by watson 347 Replies latest jw friends
Rob, I am for health care reform too. This system has a lot that needs fixing. A lot. I am just not for the same kind of reforms they are for. They always accuse those that don't agree that if you are not for outright socialization, you are for the current system. That is a simply brain dead way of thinking. Someone needs to pull the plug on a few in here. Their life support is raising insurance premiums. And their breathing is pumping CO2 into the atmosphere.
BTS
Burns points are only good if you are an insurance company CEO, or a glassy eyed neocon.
See above, Beks.
Goodnight. Love yas but love you best, BTS.
But you are right Rob, it's still warm here, the sky is clear and the stars are out, and my pool is calling.
I am just not for the same kind of reforms they are for.
Which is to say he's not for anything that might further inhance the image of the President.
Goodnight. Love yas but love you best, BTS.
Love you too, Robbie.
Which is to say he's not for anything that might further inhance the image of the President.
What a rube. It is all politics with you isn't it? I am against the President's policies in this area. Comprende, pendejo? I could care less about his fricking image. I don't worship the guy and lose sleep worrying about his image like you do. I could care less. His image, whether good or bad, does nothing for me. His policies however, do. And if on the balance, I hate his policies, then a bad image is a plus as far as I am concerned. It will prevent him from enacting them. I follow ideas, not men. And if you look at the polls, Xerxes is looking pretty scratched up lately. He wants to chain himself to the millstone of socialized healthcare? He'd better hope it doesn't slide off the deck, because it will take him down with it.
BTS
There is charity, which we should all be encouraged to do and should do. But here is a difference: with socialist programs, you have entitlements. You are entitled to get a free ride on the backs of the rest of us. On the other hand, with charity, you are depending on the kindness of others. No one is entitled to charity from another. Charity is a gift. The giver is empowered by showing kindness anmd mercy(which is the only true power), and the receiver is educated and raised up by the good act of the former. That psychological difference alone, is enormous. The first breeds a dependent class of people. The second does not. Also, I am not so severe as to not be willing to give a hand up to someone temporarily down and out. Even if it is government funded. But a basically functioning person that can work over long periods of time? Get out of my house, loser.
BTS
Well, I can't sleep thinking about this. One thing that I can't get off my mind is the feeling I had when getting help from the government, I felt badly, ashamed, and embarrassed. I felt like a low-life citizen. I was in a horrible predicament and many days I woke up and thought, crap I am still breathing. I had very little skills, lived in a backwoods Arkansas town, pop 2,500. I could not get gainfully employed as no one would hire me with 5 small children to care for, not mentioning again I lived in a very small town. I got creative and started my own business. It was not until I moved out of the state did I have a chance to get sucessful in getting off aid. I don't want anyone to feel like I did in needing that assistance. You have to dip way below the poverty level to get out of it as benefits get cut as you begin to make money. Whether you get it from the government or some charity, it is all a gift isn't it? But, people like you made me feel badly in an already bad situation. The government watched me like a hawk and I hated it. I was humbled beyond belief after coming out of a marriage where money was never a problem. So, I can only imagine how people must feel with illnesses that they cannot pay for and go bankrupt, lose their homes, etc. Thankfully, I remained healthy, who knows what the outcome would have been otherwise. But, I worried about it constantly, giving me some health problems for awhile, until the doctor said if I did not get a handle on it, I would not live to see my 30th birthday.
Not everyone that is "needy" is scum. In your world Burns, when the going gets tough, it feels like you are saying Tough Shit.
I never in my wildest dreams would have thought I would be in a situation as I was. But I found that we can wake up any given day and things just are not the same as the day before.
Whether it comes from charity or the government it should all be thought of as a gift. In the pool of humanity we are all valuable. We all have something to offer. For some it is money, some it's intelligence, others compassion, some heal, some give us beautiful arts and music, some give us a nice homecooked meal and a listening ear. We can only be better if we care for each others basic needs. When that is done MOST people will feel good and be eager and willing to contribute.
This hits me close as I have been in many different situations, married and well taken care of materially, struggling as a single mom needing a handout, working my way out of that situation feeling all proud, independant and resourceful and then finding myself unemployed and uninsured again. Older in an economy that is not doing well. Hoping that everyday no accident comes my way or serious illness, telling my children to just let me die rather than run up huge medical bills. Do you think my kids want to hear something like that?
Anyway, I have said way more than ever anticipated. This is just not about money, it is about people, People that live and breath, that we love and care for, some we don't, but hopefully they have someone that loves them and if they don't, at least some stranger cares enough to see that they are properly looked after as far as their health goes without being made to feel like scum from the bottom of the earth.
purps
(((((((purps)))))))
Well said Purps. I know the pain only too well. I didn't want this kind of life and will be glad when the next chapter comes. When you're at the bottom there's only one way to go.
Josie
Not everyone that is "needy" is scum. In your world Burns, when the going gets tough, it feels like you are saying Tough Shit.
That's because people like BTS care only about themselves. You would think the son of immigrants who were welcomed with open arms by our countries "socialized" government programs would have a little more appreciation. One of the greatest lessons learned from the Great Depression was the need for a social safety net. For every scumbag out there gaming the system there are ten honest people just trying to better their lives, but people like BTS and John Doe lump them all together and assume they're all losers. Purps your story sounds very similar to my mother's. When she fled in the middle of the night with 3 young children to escape the abuse of my alcoholic father, it was government run "socialized" programs which saved our lives. Had we had the misfortune to be in the same situation before WIC, HUD housing, Welfare, the School Lunch program, Pell Grants, etc. we likely would have been raised in a life of drugs and prostitution. Instead my mother was able to receive a helping hand and get an education. We then moved up to lower middle class status.
Let me say this again: For every ONE scumbag out there, there are ten honest people who just need some help. This is one of the core differences between us Democrats and the Republican/Conservative/Libertarian philosophies. Democrats believe in a social safety net, the other side believes in their own bank accounts. "Pull yourself up by your own bootstraps" and "rugged individualism."
Now everybody watch while BTS and John Doe proceed to flame me. Here come the insults about my intelligence and whatever else they can come up with. Whatever, I have a Calculus class to go to.
