Spirituality

by Aleman 79 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  fifi40

  Aleman..............I am always amazed at people who profess spirituality or a christian belief and then talk or act in a manner which does not seem christian like at all.

  Gopher does not share your view.......so you turn that into I hope you dont find yourself in some extremely horrible situation and know you are going to die..........death is inevitable for us all regardless of faith, religion or spirituality.............the only difference you have being a JW is that you have an alternative hope for something in the future..........a hope that is not proven......a hope that at this point in history has not benn realised by another human being.......and a hope that if you truly examined it you would realise has been given to you by an organisation that is deceitful, manipulative and false..........but you are probably so scared of loosing that hope that you are not honest enough to do a thorough and true search of the organisation you follow.......remember that many of us have shared that very same hope at some point and found its origin to be wanting.

  I wish you well in life and hope that neither you or anyone who uses this board has to face extreme circumstance of horror and stress.
• 

  Gopher

  Muslims and even the American Indians believe in a higher spirit being, but the buddists and hinduists, believe in a higher state of oneself called nirvana. Both are spiritual needs for each of the beliefs. These people know that this life is confusing and hard enough to walk it by themselves.

  Hindus don't believe in Nirvana, I work with some of them.

  Anyhow, what you alluded to are "beliefs", and some find it comforting to believe in the unknown. If people want to seek comfort in such a manner and call it "spirituality", it's fine for them. My spirituality is based on what I first posted in this thread: life, love, sharing and caring. These are known factors that I can fully engage with. The rest is mysticism to me. I also know life is confusing and hard, and don't believe in being a loner. I'm a social individual, and I try to contribute to the better state of the people when I can.

  With death always around the corner and natural desasters that plauge the world, not to mention uncureable and painfull diseses, and hunger, and homeless people, do you really feel in control of your life to say you can "accept the consequences or rewards for any actions you take or decisions you make"?

  I don't know how believing in the unseen will help me get more control. And I'm well aware that life is temporary for us all. I don't believe death is "always" around the corner for you or me. It could be soon, or we could live 50 more years. To me spirituality is more about life (while you have it) than it is about death.

  Then to this I say to you my friend, good luck on your lonesome strugle of life. I hope you don't find yourself in a 'Columbine' situation, or in another 'twin towers' place where either you are in the plane or on the top floor of either buildings. I'm sure you will find what you are looking for in the end of the tunnel- Death.

  You're appealing to a sense of fear here. "Columbine / Twin Towers" are really rare situations that only directly affected a small minority of mankind. Am I to run toward a fantasy unseen person or hope because a few people have terrible tragedies inflicted on them?

  I'm not looking for death. Where'd you get that idea?
• 

  Aleman

  So you think that Columbine and the twin towers are things that happen to a minority of human kind. How about the forest fires in California, or Hurracaine Katrina, or the oil spill in San Francisco, or Hillary Clinton?

  This is for Fifi40- So you think that spirituality has to be proven. It seems you have to look to believe that spirituality exists. How sad. A life without spirit is trully like a water bottle with a hole, It's only belongs in the trash. Any kind of information or knowledge you try to hold will just slip thru the hole. JWs observe the Bible and if you speak this way against the Bible, you are sinning against the Holy Spirit. But then again, you just might not believe anything coming from the Bible, so what do you care.

  -Aleman
• 

  fifi40

  Aleman

  Firstly please provide evidence of where I stated that spiritualty has to be proven...........I actually believe it is something that is individual to each person.

  Fortunately for all of us, there are many or have been many 100's of people on this planet, who did not profess to have a life with spirit or religious belief, who have added to the quality of life we now experience, who have furthered medical knowledge, scientific knowledge and much much more.......their lives or life work could not reasonably be described as a water bottle without a hole.

  I was raised as a JW...........so their is little you can tell me about their beliefs but what I can tell you is that if you really wanted the truth you wouldnt be scared to look......Is the NWT an accurate translation.........the proof shows it is not, but you wont want to believe that because it means your whole premise is misguided. Show me in the bible where GOD, not the governing body, says you cannot celebrate birthdays or christmas.......show me in the bible where it say blood fractions are a matter of conscience.

  What I suggest to you Aleman with all respect is that you either do a very thorough check of the origins of JWs, the origins of of Jehovah God and who and how he was originally worshipped, the every changing beliefs of the JWs and how they have had to change tack time after time, the recent pay outs the organisation has made rather than go to court over sexual abuse cases or stop posting on this board which you know is going against everything your religion TELLS you to do!

  Best regards

  Fi
• 

  Aleman

  Fi,

  I understand that this forum is about spirituality which is why I thought you were thinking about proof of spirituality. I misunderstood and I am sorry.

  I was not raised a JW, instead I was raised Catholic, then after seeing the hipocracy in church I decided to look for another source of spiritual belief, so I joined the methodists and found more hipocracy. I then tryed and examined budism, muslim, and jewish faiths. Then after being unsatisfied with all of these, a JW visited and studied with me. I have done alot of research and found that the JWs have fewer court cases of sexual abuse, or any other type of misconduct.

  Truth be said, man is prune to make mistakes due to sin, but in the big picture of how the rest really are, there is no comparison to the rest of the other religions. I haven't met an ex-JW who went to the Catholics, Muslims, Methodists, or any other sect or religion.

  I see that you wish to celibrate Christmas, I guess you know that Jesus wasn't born on December (heck the whole world knows this) instead he was born somewhere in June or July. So then if you celabrate Christmas, you are actually celabrating Saturnalia a pagan festival which the Romans commemorated the dedication of the temple of the god Saturn, which took place on December 17. Over the years, it expanded to a whole week, up to December 23.

  -Aleman
• 

  Rosalee

  Just a quick side point ... Aleman ...

  Jesus was 33 1/2 years old when he died ... which was late March .. early April.

  This would mean he was likely born in October.

  Early Christians did incorporate sun worship with the celebration of Jesus birth though to attract the masses.
• 

  fifi40

  Aleman

  You will have noticed I am sure that this forum is about anything and everything and is not limited to discussions on spirituality.........the common link is the users of this board, who in the main have been in some way associated with the JWs and no longer are or are JWs experiencing doubts.............some have adopted new religions, faiths or spiritual awareness and some do not believe in God at all................whatever there inclination they are a fairly friendly bunch and have a wealth of knowledge and information between them.

  It is good that you have examined many religions......you will find many of varying beliefs on here and those who have knowledge of many religions................the reason that you will not have found many court cases of sexual abuse in the JWs is that historically cases such as these have been presented to elders they have discouraged such cases from being taken any further, have protected many abusers with the 2 witness rule and recently have paid out of court millions of dollars to prevent 16 cases (I believe that is the number) being taken to court. There are many people who use this board who have personal experience of this situation.

  Yes I know Jesus was not born on December 25th and as another posted stated it is commonly thought he was born around October........still it was never stated in the bible not to celebrate Jesus birthday or in fact anyone's birthday.......as far as the pagan aspect goes.......there is some evidence that Jehovah was originally a Storm God worshipped by pagans.......wedding rings have pagan origins and a whole host of other things have pagan origins.

  What I am asking you to do is to check into the JW organisation, there are many threads here that cover the discrepancies of the teachings and beliefs of the JWs and much much more that if you examined with a honest heart would possibly require that you would have to question the reliability of your religion. If you ask an elder he will tell you that some stuff we dont know, wait on Jehovah and do not look at literature or forums such as this, that question what you are being taught. The Truth should stand up to any amount of questioning.

  Regards and all the best in your journey

  Fi
• 

  Aleman

  "The truth should stand up to any amount of questioning."

  This is true, because during my study, I have found that the living God Jehovah answers all my questions in the Bible. Not the WT or the Elders, although they sure study alot to inform everyone what the Bible states.

  I have been to many of these selfish and weeping contraversy sites about the JWs and the BG and the WT. But all they want is to sell you something or be sorry for their selfish and worldly sins. I even went to one that was trying to start up a new religion as he describes how lazy you can get while you give him money.

  All of these sites are a bunch of cry babies just trying to make an easy buck. As far as Jehovah being the god of storm... I think you have him confused with Zeus. By the way, have you read the book of En'och? this is a very enlightning book. The fact that it is writen in the Bible on the book of Jude verse 14 and 15 got me interested. Mabye all the gods like Zeus, Athena, Ra, Osiris, Odin, Thor, and all the others where actually fallen angels in human bodies. Who knows, mabey they all were here before the great flood?

  -Aleman
• 

  Open mind

  And just to lighten things up a bit.......

  Aleman:

  man is prune to make mistakes

  Couldn't resist.

  Just messin' Aleman. Keep readin and postin.

  Open Mind
• 

  fifi40

  Aleman

  Please read this encyclopedia article especially the bottom half

  http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Jehovah

  regarding the origins of the name and the God.

  or here again about half way down and easier reading

  http://www.karenlyster.com/genesis.html

  regards and happy searching

  Fi