Auld Soul... I, too, am so sorry for this pain. You have gotten incredible perspectives and encouragement and advice from the others, and I would really only be repeating what has already been said.
I just wanted to wish you Strength... (Wisdom and Smarts you've got already... oh, heck, you've got Strength too but you might need a shot more in the arm about now!)
Hugs to you
Baba.
What if she never leaves JWs? (The interminable waiting period...)
by AuldSoul 87 Replies latest jw friends
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BabaYaga
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jwfacts
I can appreciate how difficult it is. When I stayed home alone and watched my wife go to meetings for her indoctrination it was gut wrenching. When she stuck up for my parents and other JWs shunning of me it caused great anger. Luckily my wife was never very active and it was easy for her to slip away and stop going to meetings over time.
I can only hope that your wife can leave. Unfortunately experience shows it is unlikely to be her husband that is able to convince her it is a cult. It will take other external factors to wake her up. Maybe you could research some of Steven Hassans material and see if you can find ways for her to come across information that could get her thinking.
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Borgia
I was digesting some of the comments here and on some other threads about the reason pleople start doubting or leaving the Borg. It seems like there are two main strands: recognition that the whole thing is crap and lack of love. Say: someone stays in because not the crap is more important but the social structure, the friends, the net so to speak. Only when a point comes where a clear and present lack of love is shown: eyes turn open, wouldn´t you say? If the cong one is in shows (perceived) real affection: how big chance is there that a lack of love will ultimately drive someone out?
Cheers
Borgia
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Sunspot
But she hopes I will go back. She refuses to give up that hope, therefore she refuses to let go of her dreams of my potential, therefore the disappointment shows no signs of letting up. Plus, my mother frequently reminds my wife how much I am missed, how sorry everyone is that I made the choices I made, how hopeful everyone is that I will choose differently before it is too late
(((((Brandon)))))
This is the nature of the Beast that is implanted in the WTS-trained mind. The idea that you once "had it" (the nonsense under the heading "zeal for Jehovah") and have "lost it".....and that you can "find it" again, lives in the recesses of the JW head. This is the ONLY hope they have for ones that leave.
My hubby walked away from the WTS on the very morning he was to be baptized, and I went through the same train of thought in hoping he would reconsider and "come back" to the WTS again. (Thankfully, now, he didn't, LOL) but the JWs make this all to clear, painfully clear, in that YOU have disappointed THEM and of course, "Jehovah" in the process. I was devastated and LONGED to have MY hubby next to me at the meetings like a dutiful JW husband......but I too, was thinking with the WTS glasses on back then. It was hard to think about him never BEING a JW and how I would cope with that. It was difficult from both angles.
BUT----You HAVE to take stock of where you stand now....AND what you will stand FOR at this point. You (we) can be as "understanding" as humanly possible as to the situation they now find themselves in.....but there comes a time when former JWs are not being treated humanely that things have to take some kind of a turn. JWs are known to be relentless in their superior-judgmental mode and feel quite "justified" in doling out whatever punishment they feel they can. When our self-esteem takes a nosedive BECAUSE of this WTS-induced treatment.....things have to be re-evaluated.
Quite often circumstances within ANY marriage change and people themselves undergo changes....it IS part of Life. IF we can live with one another's changes....so be it. When it becomes impossible to live under certain circumstances.....it is time to put things on the table, discuss them frankly and openly.... and go from there.
YOU know you will never return to the WTS and that SHE must make accommodations to that fact, but it is totally different having the WTS teachings and arrogance mixed into the fray. They MAKE NO allowances OR accommodations.....and are so cocksure THEY are "right" and everyone else is wrong. You CAN'T deal with that after a while, in most cases anyway, especially when you have an entire family situation behind the JW!
I think so much of you and I am so sorry you are in this mess.....it's a sticky one at best. Take care, dear friend.....
hugs,
Annie
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codeblue
(((Auld Soul)))
I am so sorry you are going thru this. It is very painful to not be respected by someone you love. I am going thru this with my son. (I have have a broken heart from him)
There was a time when NOdenial was on the road to leaving being a JW and was making me feel like our marriage was going to end and he would cheat on me. The WTBS does a great job reinforcing that line of thinking: when one leaves the WTBS he has left Jehovah as well and then your marriage is over. He finally stopped talking about his anti-jw statements. Even though he wouldn't go to meetings, he would listen as I rambled about things that irritated me, mainly: the obvious lack of love.
We would have weekly dates and would have fun, just the 2 of us. An obvious reminder to me, that he loved me and wouldn't leave me.
It was a very painful emotional time in our life... but as Big Tex and others recommend, patience. (patience is hard for me too) (marriage counseling is highly advised as well)
take care
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LovesDubs
Auld....god man, what an incredible outpouring of love you are getting. Im personally very touched by all you guys and this isnt even ABOUT me :) You all rock. IMHO.
These things seem to me to be true Auld: "You" are not what your wife decides you are or arent. "You" need to be secure enough in your own skin, and love yourself and your decisions enough to not need her mark of approval. Yes, you love her, but how long can you live off of that love before her disappointment in you wears on you to the point where you are agreeing with her that indeed you arent lovable. Im thinking she is looking at you as an albatross keeping her from getting her 5-star witness elder's wife standing and that perhaps she has resentment for you having wasted her time going in THIS direction when she could have been going in THAT direction and gotten what the package said she should have gotten for her money. And now, dammit its too late to return it. How much stronger and more frequent are the snide little "so now I suppose you believe in SANTA?" type comments going to become?
I have stayed with my JW husband through the WORST of times and he has not left the JWs even after my being out 10 years now. His family is in...and he will stay with his family. I have tho, ceased to care what nasty things he has lobbed in my direction trying to put me down. I didnt divorce him. And if he wants to leave me, he knows where the door is. I love him...but I do not have to be treated like a second class citizen because he and his ilk have deemed me so.
Your bride has a Consumers Report type thing in her head where her ideal "Millenium Man" has black check marks next to ALL of her qualifications right down the list to the bottom. He lacks for nothing. You...in the next column, now have BLANKS where your potential check marks were supposed to be. However the next guy she might hook up with, in his column right next to YOURS might have his check marks in different PLACES than yours were, perhaps more of them being in the SPIRITUAL QUALIFICATIONS area...but he may not treat her nearly as well as you do, or love her as much as you do...and so he will be short of her Millenium Man expectations as well...do you see where Im going with this?
Hang around for awhile. Give this some time, some space, and dont be afraid to have honest "out there" conversations with her. I guarantee you...the JWs in her life are having those conversations with her about YOU.
Hugs hugs hugs, AS
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skeeter1
It sounds like your "love tank" is starting to run lower than usual. With each "ding" she provides, it will be depleted a little more. If things do not change, you will be empty.
It may take her a few months, a few years, or never to come out of the borg. It's a timing issue, when her "heavy petal foot" drains your tank dry, you (or she) will leave. Most of all, don't have children right now. Else, you will have a huge fight over Santa.
Skeeter
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TheListener
(((((man hug))))))
You know you're one of my best friends. I can't stand to see you going through this. It's not much consolation, but remember, you are not alone. The disappointment, the dings, the disapproving looks, the smugness they exude when they just know they're right about everything - these are things I experience (apparently many here do/have).
No relationship can survive without - boundaries. It is unfair for a parent, child, spouse, workmake, stranger, etc to cross your boundaries. It's your job to set those boundaries and kindly let others know where they are. Some boundaries are taken for granted - we don't stare over or under a public bathroom stall door for example. Other boundaries are subjective and depend largely upon the individual setting the boundary. As JWs boundaries are not respected. Raised in the truth or converted make no difference. One of the things that makes high control groups work is the loss of individual boundaries.
Do some research on boundaries. Possibly even see a therapist that can assist you. Do this before talking to your wife. Perhaps the talk with your wife should be about this very subject. Since you can't study the Bible together offer talking about relationships and boundaries. There is some really good information on this subject. Let her know what is acceptable and what isn't. After your talk make sure you let her kindly know when she crosses a boundary. It takes time.
Auld, you love her. You know she loves you. That isn't always enough but it makes for a good foundation. Your relationship is worth fighting for. Boundaries aren't a magic cure all but it may help refocus the relationship lens off emotional blackmail and sarcastic quips.
PM me whenever you want. I'll try to call later today.