting that into perspective today: Say you've done something wrong to your spouse or parent or any loved one; there is then a wedge between you (guilty conscience, fear of being caught, etc). To remove that wedge, you usually have to fess up and hope for forgiveness from the wronged party. This is the wedge between God and mankind -because we all continue to do things against his instruction. But instead of leaving us to our separation from God, God is reconciling us to Him through Jesus.

  Giving us life (spiritual) as a free gift that covers over our sins - (of which the result is a spiritual separation from God - death).

  Tammy
• 

  cult classic

  So Terry what I failed to say up above is I think it's a good comparison ---- god made us sick and then gave us the remedy
• 

  aSphereisnotaCircle

  Putting that into perspective today: Say you've done something wrong to your spouse or parent or any loved one; there is then a wedge between you (guilty conscience, fear of being caught, etc). To remove that wedge, you usually have to fess up and hope for forgiveness from the wronged party. This is the wedge between God and mankind -because we all continue to do things against his instruction. But instead of leaving us to our separation from God, God is reconciling us to Him through Jesus.

  I didn't eat any forbidden fruit, what do I have to fess up to?

  Now think about it, if god couldn't get his two "perfect" creations to listen to his instructions, they why on earth does he expect it from "imperfect" humans, that makes no sense.

  If god is displeased with his creation, who does he have to blame but himself?

  One time my pre schooler was trying to draw a picture, she was very unhappy with it, no matter how hard she tried she could not create the picture she wanted to create, she finally threw her crayons on the ground and yelled "stupid crayons".

  That's just how "god" behaves.
• 

  cult classic

  Sphere & Terry here here!!