Me, the WT, and the "Separating Work"...

by AGuest 122 Replies latest jw friends

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    May you all have peace!

    A little while ago a dear one referred to my trip to "Bethel" and discussion with Carey Barber. Apparently, that reference peaked someone's interest and they contacted me for more information. As we discussed that event, we also discussed my letter to the WTBTS regarding their erroneous teaching about the "separation work," the contents of which turned up in one of the October 1995 WTs. The interested person has asked that I recount the circumstances of that event and I have agreed. What occurred was this:

    The time was February 1994, and I was attending the DC with my family. Until that time, the WTBTS taught that the "separating of the sheep and goats" had begun in 1914 and was continuing until the present day. That subject was the topic of the... now, what do they call that... "keynote address" I think. The "brother" who was giving the talk was reading from the outline that the WTBTS had prepared and at some point he reiterated the belief that the "separating work" was underway. He then read Matthew 25:31-46, particularly verses 31 and 32, which state:

    "But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate them as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats."

    No big deal, right? Well, not quite. When he finished verse 46 he said something like "We are now in the midst of this work," to which the audience all applauded. Except me. I didn't applaud because just then I heard a voice say to me, "That is not accurate. Read it again." And so, I did. But I couldn't "see" anything wrong with the account. The voice again said to me, "Read it again." And I did. Then the voice told me to read Matthew 24:29-31. And I did. And I thought, okkaayyy... what am I missing? And the voice ask me how it could be that Christ had arrived and began separating the sheep from the goats now... BEFORE the "great tribulation"... when he does not even return to gather his chosen ones until AFTER that tribulation? The voice then directed me to 8 or 9 other verses that prove the work could NOT be occurring, yet.

    I remember thinking, as Miz Silvie said, "Well, I'll be..." (what was that word you used, Miz Silvie, "swoped"?)

    I immediately turned to my ex and said, "Oh my gosh, they've got it wrong... the separating work CAN'T be happening now!" And I explained what I heard... and that I had in fact heard a voice tell me this. I then told him that I had to go and tell "them." His response, of course, was "You can't go tell them that! What are you THINKING?!!" Then he shushed me and told me to be quiet. Well, you all know me by now, so that didn't work. tried to get up, but he wouldn't let me at first... and blocked my way. I eventually got past him, though, and went to find the speaker. I mean, I was thinking that this was big. HUGE.

    When I arrived downstairs (we were at the Cow Palace in Burlingame, CA), I had to wait for the speaker to come out. When he did, I was SO excited! Dumb me, I thought "Oh, they're gonna wanna here this, so they can change it, make it right"... yada, yada, yada. Well, the speaker wasn't quite as excited about it as I was. He first said, "Well, I read it straight from the outline, so it must be right." But when I showed him the verses given me HE said, "You know, I almost couldn't read that part. It was like something was stopping me. When I tried to start, I almost couldn't speak. Something just wasn't quite right to me. But that's what it says, and I had to read it as it was written in the outline."

    I then told him, "But it's not the TRUTH! Aren't you supposed to tell the friends what's TRUE?" He got quiet and looked at me for a few seconds and then said, "Well, if it's bothering you that much, why don't you write to the Society and see what they say?"

    And so I did. I wrote them in March of 1994. And I did one of the briefest letters I'd ever written to them, two and a-half pages, the second page of which was a two-column chart showing the corresponding verses that had been given me showing that work COULDN'T be occurring yet. Unfortunately, I didn't hear a thing back... for close to a year. This was a bit disturbing to me because I usually got a fairly quick response ("Wait on Jehovah"... "talk to your CO"... and even "We don't agree..."). True, some letters weren't answered directly, but all of a sudden a question I'd raised would show up in a WT article... along with "new light." I figured, well, they must have gotten the information from the Holy Spirit and so my question was "answered." Two letters, however, were never answered - one, regarding why there were "two laws" between the "anointed" and the "great crowd"... and one regarding how it is that a person's blood... which even they admit has no redeeming value... can "pay" for one's sins.

    So, I was beginning to believe that this one wouldn't be either. And then... 11 months later in February 1995... I received a letter apologizing for the delay in response and asking me to be "patient," that "perhaps something regarding this matter will appear in a future WT publication." Well, you can guess I was pretty excited - "something" was coming. WHOO-HOO! And it did come. In the October (oh, shoot, I now can't remember if it was the 1st or the 15th, it's been so long!) WT... there was article about this very matter! And what was more... THERE WAS MY CHART!! Seriously. In the exact format as I had created it in my letter! In all of its glory! WHOO-HOO... I thought.

    Well, I went to the KH for whatever next meeting and who greets me at the door? The "brother" who was the speaker at that DC. Yep, he was now my PO!! He came up to me and asked, "Have you seen the new WT?" And I said, "Yes, I have. Isn't 'Jehovah' wonderful?!" He then asked me if I had ever written the "Society" before... and I said that I had. He asked me if I had copies of my letters and their responses. I said I did. He asked if he could read them. I said he most certainly could... and gave them to him. He kept them for 2 months.

    When he gave them back he said, "These are very interesting." After that, however, he began to avoid me. And, no, I don't think he did so because HE had a problem with me (indeed, he said, at one of my 14 JD meetings, "Jehovah's going to judge us for this"). No, I think he was directed to avoid me. I think he shared my letters... and the WT responses... with someone, perhaps a CO, even... or some "respected elder" from another congregation. And I was beginning to be "marked."

    At any rate, the Voice began to speak to me more often. But I didn't know who or what it was... and didn't share what I heard. I thought, okay, they (the "Society") don't get it... yet. But they will. In the meantime, I'll just "wait on Jehovah." And then one day the Voice called my name. And after a bit of back and forth, I answered. Shortly after that, "it" sent me to Bethel to meet with Carey Barber (or whichever GB member was available) to get a response to my letter about how it is that a person's blood can "pay" for such one's sins... which, if true, meant no one needed Christ's blood. I thought I was sent because perhaps they hadn't actually received the letter, and so I took a copy with me. I found out when I got there that they certainly had... AND understood what it was saying... AND... really hoped I wouldn't tell anyone else. I also found out that, per Mr. Barber, "the Governing Body hasn't had ANYTHING to do with the Watchtower or Awake since 1972... when we turned it over to the 'Joshua' class in anticipation of 1975. We TOLD everyone that, in the video.* If people would just watch the video, they would KNOW where the information comes from!"

    Well, the sister who went with me and I watched the video. It looped on a monitor in the Headquarters lobby. And it absolutely DOES say where they get the information... and it ISN'T from the anointed, the GB, the Society, or anyone like that. It comes from a file cabinet... one of many, many files cabinets... in a room overseen by the Writing Committee. Various YOUNG men simply peel through the files... and find whatever information is in there on the subject given them (most, from previous WTs or other WTBTS publications)... and write an article. Then, someone else checks it for SPELLING ERRORS... then artwork is added... and VOILA! You have a WT article!

    Anyway, as I said, I was asked to post this and I have. To the dear one who asked... may JAH bless! May the undeserved kindness and mercy of my God and Father, the Most Holy One of Israel, whose name is JAH... of Armies... and the love and peace of His Son and Christ, the Holy Spirit and Holy One of Israel, my Lord, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH... be upon you... and your entire household!

    YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

    SA

    *The first VHS video put out by the WTBTS. Note, you have to look/listen really HARD... because they tell you in all of, what, 5 seconds or less...

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    I think I finally get it with you. Your thoughts here are intentionally so whacked out that we should be able to see the ridiculousness of the religion through the ridiculousness of what you say happened.

    "A voice" told you to read the scripture a few times, even adding surrounding verses. Yeah, right. People get checked into psych wards for hearing voices.

    The Keynote speaker discusses details of his talk with a "woman" and admits "Well, I read it straight from the outline, so it must be right." Sure that happened (with heavy sarcasm).

    Further, you imply that the same "voice" that woke you up may have been trying to stop the keynote speaker- "You know, I almost couldn't read that part. It was like something was stopping me." You don't say that, but that's the way we are supposed to take that. Your ridiculousness factor is extremely high there. I get it. Nobody would believe any of this, so we see how silly the JW's are.

    You "usually got a fairly quick response ("Wait on Jehovah"... "talk to your CO"... and even "We don't agree..."). True, some letters weren'tanswered directly, but all of a sudden a question I'd raised would show up in a WT article... along with "new light." Now that one really got me. Yeah, like the Governing Body or their writers would regularly respond to you about your inspirations and incorporate them into their teachings. WOW, how were we so blind not to see your extreme sarcasm?

    That bit- "I received a letter apologizing for the delay in response and asking me to be "patient," that "perhaps something regarding this matter will appear in a future WT publication."" We should all know how WTS would never apologize and never tell a member that they were going to perhaps use their thoughts in a doctrinal change. Even if they heard you were anointed, they don't give a flying fu*^ what anyone outside of their ivory tower says or writes to them. You done good here showing us how blinded we were.

    But the real topper here, while it may be true that everything comes from a filing cabinet in WT Headquarters instead of from Holy Spirit or the GB, for you to be able to discover that and have a GB member tell you some of their secret- excellent ridiculous ideas coming from you. You could write excellent satire.

  • Highlander
    Highlander

    In california, the authorities can do a 3 day hold on you in a mental institution. I suggest that you refrain from telling others about the voice(s) you are hearing.

  • Think About It
    Think About It

    THE VOICE said, "If you write them, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH will come."

    Think About It

  • AGuest
    AGuest
    I think I finally get it with you.

    Do you now, dear OTWO... and peace to you!

    Your thoughts here are intentionally so whacked out that we should be able to see the ridiculousness of the religion through the ridiculousness of what you say happened.

    "Intentionally" whacked out. If they are intentional, can they be whacked out? If they are whacked out, can they be intentional? I don't think you can have it both ways. What I wrote is absolutely true. Every bit of it. Now, if it shows the religion to be ridiculous, well, so be it.

    "A voice" told you to read the scripture a few times, even adding surrounding verses. Yeah, right. People get checked into psych wards for hearing voices.

    I didn't.

    The Keynote speaker discusses details of his talk with a "woman"

    Me... yes. What do you think he was going to do in front of the "brothers" who made me wait for him? Blow me off? Right then and there? You forget, they do have "appearances" they have to keep up. And he did his part.

    and admits "Well, I read it straight from the outline, so it must be right." Sure that happened (with heavy sarcasm).

    That is what the man said, yes. Verbatim. He told me that he read what he did "straight from the outline," and so what he read "must be right."

    Further, you imply that the same "voice" that woke you up may have been trying to stop the keynote speaker- "You know, I almost couldn't read that part. It was like something was stopping me."

    No. You misread/misunderstand me (but of course). HE was saying (and I know this because we spoke of it later) that almost couldn't read it because IT DIDN'T MAKE SENSE TO HIM, EITHER. BUT... since it was in the outline... it must have been right.

    You don't say that, but that's the way we are supposed to take that.

    Sigh. No. YOU "heard" what YOU heard... because that's what YOU wanted to hear. You WANTED to attribute a bad motive to me... and so you "heard" exactly what YOU needed to to do so.

    Your ridiculousness factor is extremely high there.

    You're entitled to your opinion.

    I get it.

    Apparently, you don't.

    Nobody would believe any of this, so we see how silly the JW's are.

    What? I'm not sure I understand you, here...

    You "usually got a fairly quick response ("Wait on Jehovah"... "talk to your CO"... and even "We don't agree..."). True, some letters weren'tanswered directly, but all of a sudden a question I'd raised would show up in a WT article... along with "new light." Now that one really got me. Yeah, like the Governing Body or their writers would regularly respond to you about your inspirations and incorporate them into their teachings.

    Well, I wouldn't have thought so, either. Especially when they print articles about how information doesn't come through just one person, but it's only after THEY receive it (I am guessing "through holy spirit"). So, I always thought that I wasn't the only one writing, that in fact others... MANY others... were having the same experience as I (I mean, they DO say that the information "comes through" the anointed, don't they?). So, it never even DAWNED on my that various changes ("new light") had anything specific to do with what I wrote. The ONLY time I even entertained that particular thought... was when I saw my chart.

    WOW, how were we so blind not to see your extreme sarcasm?

    (Okay, to the one who asked me to post this - NOW you see why I don't... and just try to stick to what my Lord gives me?)

    That bit- "I received a letter apologizing for the delay in response and asking me to be "patient," that "perhaps something regarding this matter will appear in a future WT publication."" We should all know how WTS would never apologize

    The letter said, and I QUOTE... "We APOLOGIZE for the delay in responding to your question..." AND asked that I "be patient," that "perhaps some additional information regarding this matter may be considered in a future Watchtower article." Close quote.

    and never tell a member that they were going to perhaps use their thoughts in a doctrinal change.

    They NEVER said they were going to use my thoughts. Or anyone's thoughts. Nor did I say that. They didn't even say what the "additional information" was. They DID later say, however, that no one should think that THEY'RE information is used in any article as, again, information "doesn't come through just one person," but it's only after THEY receive it... or something like that.

    Even if they heard you were anointed, they don't give a flying fu*^ what anyone outside of their ivory tower says or writes to them.

    That was my point, dear OTWO. The world, however, calls it plagerism...

    You done good here showing us how blinded we were.

    If the person who asked me to post this is willing... now's a good time to set dear OTWO straight as to why I posted this. Or not. The choice is yours and I respect it... and you... still. It's my "torture stake" not yours, so if you remain silent it's absolutely okay.

    But the real topper here, while it may be true that everything comes from a filing cabinet in WT Headquarters instead of from Holy Spirit or the GB,

    Well, that's what Barber implied when he referred us to the video, which says that IS how it's done...

    for you to be able to discover that and have a GB member tell you some of their secret

    He told me that NOT because it was such a secret. He did so because he found himself in the "hotseat" trying to answer a question he could not (how is it that our blood can atone for our sins...) and... dear old man that he was... he gave up his cronies to save his own butt. He asked if I was "anointed." I did not answer. The sister who was with me (who is also a member of the Body of Christ) said, "Yes," after which he face went pale, he began to tremble... and I knew from the fact that he could no longer LOOK AT ME... that HE was not who HE claimed to be... and that he KNEW I knew it. I felt more pity for him than anything else. I knew that the only reason he was continuing with the facade was because he had no where else to go. I knew, when I looked in his eyes... which said to ME, "Please have mercy on me..." that he had given his WHOLE life to a fake situation, that by the time he realized it it was too late for him, and that if he spoke up, he would be out on his ear in 90 seconds flat. And so he continued to perpetuate the lie... because he had no where else to go. If he would have listened, I would have told him that there was no WHERE to go away to... but only a whom... and that if he needed, he could have come and lived with me.

    - excellent ridiculous ideas coming from you. You could write excellent satire
    .

    I wrote the truth, dear OTWO... and makes absolutely NO difference to you whether you believe it or not. I have not mentioned the names of the PO or the sister who accompanied me out of respect for their privacy. Her identity I will keep private but you are certainly welcome to have his, so that you can call him and check if you wish. Although I know I eventually became the bane of his existence as a PO (we had actually became friends and he tried to stop my DF'ing, but his co-elders wouldn't have it)... I know him to be an honest man. I don't think he will lie about it to you, if you asked him straight out. Then again, that organization has a way of "changing" people, so... I might be wrong. But, let me know if you want to talk to him. I will give you his name... and congregation.

    I bid you peace.

    YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

    SA

  • AGuest
    AGuest
    In california, the authorities can do a 3 day hold on you in a mental institution. I suggest that you refrain from telling others about the voice(s) you are hearing.

    I know, dear Highlander (and peace to you!), but I've had to put that fear behind me. Indeed, similar fear (of what "earthling man" could "do" to me) kept me from partaking for 12 years while in the WTBTS. And each year I felt worse and worse as I passed the bread and wine by. I felt like *I* was dying! I KNEW I was doing the wrong thing... but I feared what the "friends" (yeah, right) would do to my children. And they did try, once I started partaking. (No, I wasn't concerned with they would do to me - indeed, what COULD they do to me? I had some of that same initial fear when I started posting what I heard, first on H20, then here).

    Considering the world/country we/I live in, my education, security clearances, background and employment, etc.... it is something that used to keep me up nights, albeit briefly. Now, though, I'm no longer concerned with that at all. If they come... they come. I mean, if the folks here want to turn me over, that's entirely up to them - those who know and love me would never do that. But my Lord DID say that "brother will deliver up brother," so even that will not come as a surprise. And my children... and other closely loved ones... are ready. They know me... and they know my honesty and integrity.

    So, as I hear, I share. And as I see, I share it. As to what has happened with me and the WTBTS, I share. Honestly and truthfully. Gotta. Hope you understand. Don't hold it against you if you don't.

    Again, peace to you!

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • snowbird
    snowbird
    I remember thinking, as Miz Silvie said, "Well, I'll be..." (what was that word you used, Miz Silvie, "swoped"?)

    Swoped is the correct term, Shelby.

    For what it's worth, I want you to know that I believe every word.

    I, too, had a problem with the so-called "separating work."

    How could a person possibly be judged on how she/he responds to a so-called Bible message?

    Sylvia

  • Heartbreaker
    Heartbreaker

    Ooohh......kaaaay........

  • AGuest
    AGuest
    THE VOICE said, "If you write them, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH will come."

    Actually, dear Think (may you, too, have peace!)... the Voice [eventually] said, "I am here, child. You know who I am and you know my voice. Say what I tell you..." which is not quite the same thing. Think about it and, again, I bid you peace.

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    "Intentionally" whacked out. If they are intentional, can they be whacked out? If they are whacked out, can they be intentional? I don't think you can have it both ways.

    He [GB member] asked if I was "anointed." I did not answer. The sister who was with me (who is also a member of the Body of Christ) said, "Yes," after which he face went pale, he began to tremble... and I knew from the fact that he could no longer LOOK AT ME... that HE was not who HE claimed to be... and that he KNEW I knew it. I felt more pity for him than anything else. I knew that the only reason he was continuing with the facade was because he had no where else to go.

    Stop! Stop! Oh, you make me laugh so hard my soda comes out my nose. This is hilarious. You could get a stand-up gig in front of Bethelites or maybe even at some Aposta-Fest.

    I love how you stay in character here on JWN. We'd love to meet the real you one day.

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