Matthew 25 (page 6)

Jackson

Keep the bats swinging my friend. A home run here. A few more would be nice too.

: Perhaps you could also explain Hebrews 6:10 "For God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name, IN THAT YOU HAVE MINISTERED TO THE HOLY ONES AND CONTINUE MINISTERING."

Sure, Proplog2. But first I will ask you to explain the "Good Samaritan" story and explain to all of we dummies how that fits in your argument. Is Jesus being contradictory, or is his message of helping out those in need so obvious that people like you just don't want to get it? Why in the heck are the "Holy Ones" more deserving of charity than those not deemed as "Holy Ones?" And isn't it also possible that people could become "Holy Ones" because some Christian showed them some charity and kindness when they weren't "Holy Ones"? Or do you just expect that all "Holy Ones" just become "Holy Ones" without having some epiphany? This could also include charity? People become very moved when others help them in their time of need. They often transform their lives because of such deeds. Do you deny this? Do you deny the simple assertion that Jesus was saying something so simple as "if you help out the unbelieving destitute folks, you will be blessed and maybe some of them will come to believe in Me?" Or is that notion just to simple for you?

Perhaps you are suggesting that destitute people can never become "Holy Ones(tm)" because they were too busy with the day-to-day minor issues of starving or freezing to death. Pity them.

Well, they didn't deserve to become "Holy Ones," anyway. They didn't have the time, with their attention focused on starving to death and all.

Farkel

"When in doubt, duck!"

Farkel

tj,

: I assume you didn't see the question I asked of you, so my post will serve to bring this bttt.

All to your glory and your attention on MY thread of course, and off topic as usual, DipFuck.

I challenge you to write just ONE essay of ANY substance on ANY JW related issue. Do some research, sweat some bullets polishing it, and put it up for all to see and criticize. I've never seen you do this. Why? Because you are a COWARD. All you can do it nit-pik on the hard work of others. You have NOTHING important to say, and most people here know it.

Where's YOUR essay, asshole? I'd just love to pick it apart.

By the way, I'm sorry I called you an "asshole." I was at lack for a stronger word to call you when I said that.

Farkel

"When in doubt, duck!"

proplog2

Farkel:

I asked a legitimate question. In your book of falacious rebuttals what do you call it when someone says I'll answer your question if you answer mine? I know there is an official name for this kind of evasion.

Let me see, if it is OK and proper for you to demand that I answer your question before you will answer my question then I also can ask that you answer a question before I answer the question for which you demand an answer before you will answer my question.

So here is the question that I would like you to answer before I answer the question you want me to answer before you answer my question.

What did Jesus mean when he said "The poor you will have with you always."?

Farkel

: What did Jesus mean when he said "The poor you will have with you always."?

He meant exactly this, "The poor you will have with you always."

Now, what does that have to do with Matt 25 and the topic of my thread?

1) Fuck the poor
2) Help the poor

What other possibibilites do you see in light of Matt 25?

Farkel

"When in doubt, duck!"

GentlyFeral

You Know,

When Jesus speaks of his brothers, he is not speaking of all mankind. That's ridiculous. In the 8th chapter of John Jesus said that the Jews that rejected him were from their father---the Devil.

You Know, among the groups of people Jesus lists as "the least of his brothers" are those in prison. He does not specify whether they are there for good cause or not. He simply claims them as his brothers.

Furthermore, as he was dying, he turned to the "wrongdoer" who was dying beside him, and said, "You will be with me in paradise."

Only the anointed and the angels are called sons of God in the Scriptures.

Irrelevant! Jesus does not specify brother Christians who are in jail. He does not specify brother Christians who are naked or hungry or sick. He made the hungry, naked, sick and imprisoned his brothers by definition, when he declared that any act of service to them equals service to him.

But that's too radical for you, isn't it? I don't think you have the balls or the heart to live up to this verse.

Gently Feral

proplog2

Farkel:

The principle Jesus set for helping the poor is to do it quietly with no fanfare. The degree to which each individual helps the "poor" is a private and personal matter. It is no one's business.

The Good Samaritan story was given in answer to a specific question "Who is my neighbor"? This was not a story about feeding the worlds starving masses. A neighbor is someone you are likely to encounter. If you encounter a person with genuine need and it is within your power to help that particular person then it natural to be moved by compassion.

The problem of feeding the world is obviously too big for the most powerful and influential institutions in this world. The early Christians were quite poor themselves. They had limited resources and even had to practice "triage" in dispensing funds to widows in the congregation.

JW's are not the only ones who understand Matthew 25 as referring to giving aid to the Church. Matthew 25 uses the same figures of speech as other scriptures that refer to helping the Saints in any way possible to carry out their God Given responsibilities.

If anything I would say that JW's are coming up short by not having paid overseers in the local congregation. The Chuch Visitor (overseer) should be a full-time job and they should be compensated for their efforts.

Too much is made of Paul's decision to work for his sustenance. That was Pauls decision and it doesn't mean that congregations shouldn't have people it supports finanically to do good on their behalf.

Farkel

: The principle Jesus set for helping the poor is to do it quietly with no fanfare. The degree to which each individual helps the "poor" is a private and personal matter. It is no one's business.

So, what's your point? I never said said that charity should be accompanied with a big Brass Band. Neither did Jesus. So what is your argument?

Furthermore, what does anything you've said have to do with Matt 25 and my argument? I never talked about fanfare, and neither did Jesus.

Farkel

"When in doubt, duck!"

proplog2

Farkel:

You are trying to portray JW's as disinterested in the plight of their fellow humans.

You are trying to show that Matt 25 applies to the poor in general and not to helping Christs disciple/brothers. You are entirely in error on this.

I am saying that since helping the poor is a private personal thing you don't know what they do or don't do.

You don't want to admit that the Bible speaks about a group referred to as "holy ones".

All those who think that your explanation of Matt 25 is the correct one are simply misled. This is typical of what happens on these boards. People here are only interested in hearing what they want to hear. If it sounds good the hell with logic and accuracy. Not too much different than what you did as a JW.

I personally feel that those of you who present your old credentials of position in the organization are a bunch of ass-lickers. That's how you moved into positions of responsibility. I love to see the big dogs fall. I feel bad for the common ordinary members who have been kicked around by you former great ones.

Farkel, some of your stuff is good and some is bad. This is bad. You know better. You've run down a blind alley on this one and pride is keeping you from getting back.

These boards are as bad as the Watchtower. They feel some sort of need to publish 128 pages of stuff each month. Many here feel they need to do some kind of quantity of words. The result is a drop in quality.

You can all go back to believing that there is absolutely no connection between Matt 10:42 and Matt 25. You can continue to believe that Jesus felt humanitarian efforts alone will solve the worlds problems. You can go on believing that the "holy ones" are some sort of ambiguous loosely connected good hearted people in all religions. You can keep believing that Jesus' main interest was feeding people material food. And then you can be an Oprah Winfrey Feel Good American thinking you're on some enlightened path. The fat-bellied babies are still starving in spite of Ted Turner and Bill Gates huge contributions.

A while back you were having some kind of existential crisis associated with your father. My mother died when I was 7. My father died and left his money to his wife. We all suffer. You want to know why you write and participate here? You want strokes like all of us. That's why you get caught up in such petty arguments.

Yeah! I definitely have been up too long. Thought I would erase this stuff but it felt kinda good so I guess I'll push the Reply button. Hey Farkel, I know how you feel sometimes.

Englishman

Teejay: I don't expect you to answer my response TO YOU because, well... between me and you, we both know who the real coward is here, don't we? Chump.

Whats that supposed to mean? Who are you calling a coward, and yes this is in response to your email.

I can't communicate any more until Monday as I'm taking a weekend break.

Englishman.

..... fanaticism masquerading beneath a cloak of reasoned logic.

Matthew 25

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