WTS hasn't corrected mistakes in NWT on John 20:28.....

by A-Team 212 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Wayne L

  Beginning in 1964, JWs in Malawi began to experience persecution and violence on a scale unequaled in modern times . . . . In the first attack, 1,081 Malawi families saw their little homes burned or otherwise demolished, 588 fields of crops destroyed. In the 1967 attacks, Witnesses reported the rapings of more than one thousand of their women, one mother being sexually violated by six different men, her thirteen-year-old daughter by three men . . . . In each wave of violence, beatings, torture and even murder went virtually unchecked by the authorities . . . (Franz

  Frank - You are right. On rereading, you didn't say millions died. But why would you say I wouldn't care if it happened?

  The above is an extract about Malawi. It mentions houses burned, 2 rapes, beatings, torture, and at the end, murder. Don't you think murder would be first on this list if it had been the 1000s you mentioned in a July 8 post? You aren't by any chance fond of slight exaggeration are you? Besides, these atrocities happened because of their (the member's) beliefs. It was perpetrated by evil people.

  And why did you not catch my error when I stated all 237 Jehovah's in NT are OT quotes? We were both asleep on that one. It doesn't change my point, though.

  But you, a 50 year JW, and me never having set foot in a Kingdom Hall.

  Sorry about my poor formatting of posts, but I'm new to computers (3 months) and still figuring things out
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  fjtoth

  Wayne L,

  Frank - You are right. On rereading, you didn't say millions died. But why would you say I wouldn't care if it happened?

  I think I explained this to you already. Murder is murder, whether one is slain or a million are slain. You show no shock or even disapproval over the fact that Watchtower teachings have led to the deaths of their members. Jehovah's Witnesses have not died due to the teachings of the Bible, but due to the teachings of imperfect men who claim to speak for God. Those men are no closer to God than the average sincere church-goer, if they are even that close to him. Yet, they sit upon a judgment seat in New York City and declare what other humans like themselves may do or not do. God will require an accounting from such men. Instead of allowing JWs to be guided by a conscience trained in the Bible, those men dictate to JWs, for example, that they must not purchase a political party card. There is no command in the Bible that forbids such a purchase, and yet JWs obediently refused to buy one and brought untold misery if not also death upon themselves and members of their families. They did that, not because that was the will of God as explained in the Bible, but because it was the policy of a bunch of men living in a distant country and making decisions from behind large desks in luxurious offices.

  This is why I view you as someone who has little or no compassion toward the suffering of innocent people.

  Frank
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  fjtoth

  Wayne L,

  Don't you think murder would be first on this list if it had been the 1000s you mentioned in a July 8 post? You aren't by any chance fond of slight exaggeration are you?

  You amaze me with your lack of logic, Wayne. Who cares whether the murders were listed first or last? Murder is murder! Don't you understand that? If Watchtower false teachings are responsible for the deaths of innocent people -- teachings based not upon the Bible but upon the whim and fancy of dictators in New York City -- how can you approve of such teachings??? How can you in good faith sit there and condemn those of us who expose such wrongdoing and not condemn the murderers who are running the Watchtower Society? It is tragic that anyone can think as you do!

  Frank
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  fjtoth

  Wayne L,

  Besides, these atrocities happened because of their (the member's) beliefs. It was perpetrated by evil people.

  Again you amaze me. There would very likely have been no murders if JWs in Malawi had been law-abiding citizens. They rebelled against the established order by refusing to comply with a simple duty that amounted to the payment of taxes. They rebelled, not because that is what God wanted them to do since the Bible commands Christians to give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar. They rebelled because they were instructed to rebel by men in a distant land who would not be sharing in their sufferings. The leaders of the Watchtower Society live comfortably and have no qualms about causing suffering among their people in less fortunate circumstances.

  So who were the "evil people," Wayne? Yes, the uneducated people who did the pillaging, raping and murdering are guilty. But who started the whole evil mess? Was it those who became incensed that JWs thought themselves above the law? Are they the most guilty? What about those in New York City who sat in comfortable offices and instructed JWs to do what would naturally rile up their neighbors? Be honest, Wayne. Who was more to blame? Those men in New York City should have certainly known better. They claimed to know the will of God and to be his spokesman, yet they failed to anticipate what their foolish decision would lead to. How can you excuse them?

  Frank
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  fjtoth

  Wayne L,

  And why did you not catch my error when I stated all 237 Jehovah's in NT are OT quotes? We were both asleep on that one. It doesn't change my point, though. But you, a 50 year JW, and me never having set foot in a Kingdom Hall.

  Actually, I went back to the very beginning of all your posts so that I could list all the errors you've made. But, honestly, Wayne, you've made so many errors that it would take me most of the night just to copy and paste them.

  Interestingly, you again play the blame game. Even though you made the mistake, you want me to conclude that I'm still in the wrong since I didn't point it out to you! You're a strange fellow, Wayne! You really are.

  Frank
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  poppers

  It is amusing in a way to watch this thread unfold, and in another way it tells a lot about why the world is the way it is. It might have some relevance if there were some PROOF that the bible was actually "god's" word and NOT just a collection of ideas about god created by man to give answers to questions that man is faced with. Just look how IDEAS have created dissension and separation from one another on this thread alone. Is it any wonder that there is so much violence in the world? It seems to me, in context of this thread, that what must come first is proof that the bible is actually what it purports to be. There seems to be an assumption that the bible is what it says it is, but just because it claims itself to be god's word doesn't make it so. Prove it first and then return to the crux of the thread if necessary.
  
  As long as we have opposing camps of different BELEIFS based solely on THOUGHTS which largely define one's sense of identity we will continue down this destructive path. Why not find that which is common to each of us? No book, no religion, no philosophy, no idea, no belief is needed for that. There is your hope for peace within yourself and in the world.
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  Wayne L

  Frank. Thanks for not being able to substantiate your outrageous accusations against my friends. I knew you couldn't.

  Poppers - you seem to be a thinker. Of course no one can prove God or the Bible. We won't know until that fateful day, assuming there is an afterlife. Since no one has come back to tell us, we must find out for ourselves.

  My only purpose on this site is to make hatemongers, with no other purpose, go away. I feel that will make the world a better place.

  What do you think? Thanks, Wayne
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  Wayne L

  Who cares whether the murders were listed first or last? Murder is murder! Don't you understand that? If Watchtower

  What I care about is that you said 1000s, and if you know anything about journalism, you know that 1000s would be first and foremost in any list. It would be proclaimed everywhere, in all major newspapers, especially if JWs were involved!. Major papers have reporters in the most obscure places.
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  Wayne L

  "Murder is murder, whether one is slain or a million are slain" You are right. That innocent JWs were murdered by people in Malawi is terrible. JWs don't murder!
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  poppers

  From Wayne: "My only purpose on this site is to make hatemongers, with no other purpose, go away. I feel that will make the world a better place.
  
  What do you think? "
  
  I think it's an admirable goal. My question, however, is this: Is this an effective way to do that, by pointing out differences which only serve to further entrench personal viewpoints that lead to defensive and even violent responses? Wouldn't a more effective approach be to point out that which serves to enliven the experience of what we have in common? There is something more fundamental to our nature than that which our minds identify with and then defend for the purpose of maintaining a sense of separation from one another. There is wholeness inherent in our real nature than no one can force another to see, only point out in the hope that that can be seen by them.
  
  A lesson which seems to elude people is that you can't "make hatemongers" go away, you can't "make" anyone do anything - that is an exercise in futility. They may scatter with the wind for a while but they will take their hate with them - is that doing any real good? At most you can only point to how hate is created in such a way that others can see for themselves why they act the way they do and then hopefully do something about it. When you discover this for yourself you see the dynamic in others and can point to a way out of hate from a position of personal insight based on the experience of wholeness that transcends mental positions that have only served the sense of separation, the source of hate.