Mr. Flipper, as long as you got his back......
it'll be a'right
Mr. Flippers Son makes Best Reply yet to Witness Mom's 4th E-Mail
by flipper 29 Replies latest jw friends
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flipper
DINAH- I've got his back for the rest of his life sis ! Peace out to you, hope you are doing well .Peace out, Mr. Flipper
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searcher
Excellent reply from your son Mr Flipper.
I am still shaking my head over this (2nd email) does she actually have no understanding of what she wrote here? (seems not)
you are still listening to a source, and letting it lead you, so you are no different, than any organized group.
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Jankyn
The Watchtower society insists that humans are inherently corrupt, and there is nothing that can be done by any of us to change that. What a depressing world it must be to live with that viewpoint . I wholeheartedly disagree. I choose to see the inherent goodness in all of us.
He nails it right there. That's one of the things that makes me craziest in trying to talk to JW relatives: their pessimistic world view. It also puts the lie to "the happiest people in the world." Oh, no, they aren't! They're always looking for proof that everything is getting worse--which probably goes a long, long way to explaining the depression and "illness of the month" that seems so endemic among JWs.
But I think we all, eventually, come to the place where we have to stop trying to talk sense to crazy people. If a person believes that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God (though if you actually read it, it says that Jesus is the Word, not the Bible), you can never have a conversations because the premises cannot be agreed upon. Mom believes the Bible is true; I think it's just a book. No room for a discussion to begin, because we share no common ground.
Sooner or later, I fear, Mr. Flipper's son will realize one simply cannot reason with unreasonable people.
Jankyn
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Mincan
Yes, Jehovah does love mankind in general .
In general? WTF? This is an excuse to kill certain people.
He loved the world so much he gave his only son so mankind could have a chance to live again. I hope that clears things up for you.
Yeah, as if we could ever forget....
I choose to see the inherent goodness in all of us. There is a change underway Mom. We are breaking free from the few evil individuals who choose to oppress the masses . I choose to help this shift . Humans are not helpless !!! We can change our reality, but it takes work ! It is simply a lie that nothing can be done to change the way things are !!! If we rely on someone else to do things for us, we will never make any progress towards a better existence . Change for the better starts with each and every one of us !!!
Sounds as if I could learn a lot from your son.
Your son is a good writer, and this first letter was very good. It used tact but was also firm.
Now if I would of just thrown you in, you would not even be here to talk about your expererience .
This is sad, it shows a complete denial of an amount of cognitive dissonance I don't even want to imagine.
Jehovah gave so much
Except compassion and mercy... wasn't Justice one of his "Four Cardinal" principle attributes? Killing 6.8 billion for the actions of 2 seems like the reasoning of a God I want nothing to do with.
Have you even thought about your own children, would you feel safe telling your own daughter that all people are loving and hang out with whoever ?
Holy S+it! Wish I'd been given this chance. My life would be... *sigh* ... much different...
please remember son, the Bible guides my life.
Yes mother... that's the problem...
Should my son let her stew? Reply again ?
I think he and she have both made their premises known to each other. Thus let it die down for now I would say. As others have mentioned, his emotional and mental stability are important. I envy him his, and wouldn't want him to lose it! I have to avoid my mother to keep whatever of them I have.
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flipper
SEARCHER- You are right. I think she has no comprehension or understanding of what she writes. I think my son did a great job of trying to reason with her .
JANKYN- Yes, I agree. It is impossible to convince witnesses that we could possibly be good because they believe in inherited sin from Adam and Eve. I think it's a useless battle with her too. My son is going to take a break from trying to convince her.
MINCAN- Thanks dude. He is a good writer as you say. Yeah, even being his dad, I've learned a lot from him too . I could not believe how insensitive a comment his mom made about the " throwing him in the pool " comment. That statement is still giving me the chills and creeps me out. He is going to let it die down for awhile as I talked with him last night, and he said it was stressing him out too much to recieve her written blasts of self righteous bantering. He realizes he can only take it in small doses or it will drive him crazy ! Good comments Mincan, thanks ! Peace out, Mr. Flipper
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momzcrazy
Mr Flipper, thank you so much. You are a sweet man.
I had called Mom and left a message, she didn't answer either phone. Very brief, we've left and are doing the holidays. I didn't want her shocked when her dad got a card. Said I love you, lots. After 2 days this is the email I got.
"My turn I guess.
I have felt for the last several months that I've been excluded from you and
K's lives, like I am no part of the family anymore, and didn't know
why. I guess I understand why now. When K said she wanted to spend more time
with family, I didn't realize at the time that she wasn't referring to me.
I think right now my heart is hurting more than I could ever imagine.
You kids are what has kept me going everyday since the day each of you were born,
and I love you each so much it hurts. As a Mother yourself now, you know that nothing
in the world can ever take away that love you have for your children. But sometimes,
kids grow up and go their own way and choose a life that they no longer want a parent
a part of. I'm feeling that now with both you and K, so I'll back away
and let you each live your life the way you choose....but I will never not love
you or the grandkids.
You have the right to choose what you think is best for you and the kids whether
I agree or not, and I'll respect that...I made that decision also at one time,
for different reasons, but my decision was for me only, unfortunately your's
involves 3 other little precious lives that I love very much.
Chaunte', I was truly so happy when you got your new home and was able to start
a new life, but as time went on I could see you becoming busier with your friends,
the kids, Jason and his family. I feel like I did when Jason brought you here from
Utah, The Somervilles had you here and I was 2000 miles away and I didn't have
you. It's like they have won again only this time it's what you and the
kids want. So I'll leave it at that.
I love you too, Chaunte'"My sister DA'd herself and happened to email mom the same night as my phone call. She also confirmed Mom's suspicions that she is in fact a lesbian.
After 2 emails from sis this is what she received. ( I have her permission BTW)
What do I say?
> >
> > No, this isn't what I envisioned and I'm angry.
> >
> > You are my daughter, K, and nothing can ever change the love that
I
have for you. You kids have been my life and the reason I had to get
through each day, and I never thought that any of you would purposely
choose a life that meant I couldn't be a part of that life, but you and Te
have done that. Everthing that I came to TN for is gone, I never thought my
heart could hurt as much as it does right now.
> >
> > You have the right to choose your way of life, right or wrong...and
I'll respect your right, But you know I'll never accept your lifestyle
choice because you've turned your back on Jehovah's standards.
> >
> > I'm sorry if the Brother's have been insensitive and lacked compassion,
but it hurts me to think that you are using that as an excuse to break
Jehovah's law, and turn your back on him. What they may have done or not
done doesn't change Jehovah's laws or standards. Nothing is going to change
how Jehovah or Jesus feels about this, not even their compassion.
> >
> > I truly hope this is worth it to you K, because you're giving
alot
up for this decision. But just like I told Te', Neither of you seem to
want me in your lives now, I've sensed that for quite awhile, so I'll back
away, and let you each do whatever.
> >
> > I love you very much KNow please realize that this woman left my sister and brother with a maniac father and moved to WY, with a note on the table. I was married. Sis has been on her own since 16. Brother since 17.
She is playing up the sympathy in the hall and with brother. He told her to grow up and stop being so stubborn.
Thanks for letting me share, kind brother.
momz
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Gringa
Flipper -
Don't worry about your son too much. I have endured 50 years on this planet with a mom just as or more critical, obessed and devoted to Jehovah but FAR more articulate than his mom.My mom would have stopped writing and had been at my door for marathan witnessing sessions - actually, that is what she did. He'll get through it - he is smart and he has the WTS's number.
I think at this point, I would, if I were your son, just send a nice little chatty letter thanking her for her concern but his mind is made up and hopes that they can still love each other and be close to one another even if their religous beliefs differ. Let her know that he always has and always will love her and that by following his own path in NO WAY changes hw he feels about her and plans to continue a loving relationship with her. And hopefully, she feels the same. This now puts it in her lap whether she is going to shun him or not. If he continues to preach to her about his beliefs, she will cut him off as an apostate - satan - dangerous person to be around.
Her story about the swimming was poorly written - she was using a comparision - that God is like a loving parent - there to save his children and you have to completely trust him to save you, just like a little baby (him) trusted her when in the water.
She is just brainwashed. My mom actually did call me Satan himself because I was in town one Sunday and called to invite her to go out for dinner with me and my children. The time I could come by to get her was the same time she was suppose to be at the Hall......so, don't feel too bad against this woman. They are all the same - brainwashed cult members.
Fortunantly, my mom never did shun me or turn me into the congregation. I am not sure why but I think it is because years before she went to the elders for help with my dad's smoking and they df him. It was an extremely painful time for my mother - it all back fired on her and I don't think she wanted to go through that again.
She loves him, I can tell.
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Gringa
editing to add -
Although she didn't shun me - every conversation for the last 32 years +/- has been a preaching session - so I have had little to do with her - she does not allow me to speak and it is a lecture on Jehovah, filling me with guilt, trying to scare me - etc., etc.....so needless to say, I did lose my mom - we have had very little contact over the years. I get a memorial invitation every year with a follow up phone call to see if I received it and to confirm my attendance.....LOL
Sounds like your son knows what he may be in for and certainly is prepared for the consequences - be sure you are not too bitter against her and do encourage him to try and have a relationship with her - afterall, she is his mother.
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flipper
MOMZCRAZY- Hey sis, great post on your mothers dealings with you and your sister ! Wow ! It never ceases to amaze me with some of these witnesses how they can expect so much of others, yet fail to see the error of their own personal ways, as indicated as you said by the leaving of the letter on the table and abandoning kids, etc. Quick to accuse you and your sister of a non-spiritual lifestyle but she has been an angel. Yes, I totally understand what you have been through Momz. My ex is like that in claiming to be the most spirit directed witness since Jesus Christ himself , but she has intruded on many other peoples lives in the organization and been a busybody to others too. Thanks for sharing that, and I hope you and your sister can enjoy true peace of mind and heart now, ( without cult momma's influence ). Peace !
GRINGA- Thanks for sharing your mom's experience with you. It sounds like you too, have had to make a stand to let your mom know you have your own life to live ! Sounds like you have done a good job of that. You did have an aggressive mom, much like my ex, but as you say very bright though. My son is going to write to his mom and tell her he loves her but there will be boundaries as to what they can or can't talk about as far as religion . I agree with him. It is too upsetting to have to deal with someone not acknowledging his loving letters, and then be put down for his thoughts, and made to feel he should be forced to accept her thoughts. He realizes his mom is " cult controlled " and understands. But it still hurts him to see her choose to remain blind. So, he said when he talks on the phone , it will just be about simple, non-confrontational things. Hopefully she will respect that. Thanks, Peace out, Mr. Flipper